Lamont of that Ilk

Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper

Svar
Kelsey J. Williams

Lamont of that Ilk

Legg inn av Kelsey J. Williams » 29 sep 2004 03:02:36

Hello,

Can anyone comment on the accuracy of the genealogy listed below? The
Eoin who heads the Clan Ladhmainn pedigree is Sir John Lamont of that
Ilk whose daughter Mary/Isabella married Sir Archibald Campbell of
Lochowe from whom many participants of s.g.m. descend.

O'Clery's Book of Genealogies (R.I.A. MS. 23 D 17):

Genealch Meic Ladhmainn

§306. Eoin m Donnchadha m Gille epscuip m Roibeird m Donn-
chadha m Eoin m Giolla colaim m Ladhmainn m Gilla colaim m
Ferchair m Duinnslebhe. Sunn condregait et clann t-Suibhne.

Genelach Meic Suibhne Fhanad

§336. Domnall gorm, Maol muire dubh, et Toirrdealbach: clann
Domnaill m Toirrdelbaigh m Ruaidhri m Maoil muire m Toirrdelbaigh
ruaidh m Toirrdelbaigh chaoich m Maoil muire m Murchada oig m
Murchada mir m Maoil muire m Murchada m Maoil muire an sparain
m Suibne (o tat clann t-Suibne) m Duinn slebhe m Aeda alainn (.i.
an Buirrce) m Anrothain m Aedha athlamhain m Flaithbertaigh
an trosdain m Muircertaigh midhigh m Domnaill ard macha m
Muircertaigh na ccochall ccroicend m Neill ghlunduibh m Aodha
finnleith.

Sincerely,
Kelsey J. Williams

siabair ~^~

Re: Lamont of that Ilk

Legg inn av siabair ~^~ » 29 sep 2004 19:21:20

Kelsey J. Williams wrote:
Giolla colaim m Ladhmainn m Gilla colaim m Ferchair m Duinnslebhe m Aeda
alainn (.i. an Buirrce) m Anrothain m Aedha athlamhain m Flaithbertaigh
an trosdain

This portion is authenticated in 'Family Origins in Cowal and Knapdale' by
W D H Sellar, Scottish Studies, volume 15 (1971), part one, pages 21-37.

--
SIABAIR (Old Irish) /shabba/ 'ghost', 'phantom', 'spectre'

siabair ~^~

Re: Lamont of that Ilk

Legg inn av siabair ~^~ » 29 sep 2004 19:55:06

Kelsey J. Williams wrote:
Can anyone comment on the accuracy of the genealogy listed below? The
Eoin who heads the Clan Ladhmainn pedigree is Sir John Lamont of that
Ilk whose daughter Mary/Isabella married Sir Archibald Campbell of
Lochowe...

(cancelled and resent with correct date 1292)

Are you sure about that? The Eoin that heads the genealogy would have been
alive in the late fifteenth/early sixteenth century by dead reckoning from
Ladhmann floruit 1240-1292 as per the W D H Sellar article.

--
SIABAIR (Old Irish) /shabba/ 'ghost', 'phantom', 'spectre'

siabair ~^~

Re: Lamont of that Ilk

Legg inn av siabair ~^~ » 29 sep 2004 21:00:09

Kelsey J. Williams wrote:
Eoin m Donnchadha m Gille epscuip m Roibeird m Donn-
chadha m Eoin m Giolla colaim m Ladhmainn m Gilla colaim m
Ferchair m Duinnslebhe. Sunn condregait et clann t-Suibhne.

I have had a quick google on various Lamonts and this seems to give two
UK/US gateways back to the Uí Néill.

Ladhmann, 1292 Paisley charter.
|
Giolla Colum
|
Eoin, John father of Isabella.
|
Donnchad
|
Roibeard, Robert of Inveryne dispensation 1396 (or 1397?).
|
Giolla Epscop
|
Donnchad
|
Eoin, John of Inveryne dispensation 1466.

But http://www.myclan.com/clans/Lamont_62/ (though a little broken) implies
that there was another John around in 1466 who was not 'of Inveryne' and
that the chiefship passed to the Inneryne branch only in the late fifteenth
century, which would either upset the above arrangement or imply that it
reflects the conflation of two collateral lines into one.

So more work needed at the Scottish end I think.

--
SIABAIR (Old Irish) /shabba/ 'ghost', 'phantom', 'spectre'

Kelsey J. Williams

Re: Lamont of that Ilk

Legg inn av Kelsey J. Williams » 30 sep 2004 00:01:11

"siabair ~^~" <siabair@h=tmail.c=m> wrote in message news:<cjf0o4$3vf$1@news5.svr.pol.co.uk>...
Kelsey J. Williams wrote:
Eoin m Donnchadha m Gille epscuip m Roibeird m Donn-
chadha m Eoin m Giolla colaim m Ladhmainn m Gilla colaim m
Ferchair m Duinnslebhe. Sunn condregait et clann t-Suibhne.

I have had a quick google on various Lamonts and this seems to give two
UK/US gateways back to the Uí Néill.

Ladhmann, 1292 Paisley charter.
|
Giolla Colum
|
Eoin, John father of Isabella.
|
Donnchad
|
Roibeard, Robert of Inveryne dispensation 1396 (or 1397?).
|
Giolla Epscop
|
Donnchad
|
Eoin, John of Inveryne dispensation 1466.

But http://www.myclan.com/clans/Lamont_62/ (though a little broken) implies
that there was another John around in 1466 who was not 'of Inveryne' and
that the chiefship passed to the Inneryne branch only in the late fifteenth
century, which would either upset the above arrangement or imply that it
reflects the conflation of two collateral lines into one.

So more work needed at the Scottish end I think.


Hello,

You are probably correct about the placing of Sir John. I hadn't
investigated the chronology of the pedigree but certainly the earlier
Eoin is a more sensible candidate. I have ordered the Sellar article
and will endeavour to locate some more documentation on Ladhmann, his
son and his grandson.

Sincerely,
Kelsey J. Williams

Svar

Gå tilbake til «soc.genealogy.medieval»