Hi,
The Trysil book III has information about Anders Olsen Kuosmainen (1627-1700) on pages 198 and 199. I can only read a little Norwegian and can't understand what they write about him.
I know he was born in Sweden but was a Finn and he lived at Tørberget. Can someone explain
to me what it says about him being arrested (stevnet) and being a spy (norsk spion)? Thank you very much!
Brian
Anders Olsen Kuosmainen
Moderator: MOD_Hedmark
Re: Anders Olsen Kuosmainen
Hi.
I have tried to translate the most important stuff from page 196 to 199 about Anders.
He is also related to me. 11 generations back.
Anders Olsen Kuosmainen ( called Korsman) was probably born in Orsa 1627 and died in Tørberget 1700.
He was married to Marte Paalsdatter Ratikainen (called Ratkin) born 1638 next to the big copper work by swedish parents.
We know from finnemanntallet of 1686 (where they recorded all finnish people),
that he has been in norway for 20 years.First in Rotberget and now 16 years in Tørberget.
Anders with children,children in-law and grandchildren,together 18 persons lived in Tørberget in 1686.
Anders Olsen Kuosmainen came to Tørberget together with Oluf "shoemaker".
In a lawsuit from 1673 we get enlightened that finnish settlers had a custom to be two together when they developed new land.
They were not only farmers and rye finns but also hunters.
In 1673 they were sued for killing 3 elks(moose) in forbidden times.
They were fined 7 daler for each elk and they also had to pay 3 mark because they had hunted on a palm sunday.
As a result of another verdict in 1670 by deputy primeholder Ove Juul command to the
fogd (about the same as a policeman that also collected tax) that settlers in Galåsen and now in 1673 also settlers in Tørberget had to be removed because they "crowded their woods and roaming around in the fields".
In the autumn the fogd`s agent Christopher Thordsen had been in Galåsen and Tørberget and "ruined the farms" and carried away most of the cattle from Galåsen.
In the lawsuit the finns from Tørberget Anders and Oluf shoemaker claimed that the cattle was their own and that they therefore had driven them over to Aspberget on the swedish side of the border so they not would be taken away from them.
The sentence that followed gave the finns favor and Christopher Thordsen had no right to act like he did and the finns also had the fogd Stenkuhls promise to keep the place.
They also leased the place from him and had also recently given him 4 barrels rye for the rent. After this sentence they sat mostly in peace.
After this day Oluf shoemaker is gone.
He probably moves to Sweden after the evacuation in 1673.
Anders was a guide during the war. In other words a spy.
He did both sabotage and business on the swedish side of the border.
In 1683 Anders sued Jakob Larsson,a swedish spy..,because he had not paid Anders 16,5 riksdaler he owed him for tobacco.
Larsson admitted the blame but sued him back for some damages to his farm.
Yes,said Anders but there were officers with who ordered the damages.
Jakob Larsson now got courts order to pay but Anders probably never got any money bacause he didnt have any.
Anders was sued in 1682 together with Nils Olsen for taking 26 riksdaler,one dukat and 2 silverspoons from a swede Bertel Jacobsen. He had come to Tørberget and died there under the holidays(pinsetider).
The money was kept at Anders Liitiainen in Gravberget and supposed to been taken by Anders but the case was first delayed then closed,so the complaint can not have been real.
In 1680 Anders was acused for illegal connection with the enemy.
The case was that he had "allowed" his daughter Marte to go over the border to Sweden to meet boys. She later married a swede,Anders Ronkainen.
Anders told in court that Marte had done it against their will and was not "to control".
Anders and wife got a 2 riksdaler fine for this.
When the finnemanntallet was recorded in 1686 it was informed that Anders had made good use as a guide during the war. (gyldenløve war).
It was also informed that Anders with wife and children had behaved well and gone to church. Anders also had given the fogd a bear-skin for the lease.
He could already now seed 4 barrels rye,hold 5 horses,20 big and 20 small cattle.
But the harassment against the finns was not over.
In 1699 Anders,3 sons,son in-law,a house-finn and 5 finns from Osen was acused
of "destroying" the woods in åmot and shooting 17 elks.
When the finns claimed they had been performed as shooters mostly of the time for colonel Brochenhus,the case was delayed.
Later when it was taken up again none of the complainant met with evidence and the case was closed.
Regards Tage.
I have tried to translate the most important stuff from page 196 to 199 about Anders.
He is also related to me. 11 generations back.
Anders Olsen Kuosmainen ( called Korsman) was probably born in Orsa 1627 and died in Tørberget 1700.
He was married to Marte Paalsdatter Ratikainen (called Ratkin) born 1638 next to the big copper work by swedish parents.
We know from finnemanntallet of 1686 (where they recorded all finnish people),
that he has been in norway for 20 years.First in Rotberget and now 16 years in Tørberget.
