C.P. Correction/Addition: Children of Sir John Neville (died

[Douglas Richardson]

Dear Newsgroup ~

The authoritative Complete Peerage, 12 Part 2 (1959): 548-549 (sub
Westmorland) includes a good account of the life of Sir John Neville
(died 1420), of Sutton (in Galtres), Yorkshire, eldest son and heir
apparent of Ralph Neville, K.G., 1st Earl of Westmorland, by his 1st
wife, Margaret Stafford. Regarding his marriage, Complete Peerage
states that Sir John Neville married Elizabeth Holand, daughter of
Thomas Holand, 5th Earl of Kent. Their issue is not given, but on
page 549, footnote h, it is stated that their son and heir, Ralph
Neville, 2nd Earl of Westmorland, had "an only brother, John, Lord
Neville ... who was slain fighting for the Lancastrians at Towton, 29
March 1461." Thus, if this information is to be trusted, Sir John
Neville and his wife, Elizabeth Holand, had only two sons, Ralph [2nd
Earl] and John. No mention is made if there were any daughters.

Actually, contemporary evidence shows that Sir John Neville and his
wife, Elizabeth, had four children in all, including three sons,
Ralph, John, and Thomas, and one daughter, Margaret. The evidence for
the younger children is found in Proceedings and Ordinances of the
Privy Council of England, edited by Sir Harris Nicolas, 3 (1834): 20.
On that page, there is a contemporary record dated 17 January 1423,
which concerns the estate of Elizabeth, widow of Sir John Neville.
This record specifically states that Lady Neville had three younger
children, John, Thomas, and Margaret, all then living.

The item in question on page 20 may be found at the following weblink:

http://books.google.com/books?id=NvYKAA ... A1-PA20,M1

Although the item is in Latin, an abbreviated abstract in English can
be found on page v:

http://books.google.com/books?id=NvYKAA ... RA1-PR5,M1

It reads as follows:

"17th January, 1 Henry VI. 1423. The feoffees of the deceased Lady
Neville of certain manors in the Counties of York, Nottingham, and
Surrey, having been examined, acknowledged that they were enfeoffed
thereof, for the purpose of paying the debts of the said Lady, forty
marks to her son John, £20 to her son Thomas, and to her daughter
Margaret according to their discretion, and of making a re-enfeoffment
of the same to her son and heir." END OF QUOTE.

It is puzzling indeed why the third son, Sir Thomas Neville, should
have been overlooked by Complete Peerage, as I find him mentioned in
other records of this family which are easily accesible [see, for
example, Harvey et al. Vis. of the North, 3 (Surtees Society 144)
(1930): 23-32 (Neville pedigree)]. Sir Thomas Neville allegedly
resided at Slingsby, Yorkshire. He married Elizabeth Beaumont,
daughter of Henry Beaumont, K.B., 5th Lord Beaumont, by which marriage
he had two legitimate sons, Sir Humphrey and Charles. By an unknown
mistress, Sir Thomas also had a bastard son, Sir George Neville, of
London, whose wife was Mary Fitz Lewis, Countess Rivers. Sir Thomas
Neville has modern descendants. Also, there is a biography of Sir
Thomas Neville's son, Sir Humphrey Neville, in the standard reference
work, Oxford Dictionary of Modern Biography (ODNB).

As for the "new" daughter, Margaret Neville, I find no mention of her
in any account of the Neville family that I've consulted. As such, I
assume she died in young adulthood, presumably unmarried.

For interest's sake, I've listed below the names of the 17th Century
New World immigrants that descend from Sir John Neville and his wife,
Elizabeth Holand:

Philip & Thomas Nelson

Comments are welcome, indeed invited. Please cite your sources and
provide weblinks if you have them. Thanks!

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah