John Ottesen (Johan Othesen/Ottesen)

[gj10647]

Trying to find out if John Ottesen (Johan Othesen) emigrated to USA and if so when. He was born on May 9, 1815 and baptized in Domkirken in Bergen on May 28, 1815. His parents are Iver Othesen and Magrethe Othesen (Olsdatter?).

Thank you for your help.

Solveig Schavland

[Anne Lisbeth Stavland]

Same etterlysing er også her: https://slektsforum.slektogdata.no/view ... p?t=133963

[gj10647]

I though you only covered certain area, sorry about that.

Solveig

[Else Berit Rustad]

You should read the guidelines, especially # 1, here:

https://slektsforum.slektogdata.no/view ... hp?t=27366

Regards
Else B.

[gj10647]

Thank you for giving me a heads-up. Sorry for making extra work and taking up extra space. I really appreciate all of you and the help you have given me.

Solveig Schavland

[Gry Onarheim Dahlmo]

Have you found him in any US records? Naturalizations records often give information of emigration year etc

[dn33797]

Hello, I am a newbie here. Solveig asked the original question about John Ottesen on my behalf when she was helping me with my research at the Norwegian American Genealogical Center in Madison, Wisconsin.

The John Otteson I'm researching was my 3rd great grandfather. Thanks for your interest and sorry for taking so long to reply - I signed up for an account here but was having a little trouble navigating the site. To answer your question, unfortunately, I haven't been able to locate a confirmed US naturalization record for John, although I do have him in US census records for 1850 through 1880, as well as additional records (tax records, etc.) that show he lived in Wisconsin, Iowa, South Dakota, and finally Kansas, where he died in 1895. In the 1850 US census he was already married to a non-Norwegian woman and was living in Walworth County, Wisconsin, although not in one of the identified Norwegian settlements; and the 1850 census indicates his five-year-old son John was born in Ohio. His wife's family migrated from Pennsylvania to Iowa in the 1840s, around the same time she married John. They named their children John, Calvin, Julius, Josephine, and Appeline. None of the names are family names from the wife's side. In the 1850 census John Sr. was listed as a tailor, although after that he apparently turned to farming.

In 1860 the family was living in Iowa, in 1870, South Dakota; in 1880, back in Iowa; and finally John died in Kansas, where his son Julius was living.

I've always assumed John came from a rural family because that is the usual background for Norwegian immigrants, but I never found a farm name for him, and in 30 years (really!) I've never been able to figure out where he came from in Norway or exactly when he emigrated. I've looked through ship's lists and emigrant books, histories of the early Norwegian settlements, as well as some of the Bydgeboker when I was at NAGA with no luck. I've increasingly focused on western Norway because I've done quite a bit of DNA testing (all three major companies) and all of my strong DNA matches are from Hordaland (particularly Voss), and Sogn og Fjordane.

The Bergen John Ottesen (son of Iver Ottesen and Anna Margrethe) is one possibility I'm currently exploring. He was born in the right year (1815), and I can't find a record of him in Norway after his DK confirmation in 1831. (There is a John Ottesen born in Bergen in 1816 who died in Bergen in 1883, but I believe he was not John Ottesen son of Iver but a different person, John Christian Ottesen born in 1816. John Christian also appeared in the 1875 census where his occupation was the same as in the 1883 death record - vognmand, if I recall correctly).