Anders with children,children in-law and grandchildren,together 18 persons lived in Tørberget in 1686.
Anders Olsen Kuosmainen came to Tørberget together with Oluf "shoemaker".
In a lawsuit from 1673 we get enlightened that finnish settlers had a custom to be two together when they developed new land.
They were not only farmers and rye finns but also hunters.
In 1673 they were sued for killing 3 elks(moose) in forbidden times.
They were fined 7 daler for each elk and they also had to pay 3 mark because they had hunted on a palm sunday.
As a result of another verdict in 1670 by deputy primeholder Ove Juul command to the
fogd (about the same as a policeman that also collected tax) that settlers in Galåsen and now in 1673 also settlers in Tørberget had to be removed because they "crowded their woods and roaming around in the fields".
In the autumn the fogd`s agent Christopher Thordsen had been in Galåsen and Tørberget and "ruined the farms" and carried away most of the cattle from Galåsen.
In the lawsuit the finns from Tørberget Anders and Oluf shoemaker claimed that the cattle was their own and that they therefore had driven them over to Aspberget on the swedish side of the border so they not would be taken away from them.
The sentence that followed gave the finns favor and Christopher Thordsen had no right to act like he did and the finns also had the fogd Stenkuhls promise to keep the place.
They also leased the place from him and had also recently given him 4 barrels rye for the rent. After this sentence they sat mostly in peace.
After this day Oluf shoemaker is gone.
He probably moves to Sweden after the evacuation in 1673.
Anders was a guide during the war. In other words a spy.
He did both sabotage and business on the swedish side of the border.
In 1683 Anders sued Jakob Larsson,a swedish spy..,because he had not paid Anders 16,5 riksdaler he owed him for tobacco.
Larsson admitted the blame but sued him back for some damages to his farm.
Yes,said Anders but there were officers with who ordered the damages.
Jakob Larsson now got courts order to pay but Anders probably never got any money bacause he didnt have any.
Anders was sued in 1682 together with Nils Olsen for taking 26 riksdaler,one dukat and 2 silverspoons from a swede Bertel Jacobsen. He had come to Tørberget and died there under the holidays(pinsetider).
The money was kept at Anders Liitiainen in Gravberget and supposed to been taken by Anders but the case was first delayed then closed,so the complaint can not have been real.
In 1680 Anders was acused for illegal connection with the enemy.
The case was that he had "allowed" his daughter Marte to go over the border to Sweden to meet boys. She later married a swede,Anders Ronkainen.
Anders told in court that Marte had done it against their will and was not "to control".
Anders and wife got a 2 riksdaler fine for this.
When the finnemanntallet was recorded in 1686 it was informed that Anders had made good use as a guide during the war. (gyldenløve war).
It was also informed that Anders with wife and children had behaved well and gone to church. Anders also had given the fogd a bear-skin for the lease.
He could already now seed 4 barrels rye,hold 5 horses,20 big and 20 small cattle.
But the harassment against the finns was not over.
In 1699 Anders,3 sons,son in-law,a house-finn and 5 finns from Osen was acused
of "destroying" the woods in åmot and shooting 17 elks.
When the finns claimed they had been performed as shooters mostly of the time for colonel Brochenhus,the case was delayed.
Later when it was taken up again none of the complainant met with evidence and the case was closed.
Regards Tage.
Re: Anders Olsen Kuosmainen
Hi Tage,
Thank you very much for this interesting translation! My Kuosmainen line is Kari Eliasdatter Kuosmainen, born about 1751, married to Peder Olsen Munksjøberget.
Regards,
Brian
Thank you very much for this interesting translation! My Kuosmainen line is Kari Eliasdatter Kuosmainen, born about 1751, married to Peder Olsen Munksjøberget.
Regards,
Brian
Re: Anders Olsen Kuosmainen
Hi Brian.
My Kuosmainen line starts with Kari Andersdatter Kuosmainen b.1760 married to Halvor Pedersen. They lived at Baksjøberget.
As far as i know Anders and Marte Paalsdatter Raatikainen had 6 children.
Marte b.1658
Olof b.1661
Henrik b.1664
Anders b.1666
Lisbet b.1671
Anniken b.1675
Regards,Tage
My Kuosmainen line starts with Kari Andersdatter Kuosmainen b.1760 married to Halvor Pedersen. They lived at Baksjøberget.
As far as i know Anders and Marte Paalsdatter Raatikainen had 6 children.
Marte b.1658
Olof b.1661
Henrik b.1664
Anders b.1666
Lisbet b.1671
Anniken b.1675
Regards,Tage
Sist redigert av dn23976 den 19. september 2009 kl. 7.06, redigert 1 gang totalt.
