Parentage of Mary (Gardiner) Dowse (attn. Martin Hollick)
Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper
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John Brandon
Re: Parentage of Mary (Gardiner) Dowse (attn. Martin Hollick
Saint Mary Somerset, London
--Christopher Gardener to Jone Tape, 19 June 1595
--Christopher Gardener to Jone Tape, 19 June 1595
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mhollick@mac.com
Re: Parentage of Mary (Gardiner) Dowse (attn. Martin Hollick
On Oct 8, 6:43 pm, John Brandon <starbuc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Many thanks for remembering me and for this great information.
Saint Mary Somerset, London
--Christopher Gardener to Jone Tape, 19 June 1595
Many thanks for remembering me and for this great information.
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mhollick@mac.com
Re: Parentage of Mary (Gardiner) Dowse (attn. Martin Hollick
On Oct 8, 6:43 pm, John Brandon <starbuc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
I've had some time to add to your great discoveries. In addition to
the two works you linked to (Visitation of Essex and Le Neve's
Pedigrees), the Gardiner family is found in the Visitation of London
1633-5 (1880), p. 299. No Gardiners are found in the Visitation of
Buckinghamshire where they originate. The Topp(e) family of Wiltshire
appears in Wiltshire Pedigrees 1623 (1954), pp. 197-8. This genealogy
does give the daughter Jane/Jone Topp(e) as marrying Christopher
Gardiner. Sadly there are two consecutive generations where two John
Toppes are siblings. John Toppe (will pr. 15 Oct 1573, PCC 30 Peter)
m. Sybil (---) and had two Johns, one with no information and the
other who d. 13 Aug 1632 m. Mary Hooper, daughter of Edward Hooper of
Boveridge in Dorset. This last couple also had two Johns, both of
whom married and issue.
The Visitation of Dorset, 1623 (1885), pp. 55-6, has the Hooper
pedigree and shows Mary as the daughter of Edward Hooper and Dorothy
Munsell, dau. of Nicholas Mussell of Steeple Langford, Wiltshire;
Edward the son of John Hooper and Agnes Porte, dau. of John Porte.
The Wiltshire Pedigrees, p. 139, gives the Mussell pedigree and leaves
the maternity of Dorothy in question between two wives: Mary, dau. of
Dirdo in Dorset or Alice, dau. of (---) Poticarie in Wiltshire.
The Essex Visitation shows the father of Christopher Gardiner as
Thomas Gardiner and his wife Catherin d. of Denbow (poss. Benbow). In
the London Visitation she is called Katherine, dau. of Bembo of
Devonshire. No Denbow, Benbow, or Bembo appear in the Visitation of
Devonshire. The Wiltshire County Council has a searchable database
for wills across all courts for Wiltshire and I found Christopher
Gardiner, Gentleman, of Tinhead, Edington, Wiltshire in 1642 and have
written away for a copy [the database is in progess, some wills are
there others must be ordered].
A brief AT then for Mary Gardiner, wife of Thomas Dowse:
1. Mary Gardiner b.c. 1596
2. Christopher Gardiner b.c. 1570, m. 1595
3. Jane/Jone Topp(e) b.c. 1572
4. Thomas Gardiner b.c. 1545
5. Catherine Denbow/Benbow/Bembo b.c. 1550
6. John Toppe b.c. 1550, d. 13 Aug 1632
7. Mary Hooper
8. Robert Gardiner
12. John Toppe, b.c. 1525, d. Oct 1573
13. Sybil
14. Edward Hooper
15. Dorothy Mussell
24. Thomas Toppe, b.c. 1500, d. March 1559/60
25. Elizabeth
26. John Hooper
27. Agnes Porte
28. Nicholas Mussell
29. Maria Dirdo (probably, since her daughter names her eldest child
Mary and no child Alice).
Saint Mary Somerset, London
--Christopher Gardener to Jone Tape, 19 June 1595
I've had some time to add to your great discoveries. In addition to
the two works you linked to (Visitation of Essex and Le Neve's
Pedigrees), the Gardiner family is found in the Visitation of London
1633-5 (1880), p. 299. No Gardiners are found in the Visitation of
Buckinghamshire where they originate. The Topp(e) family of Wiltshire
appears in Wiltshire Pedigrees 1623 (1954), pp. 197-8. This genealogy
does give the daughter Jane/Jone Topp(e) as marrying Christopher
Gardiner. Sadly there are two consecutive generations where two John
Toppes are siblings. John Toppe (will pr. 15 Oct 1573, PCC 30 Peter)
m. Sybil (---) and had two Johns, one with no information and the
other who d. 13 Aug 1632 m. Mary Hooper, daughter of Edward Hooper of
Boveridge in Dorset. This last couple also had two Johns, both of
whom married and issue.
The Visitation of Dorset, 1623 (1885), pp. 55-6, has the Hooper
pedigree and shows Mary as the daughter of Edward Hooper and Dorothy
Munsell, dau. of Nicholas Mussell of Steeple Langford, Wiltshire;
Edward the son of John Hooper and Agnes Porte, dau. of John Porte.
The Wiltshire Pedigrees, p. 139, gives the Mussell pedigree and leaves
the maternity of Dorothy in question between two wives: Mary, dau. of
Dirdo in Dorset or Alice, dau. of (---) Poticarie in Wiltshire.