Iver and Anna Margrethe Ottesen had their first daughter (Henriette Margrethe) out of wedlock in 1804 (baptised in Domkirken) and got married about six months later at DK. From 1807 to 1810 they had three children baptised at NK, then in 1812 through 1819, four more children baptised at DK. In the 1815 census Iver is listed as a Borger og Kiobmand and they are living at 14de Rode 14. The children's baptism witnesses include a lot of prominent Bergen families (Lexau, Lassen, Koren, Meltzer, Helmers, Mohn, Gran, Blydt, Grip, Cappe, Bull, Offersen, Tornoe, Jansen, Meyer, Monclair, Balchen, Cordt, Krefting, Frochen, Mowinckel, Sodring, Rolfsen, Smith). There were also a lot of military officers listed in the kids' baptisms. Ole Bull's family lived down the street. (In the 1801 census 14de Rode 14 had been occupied by Jan Jansen Greve and Berthe Lexau). Around 1820 the Ottesens moved to 12de Rode 13, which is where Anna Margarethe died in 1824 (I don't know enough about Bergen to know if this was a move up or a move down). Iver died in 1826. Their last child together, Peter Nicolay, was baptised in NK in 1820 (he died in 1821). After Anna Margrethe's death, Iver had another child, Marius, with Marie Lude (possibly out of wedlock), in 1826, shortly before his own death.

I think Iver is the same Iver Ottesen who appeared in the 1801 census as a servant in the home of Clammer Meltzer, Frederick Meltzer's father. Frederick Meltzer was a witness to the baptism of Iver's son Peter in 1820. Iver is also the right age to be the Iver Ottesen Opheim from Voss who appears in the 1804-1805 seamen's roll for Bergen. This would make it possible for Iver to be Iver Audsen/Oddsen from Nedre Opheim, Voss, son of Aud Madsen and Anna Pedersdatter Refke, baptised at Wangs Sogn March 1783. This is just a hypothesis so far.

I haven't been able to find baptism or confirmation records for Anna Margrethe and right now I'm stumped about who her parents were. In the 1801 census there are a few Anna Olsdatters of the right age (born 1781, according to her death record) who were servants in Bergen, but it's impossible to tell if they're the same person. To further confuse things, Anna Margrethe is listed in her kids' baptism records variously as Olsdatter, Hansdatter, Jorgensen, and Ottesen. I can't find any family which seems to figure consistently in the kids' baptism records except the merchant families listed above. It has made me wonder if Anna Margarethe could be related to one of these families, even possibly an illegitimate daughter, but I don't understand enough about Bergen society during that time period to know how that situation would be treated.

I've looked through the probate records at Digitalarkivet and could not find any records connected to the 1824 death of Anna Margrethe Ottesen or the 1826 death of Iver Ottesen, although I did see Iver Ottesen mentioned several times in the 1826 probate record for Madame Martha Greve, widow of Hendrich Helmers. I can't read the record well enough to understand what it concerns or even whether these are debts Iver owes the estate or the other way around.

Right now my focus is on several unanswered questions:

1. Who were the parents of Anna Margrethe (Olsdatter/Hansdatter/Jorgensen/Ottesen), born 1781 (birth location unknown), married Iver Ottesen in 1804, died 1824 in Bergen.

2. What happened to Iver Ottesen's minor children after his death in 1826 (John 1815, Oluf Hagen, 1817, and Anna Lovisa Margrethe, 1819). I wish I knew more about how orphan children were handled in Bergen in the early 1800s. John, at least, was still in Bergen for his confirmation in 1831. What kind of legal arrangements would there have been for the care of orphan children? Is there anywhere for me to look?

3. Is Iver Ottesen, kiobmand, the same person as Iver Ottesen Opheim the 1804 sailor and the same person as Iver Audsen/Oddsen, son of Aud Madsen from Nedre Opheim.

4. If this is the case, I'd like to learn more about social mobility in Bergen during that period to understand how a farm kid managed to rise to the rank of borger and kiobmand and associate with the prominent members of Bergen society. My assumption would be he married well but since I can't figure out who his wife's parents were I'm still stumped.

4. Is there someplace else I should be looking for emigration, tax, probate, etc. records for the period 1800-1850 besides the Digitalarkivet?

5. Is there a source for early 18th century maps/plat surveys which would show the physical location of 14de Rode 14 and 12de Rode 13, (and other locations in Bergen?)

Late 18th/early 19th century Bergen is a completely new line of research for me I'm finding it fascinating and very enjoyable to learn about it. I would be very grateful to more experienced researchers or historians willing to offer any tips, insights, or suggestions for my research.

Thanks!