Re: Anders Olsen Kuosmainen
Brian and Tage,
Trysilboka III contains a number of factual errors, most of which were corrected in the more recent Trysilboka VIII, but a ‘recent’ find in archives in Trysil have unearthed some seemingly major omissions by the Author of Trysilboka, which means some descendants previously thought to be direct ( male line ) descendants from Anders Olsen Kuosmainen are instead direct descendants from Anders Andersen Ronkainen, who was a son - in - law of Anders Kuosmainen. The raise of the confusion may have been the Churchbooks, which for baptism of several children from 1730 onwards, only name the father as Anders Tørberget. The Author of Trysilboka, hopefully inadvertently although it now seems he knew about this problem as well as the correct answer, thus have created a Kuosmainen line which never existed as this fitted in with known data from the late 1600s. However, this is still under review as some of the answers that unlocks the mysteries lies in the Norwegian National
Archives and will require some time and effort to access and confirm contents.
Marthe Paulsdotter Raatikainen was born of Finnish parents - She was daughter of aul ‘Paavo’ Henriksson Raatikainen ( 1614 - 1685 ) and Gjertrud Mattesdotter ( 1606 - 1686 ).
Even though Marte is stated in the FinnCount 1686 to have been born, by her own words, at ‘Stora KooberVerk’, she was born in Nya Kopparberget ( ‘New Copper Mountain’ ), or Ljusnarsberg as it is currently known, as this place borders Grangärde in south, where her mother was born. There are documented Finn farms around Nya Kopparberget, amongst other one which was named ‘Ratkens’ ( ‘The Raatikainen Farm’ ). At Stora KooberVerk which is near Falun further north, there are no documented Finn farms.
I have a slight modification to the translation about Anders Olsen Kuosmainen - He is shown in records as a ‘Kunnskapsmann’, which directly translated means knowledgeman, an equivalent to current days Secret Service Agent or the Military OpsCore. In reality it means that Anders knew his way around the area on the borders between Norway and Sweden
and helped Norwegian soldiers to perform raids in Sweden, often in revenge for similar attacks in Norway by Swedish raiders, of which some attacks could today be interpreted as War Crimes.
The only reference to when Anders Olsen Kuosmainen was born is shown in the FinnCount 1686, which give his age as 59 years, and therefore give his birth to 1627. He was born in Orsa Finnmark in Dalarne, Sweden. Anders is believed to have died in 1702 as this is when he disappears from all records.
With regards to the death of Bertil Jakobsson in Tørberget, the Trysilboka state that Bertil was otherwise unknown, but Court records from Mørstad in Elverum, dated 6. December 1682, confirm that Anders and Nils were in fact accused for the theft. Anders had explained to the Court that Bertil had arrived in Tørberget already ill and had died at Trinity after some three
months of ‘living’ in Tørberget.
And here comes the difference as court records state that Anders had CLAIMED the belongings of Bertil, who had himself left these with Anders Mortensen Liitiäinen in Gravberget. Anders did not deny that he had claimed the valuables and stated he had done this on promise to Bertil to use the valuables for the funeral ( costs for Priest, Coffin, Burrial Suit, food, beer ... )
as well as payment to Anders and Nils as ’compensation’ for their services on giving Bertil an ‘appropriate burial’.
It is also seen that Bertil died in Tørberget as Anders and Nils had hired four horses for the travel from Tørberget to the Cemetery in Trysil.
The accusation of theft against Anders Olsen Kuosmainen was therefore not proven and the Court adjourned, having accepted explanations given by Anders.
Recent theories about this conclude that this ’unknown’ Bertil Jakobsson most likely was Bertil Jakobsson Liitiäinen, who was an Uncle of Anders Mortensen Liitiäinen in Gravberget, and behind the two of them lies an even larger story about robberies, family feuds as well as death sentences and executions in Sweden.
I would like both of you to contact me on tore@skjaerstad.com to discuss your Kuosmainen lines further as I am interested to learn about your lines and how they tie in with Kuosmainen - I am also indirectly a descendant of Anders Olsson Kuosmainen and several generations of my ancestors owned the farm Tørberget North.
Especially to Tage - We need to clarify some patronyms mentioned in your ‘Kuosmainen’ lines which seem wrong to me, together with the possibility that ancestral information for you is affected by my first statement, that most of the ancestors mentioned are Ronkainen and not Kuosmainen, although Kuosmainen still remain there as he is the father - in - law of the first
Anders Andersen Ronkainen in Tørberget.