The Essex Visitation shows the father of Christopher Gardiner as
Thomas Gardiner and his wife Catherin d. of Denbow (poss. Benbow). In
the London Visitation she is called Katherine, dau. of Bembo of
Devonshire. No Denbow, Benbow, or Bembo appear in the Visitation of
Devonshire. The Wiltshire County Council has a searchable database
for wills across all courts for Wiltshire and I found Christopher
Gardiner, Gentleman, of Tinhead, Edington, Wiltshire in 1642 and have
written away for a copy [the database is in progess, some wills are
there others must be ordered].
A brief AT then for Mary Gardiner, wife of Thomas Dowse:
1. Mary Gardiner b.c. 1596
2. Christopher Gardiner b.c. 1570, m. 1595
3. Jane/Jone Topp(e) b.c. 1572
4. Thomas Gardiner b.c. 1545
5. Catherine Denbow/Benbow/Bembo b.c. 1550
6. John Toppe b.c. 1550, d. 13 Aug 1632
7. Mary Hooper
8. Robert Gardiner
12. John Toppe, b.c. 1525, d. Oct 1573
13. Sybil
14. Edward Hooper
15. Dorothy Mussell
24. Thomas Toppe, b.c. 1500, d. March 1559/60
25. Elizabeth
26. John Hooper
27. Agnes Porte
28. Nicholas Mussell
29. Maria Dirdo (probably, since her daughter names her eldest child
Mary and no child Alice).
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John Brandon
Re: Parentage of Mary (Gardiner) Dowse (attn. Martin Hollick
Very interesting, Martin. Thanks for sharing.
Are you writing an article on Samuel and Elizabeth (Dowse) Allen?
Are you writing an article on Samuel and Elizabeth (Dowse) Allen?
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mhollick@mac.com
Re: Parentage of Mary (Gardiner) Dowse (attn. Martin Hollick
On Oct 17, 5:51 pm, John Brandon <starbuc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Yes I am. It's under consideration at the NEHGR. These names are not
popping out at me as "royal" gateways. They seem to be families that
became the mercantile classes in Tudor England and made enough money
to be called gentleman and married each other, but no signs of
intermarriage with lesser gentry or nobility.
Very interesting, Martin. Thanks for sharing.
Are you writing an article on Samuel and Elizabeth (Dowse) Allen?
Yes I am. It's under consideration at the NEHGR. These names are not
popping out at me as "royal" gateways. They seem to be families that
became the mercantile classes in Tudor England and made enough money
to be called gentleman and married each other, but no signs of
intermarriage with lesser gentry or nobility.
-
John Brandon
Re: Parentage of Mary (Gardiner) Dowse (attn. Martin Hollick
Yes I am. It's under consideration at the NEHGR. These names are not
popping out at me as "royal" gateways. They seem to be families that
became the mercantile classes in Tudor England and made enough money
to be called gentleman and married each other, but no signs of
intermarriage with lesser gentry or nobility.
Still, it's considerably better than some dribs and drabs of a two-
generation peasant line ...
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mhollick@mac.com
Re: Parentage of Mary (Gardiner) Dowse (attn. Martin Hollick
On Oct 18, 10:00 am, John Brandon <starbuc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
I received the will of Christopher Gardiner today. Dated 30 Dec 1641
and probated on 6 July 1642. The will is damaged and missing at parts
1-2 inches off the right hand of the parchment. However, the copy is
clear and the hand is remarkably clear and easy to read. Christopher
Gardiner of the parish of Edington, county of Wiltshire, Gentleman
names sons Christopher, Francis, Richard, Thomas, daughter in law
Dorothy, wife of son Thomas, grandchildren including Lancelot Peacocke
(?), son in law Thomas Dowse, and a line that reads:
"and Richard Garinder and sonne in law Thomas Dowse to bee paid in six
months after the decease of Judith my [cut off]. I'm guessing it says
Judith my now wife.
Christopher Gardiner named executor. So the will essentially
corroborates the Visitation of Essex pedigree.
Yes I am. It's under consideration at the NEHGR. These names are not
popping out at me as "royal" gateways. They seem to be families that
became the mercantile classes in Tudor England and made enough money
to be called gentleman and married each other, but no signs of
intermarriage with lesser gentry or nobility.
Still, it's considerably better than some dribs and drabs of a two-
generation peasant line ...
I received the will of Christopher Gardiner today. Dated 30 Dec 1641
and probated on 6 July 1642. The will is damaged and missing at parts
1-2 inches off the right hand of the parchment. However, the copy is
clear and the hand is remarkably clear and easy to read. Christopher
Gardiner of the parish of Edington, county of Wiltshire, Gentleman
names sons Christopher, Francis, Richard, Thomas, daughter in law
Dorothy, wife of son Thomas, grandchildren including Lancelot Peacocke
(?), son in law Thomas Dowse, and a line that reads:
"and Richard Garinder and sonne in law Thomas Dowse to bee paid in six
months after the decease of Judith my [cut off]. I'm guessing it says
Judith my now wife.
Christopher Gardiner named executor. So the will essentially
corroborates the Visitation of Essex pedigree.