Friedrich von Sommerschenburg

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Greg Vaut

Friedrich von Sommerschenburg

Legg inn av Greg Vaut » 01 des 2004 22:41:02

Does anyone know if the Friedrich von Sommerschenburg #1 (1097-ca1121)
who was father of Adelheid von Sommerschenburg (m. Goswin II von
Heinsberg) is the same person as the Friedrich von Sommerschenburg #2
who was father of Sophie von Sommerschenburg (m. Hermann I von Thüringen)?

On Leo's site, Friedrich #1 can be found at:
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.ph ... 9&tree=LEO
Leo cites: 1. The Plantagenet Ancestry Baltimore, 1975. , Lt.Col. W. H.
Turton, Reference: 31
2. Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev
Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: I.1 148

Friedrich #2 can be found at:
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.ph ... 7&tree=LEO
Leo cites: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, 4
volumes, Marburg, 1953, 1975., W. K. Prinz von Isenburg, Reference: I 44

Leo shows Friedrich #1 was "Pfalzgraf of Saxony". The Genealogy.EU site
labels Friedrich #2 as "Count Palatine" (see
http://genealogy.euweb.cz/thuring/thuring.html).

Any ideas?

Leo van de Pas

Re: Friedrich von Sommerschenburg

Legg inn av Leo van de Pas » 01 des 2004 23:11:02

Dear Greg,

First, thank you for asking the question as it made me look further into
this. I think ES 1.1 provides the answer.

If you look at the year of death of Hermann I von Thüringen (1217) it seems
highly unlikely that his father-in-law died ca.1121. ES 1.1 Tafel 145 tells
that Hermann I Landgraf von Thüringen married (1) Sophie "de Austria" widow
of Heinrich Graf von Wettin. Hermann's second wife was Sophie daughter of
Otto I Duke of Bavaria.

Now I am going to change my data base and after the next update will show it
more properly. Again many thanks for the alert.

Best wishes
Leo van de Pas

----- Original Message -----
From: "Greg Vaut" <gregv.ma@rcn.com>
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 8:37 AM
Subject: Friedrich von Sommerschenburg


Does anyone know if the Friedrich von Sommerschenburg #1 (1097-ca1121)
who was father of Adelheid von Sommerschenburg (m. Goswin II von
Heinsberg) is the same person as the Friedrich von Sommerschenburg #2
who was father of Sophie von Sommerschenburg (m. Hermann I von Thüringen)?

On Leo's site, Friedrich #1 can be found at:
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.ph ... 9&tree=LEO
Leo cites: 1. The Plantagenet Ancestry Baltimore, 1975. , Lt.Col. W. H.
Turton, Reference: 31
2. Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev
Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: I.1 148

Friedrich #2 can be found at:
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.ph ... 7&tree=LEO
Leo cites: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, 4
volumes, Marburg, 1953, 1975., W. K. Prinz von Isenburg, Reference: I 44

Leo shows Friedrich #1 was "Pfalzgraf of Saxony". The Genealogy.EU site
labels Friedrich #2 as "Count Palatine" (see
http://genealogy.euweb.cz/thuring/thuring.html).

Any ideas?


Greg Vaut

Re: Friedrich von Sommerschenburg

Legg inn av Greg Vaut » 01 des 2004 23:31:01

Leo:

Thanks for the quick response. I understand that you decided that the
two Friedrichs are not the same person, based on Friedrich #1's approx.
date of death.

The date of death could be wrong (he was short lived) or perhaps he had
a son named Friedrich (#2).

However, Friedrich #1 had a granddaughter (by Adelheid) whom you show as
"heiress of Sommerschenburg". If Friedrich #1 had a son (Friedrich #2)
why would the title/estate have passed to #1's granddaughter and not to
Friedrich #2?

Any ideas?

Leo van de Pas wrote:

Dear Greg,

First, thank you for asking the question as it made me look further into
this. I think ES 1.1 provides the answer.

If you look at the year of death of Hermann I von Thüringen (1217) it seems
highly unlikely that his father-in-law died ca.1121. ES 1.1 Tafel 145 tells
that Hermann I Landgraf von Thüringen married (1) Sophie "de Austria" widow
of Heinrich Graf von Wettin. Hermann's second wife was Sophie daughter of
Otto I Duke of Bavaria.

Now I am going to change my data base and after the next update will show it
more properly. Again many thanks for the alert.

Best wishes
Leo van de Pas

----- Original Message -----
From: "Greg Vaut" <gregv.ma@rcn.com
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com
Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 8:37 AM
Subject: Friedrich von Sommerschenburg




Does anyone know if the Friedrich von Sommerschenburg #1 (1097-ca1121)
who was father of Adelheid von Sommerschenburg (m. Goswin II von
Heinsberg) is the same person as the Friedrich von Sommerschenburg #2
who was father of Sophie von Sommerschenburg (m. Hermann I von Thüringen)?

On Leo's site, Friedrich #1 can be found at:
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.ph ... 9&tree=LEO
Leo cites: 1. The Plantagenet Ancestry Baltimore, 1975. , Lt.Col. W. H.
Turton, Reference: 31
2. Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev
Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: I.1 148

Friedrich #2 can be found at:
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.ph ... 7&tree=LEO
Leo cites: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, 4
volumes, Marburg, 1953, 1975., W. K. Prinz von Isenburg, Reference: I 44

Leo shows Friedrich #1 was "Pfalzgraf of Saxony". The Genealogy.EU site
labels Friedrich #2 as "Count Palatine" (see
http://genealogy.euweb.cz/thuring/thuring.html).

Any ideas?








Henry Soszynski

Re: Friedrich von Sommerschenburg

Legg inn av Henry Soszynski » 02 des 2004 09:52:28

On Wed, 1 Dec 2004 21:37:31 +0000 (UTC), gregv.ma@rcn.com (Greg Vaut)
wrote:

Does anyone know if the Friedrich von Sommerschenburg #1 (1097-ca1121)
who was father of Adelheid von Sommerschenburg (m. Goswin II von
Heinsberg) is the same person as the Friedrich von Sommerschenburg #2
who was father of Sophie von Sommerschenburg (m. Hermann I von Thüringen)?

On Leo's site, Friedrich #1 can be found at:
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.ph ... 9&tree=LEO
Leo cites: 1. The Plantagenet Ancestry Baltimore, 1975. , Lt.Col. W. H.
Turton, Reference: 31
2. Europäische Stammtafeln, J.A. Stargardt Verlag Marburg., Detlev
Schwennicke, Editor, Reference: I.1 148

Friedrich #2 can be found at:
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.ph ... 7&tree=LEO
Leo cites: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, 4
volumes, Marburg, 1953, 1975., W. K. Prinz von Isenburg, Reference: I 44

Leo shows Friedrich #1 was "Pfalzgraf of Saxony". The Genealogy.EU site
labels Friedrich #2 as "Count Palatine" (see
http://genealogy.euweb.cz/thuring/thuring.html).

Any ideas?
FWIW

Friedrich I +c1120 was Count of S and Pfalzgraf von Sachsen (ie Count
Palatine), he was the father of Adelheid (m Goswin II) and Friedrich
II +c1162, Count of S and Pfalzgraf.
The latter was father of Adalbert +1179, Adelheid +1184 (abbess of
Quedlinburg) and Sophie +1189/1190

I think Royalty for Commoners was the source so caveat emptor!
Cheers,
Henry
INDIAN PRINCELY STATES
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
http://www.uq.net.au/~zzhsoszy/ips/

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