Regards,
Tore Skjærstad ( Liitiäinen )
Whitley Bay
England
Trysilboka III contains a number of factual errors, most of which were corrected in the more recent Trysilboka VIII, but a ‘recent’ find in archives in Trysil have unearthed some seemingly major omissions by the Author of Trysilboka, which means some descendants previously thought to be direct ( male line ) descendants from Anders Olsen Kuosmainen are instead direct descendants from Anders Andersen Ronkainen, who was a son - in - law of Anders Kuosmainen. The raise of the confusion may have been the Churchbooks, which for baptism of several children from 1730 onwards, only name the father as Anders Tørberget. The Author of Trysilboka, hopefully inadvertently although it now seems he knew about this problem as well as the correct answer, thus have created a Kuosmainen line which never existed as this fitted in with known data from the late 1600s. However, this is still under review as some of the answers that unlocks the mysteries lies in the Norwegian National
Archives and will require some time and effort to access and confirm contents.
Marthe Paulsdotter Raatikainen was born of Finnish parents - She was daughter of aul ‘Paavo’ Henriksson Raatikainen ( 1614 - 1685 ) and Gjertrud Mattesdotter ( 1606 - 1686 ).
Even though Marte is stated in the FinnCount 1686 to have been born, by her own words, at ‘Stora KooberVerk’, she was born in Nya Kopparberget ( ‘New Copper Mountain’ ), or Ljusnarsberg as it is currently known, as this place borders Grangärde in south, where her mother was born. There are documented Finn farms around Nya Kopparberget, amongst other one which was named ‘Ratkens’ ( ‘The Raatikainen Farm’ ). At Stora KooberVerk which is near Falun further north, there are no documented Finn farms.
I have a slight modification to the translation about Anders Olsen Kuosmainen - He is shown in records as a ‘Kunnskapsmann’, which directly translated means knowledgeman, an equivalent to current days Secret Service Agent or the Military OpsCore. In reality it means that Anders knew his way around the area on the borders between Norway and Sweden
and helped Norwegian soldiers to perform raids in Sweden, often in revenge for similar attacks in Norway by Swedish raiders, of which some attacks could today be interpreted as War Crimes.
The only reference to when Anders Olsen Kuosmainen was born is shown in the FinnCount 1686, which give his age as 59 years, and therefore give his birth to 1627. He was born in Orsa Finnmark in Dalarne, Sweden. Anders is believed to have died in 1702 as this is when he disappears from all records.
With regards to the death of Bertil Jakobsson in Tørberget, the Trysilboka state that Bertil was otherwise unknown, but Court records from Mørstad in Elverum, dated 6. December 1682, confirm that Anders and Nils were in fact accused for the theft. Anders had explained to the Court that Bertil had arrived in Tørberget already ill and had died at Trinity after some three
months of ‘living’ in Tørberget.
And here comes the difference as court records state that Anders had CLAIMED the belongings of Bertil, who had himself left these with Anders Mortensen Liitiäinen in Gravberget. Anders did not deny that he had claimed the valuables and stated he had done this on promise to Bertil to use the valuables for the funeral ( costs for Priest, Coffin, Burrial Suit, food, beer ... )
as well as payment to Anders and Nils as ’compensation’ for their services on giving Bertil an ‘appropriate burial’.
It is also seen that Bertil died in Tørberget as Anders and Nils had hired four horses for the travel from Tørberget to the Cemetery in Trysil.
The accusation of theft against Anders Olsen Kuosmainen was therefore not proven and the Court adjourned, having accepted explanations given by Anders.
Recent theories about this conclude that this ’unknown’ Bertil Jakobsson most likely was Bertil Jakobsson Liitiäinen, who was an Uncle of Anders Mortensen Liitiäinen in Gravberget, and behind the two of them lies an even larger story about robberies, family feuds as well as death sentences and executions in Sweden.
I would like both of you to contact me on tore@skjaerstad.com to discuss your Kuosmainen lines further as I am interested to learn about your lines and how they tie in with Kuosmainen - I am also indirectly a descendant of Anders Olsson Kuosmainen and several generations of my ancestors owned the farm Tørberget North.
Especially to Tage - We need to clarify some patronyms mentioned in your ‘Kuosmainen’ lines which seem wrong to me, together with the possibility that ancestral information for you is affected by my first statement, that most of the ancestors mentioned are Ronkainen and not Kuosmainen, although Kuosmainen still remain there as he is the father - in - law of the first
Anders Andersen Ronkainen in Tørberget.
Regards,
Tore Skjærstad ( Liitiäinen )
Whitley Bay
England
Re: Anders Olsen Kuosmainen
Hi Tore!
Thank you very much for updating.
I wanted to buy the newest bygdebok as well but it is sold out.
And you are absolutely right about my Kuosmainen line. I saw wrong.
I will contact you on mail to discuss it because i have several Kuosmainens along with other finnish names and my finnish roots interests me.
Regards Tage.
Thank you very much for updating.
I wanted to buy the newest bygdebok as well but it is sold out.
And you are absolutely right about my Kuosmainen line. I saw wrong.
I will contact you on mail to discuss it because i have several Kuosmainens along with other finnish names and my finnish roots interests me.
Regards Tage.