New ? Royal Gateway ancestor was Fw: Details of Sir Andrew R

[Leo van de Pas]

Will Johnson mentioned here John Gayer and his wife Katherine Hopkins I
thought I might have them in my system, but so far I don't think so. While
looking for them I found William Gayer, born in Plymouth and died in
Nantuckett, Massachusetts. His daughter was born in 1675 in
Nantuckett...........and so he should have arrived in the USA some years
before? Is there any reason why Gary Boyd Roberts does not mention him? Nor
does Douglas Richardson.

My source is Count d'Angerville's Living descendants of Blood Royal in
America, volumne three, page 754, where is recorded as source : "History of
Nantuckett, Masss, by Alexander Starbuck, pp 802-805, 807, 743, 826, 828,
746, 751-752.

What is regarded the cut-off date for arrivals in America, when those after
that date are "merely" migrants? I thought 1700, and then William Gayer
should qualify as a Gateway Ancestor _with_ Royal ancestors.

He descends from King Edward I, Alfonso IX, king of Leon, Alfonso VII of
Castile and so on.

Count d'Angerville gives him a skinny line to the present, but I am sure
there are more than those displayed by him.

With best wishes
Leo van de Pas,
Canberra, Australia


----- Original Message -----
From: "wjhonson" <[email protected]>
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2007 10:17 AM
Subject: Details of Sir Andrew Riccard

Here on Leo's great website
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.ph ... 4&tree=LEO

we see that Sir Andrew Riccard who was not only Governor of the East
India Company and the Levant Company but also the Turkey Company i.e.
he was a quite successful merchant

Knighted in 1662, he was also an Alderman of London

He is perhaps better known genealogically as the father of that
Christiana (Christian) Riccard who was his only child, baptised 19 Mar
1638/9 at St Olave's, London who m thrice.

Firstly Christian married John Gayer of Stoke Pogis son of the Lord
Mayor and Sheriff John Gayer by his wife Katherine Hopkins. This
first husband John Gayer d.s.p. in 1657

Christian allowed no moss to grow on her, marrying secondly, and up to
Henry Rich, Lord Kensington on 14 Feb 1659 at Kensington. He was the
son of Robert Rich, 5th Earl of Warwick and 2nd Earl of Holland
(buried 16 Apr 1675 at Kensington).

Her second husband only lasted a brief time, dying on 15 Apr 1659,
whereupon Christian married by 1661 to John Berkeley of Bruton, 1st
Baron Berkeley of Stratton (from 1658) who was 30 years her senior.

This fact apparently did not serve as any obstacle to her having at
least or exactly three sons by her last husband.

Towit Charles, John and William, each in their turn Lord Berkeley of
Stratton, the elder two d.s.p. obviously.

Leo has no date details for the life of Sir Andrew Riccard, but he has
or had a Monument at St Olave's erected apparently by the members of
the Turkey Company, showing that he died 6 Sep 1672 "aged 68"

This family is also in the Ancestry of Lord Byron

Should anyone have details purporting to show Andrew Riccard's
parents, siblings, wifes, etc, that would be appreciated.

Will Johnson

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[wjhonson]

A few things worth looking at, on the Gayer family that Leo
mentioned. Note esp the last article.
Will Johnson

<a href = "http://books.google.com/books?
vid=0J95NoFWH44S2jhibe&id=ieIypI-z2ioC&pg=PA297&lpg=PA297&dq=gayer
+harper">An article</a> on William Gayer in 1877
-----------------------------------------
"Even so, although William Gayer of Nantucket and Governor Sir John
Gayer of Bombay really were brothers, they were not the sons and
grandsons of prominent Plymouth merchants or scions of Cornish gentry
in St. Keverne, or descendants of the noble Courtenays or remote
offspring of King Edward I. Instead, more probably they were the sons
and grandsons of the two William Gayers who are mentioned in the
Plymouth town records (*) as stone masons, one in the early 1600s and
the other in the 1640s, whose antecedents are quite unknown but which
presumably were quite humble."

(*) R.N. Worthy, Calendar of the Plymouth Municipal Records (Plymouth,
1893), 163. Edwin Wlech, ed., Plymouth Building Accounts of the
Sixteenth and Seventeenth Centuries (Torquay, 1967), 20, 29, 34-35,
41, 44, 49-50, 54-58, 64, 79, 93, 98.
---------------------------------
http://books.google.com/books?id=s0F3O9 ... A#PPA14,M1
Pennsylvania Genealogical Magazine (vol 28, no 1) (1973), "The Case of
the Vanishing Ancestry", by Wallace Evan Davis, pg 14-

[[email protected]]

On Dec 17, 7:07 pm, "Leo van de Pas" <[email protected]> wrote:

Is there any reason why Gary Boyd Roberts does not mention him? Nor
does Douglas Richardson.

The Gayer "royal descent" has been disproved. An identification of
William Gayer's brother Sir John Gayer with a visitation pedigree John
Gayer was not correct; thus Roberts and RIchardson do not list the
line. John Brandon posted on this last month.

[John Brandon]

line. John Brandon posted on this last month.

This is true. See http://tinyurl.com/34m8go .

I suppose my major point there was that Gary Boyd Roberts got too far
caught up in the author's "debunking spirit" when he claimed
(someplace) in print that the parentage of Sir John and William Gayer
"is currently unknown." Of course, we actually have a surviving
letter from their mother Joan or Jane Gayer in Plymouth, England ...

http://books.google.com/books?id=AWwFAA ... #PPA299,M1

I've always wondered about Jane Gayer's line: "[M]y kind Respects to
Coson Jane Bray and her famaly ..." This implies to me that cousin
Jane Bray was also in New England. Looking in the _Genealogical
Dictionary of Maine and New Hampshire_, I find a John Bray, known to
be from Plymouth in England, who died ca. 1690, and who had a wife
Joan, whose estate was administered 1693 or 1694 (of course, this was
slightly before the date of Jane Gayer's letter, but she might not
have been aware of Joan/ Jane Bray's death). Could this wife of John
Bray of Kittery be the Gayers' "Coson Jane Bray"?

John and Joan Bray's daughter Margery married William Pepperell and
was mother of Sir William Pepperell of Louisburg.

William Gayer of Nantucket was an ancestor of British Admiral Sir
Isaac Coffin (? grandfather or great-grandfather).

If the wife of John Bray was "Coson Jane Bray," then there would have
been some sort of relationship between Sir William Pepperell and
Admiral Sir Isaac Coffin.

[John Brandon]

William Gayer of Nantucket was an ancestor of British Admiral Sir
Isaac Coffin (? grandfather or great-grandfather).

http://books.google.com/books?id=k0UJAA ... r#PPA17,M1