Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Moderator: MOD_Emigranter

Svar
gj03525
Innlegg: 7
Registrert: 23 aug 2006 09:01:53
Sted: SVERIGE

Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av gj03525 » 23 aug 2006 09:12:56

Hej!

Hälsningar från Sverige! Jag söker uppgifter om föräldrarna till två syskon: Augusta Bergerson, född 1882-12-14 (sannolikt i Sverige, denna uppgift i US census) och Oscar N Bergerson, född 1885-01-20 (enligt amerikansk dödsattest i Bergen, Norge; i denna attest anges moderns flicknamn till Anderson).

Enligt US census 1900 och 1910 var barnens mor Fredrika bergerson, född i Norge i juni 1853, invandrad till USA med de två barnen 1892. Familjens efternamn stavas i amerikanska källor olika: Borgeson, bergersen, Burgeson. Fredrika kallas ibland Ricka. Familjen bosatte sig i Minneapolis, där Fredrika arbetade som tvätterska. Senare bodde Fredrika hos dottern Augusta i Chicago.

Sonen Oscar gifte sig med Delia Anderson (1882-1962) och fick två söner. Oscar avled 1965 i Wayzata, hennepin county, Minnesota. Dottern Augusta gifte sig ca 1907 med min farmors morbror Adolf Lundquist (i USA Lind), snickare i Chicago.

Jag har försökt hjälpa mina släktingar att också finna sina skandinaviska rötter på Augustas sida, men jag har inte kunnat finna vare sig Fredrika, Augusta eller Oscar på Ellis Island eller i norska källor på nätet (jag har sökt i de källor som finns hänvisade till på svenska Rötters norska sida). Jag har kollat förutom norska avreseorter och kollat avreseort Köpenhamn samt givetvis i svenska emigrantCD, 1890 års folkräkning och försökt vara innovativ vad gäller stavning av både för- och efternamn. Men allt utan framgång.

Enligt muntliga familjeuppgifter skall Oscar och Augusta också haft en syster, som gift sig och bodde med sin familj på en gård i South dakota, USA. I Us census anges Oscars och Augustas far som född i Sverige och modern i Norge.

sannolikt har vi här en svensk-norsk familj som rört sig över gränsen och stundtals bott i Norge och stundtals i Sverige. I US census nges Fredrika som "divorced" - låter lite märkligt för den tiden .- jag skulle sannolikt tro på en missuppfattning och att hon var änka. I US census anges också att fredrika fött 5 barn, varav 3 levde vid tiden för 1910 års census.

Så, kan någon med bättre kunskap än jag om norska källor, ge mig någon hjälp eller tips vart jag skall söka vidare? kanske jag inte sökt rätt i de norska källorna? tack på förhand för all tänkbar hjälp! Hälsningar, Susanne

dn12258
Innlegg: 250
Registrert: 21 jan 2005 17:17:39
Sted: LENA

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av dn12258 » 23 aug 2006 16:22:15

Susanne;

det første som slår meg at ifølge Census 1910 var hun født i 1843 og imigrerte i 1886??

Forøvrig ser det ut til å være mye å finne om familien i USA; men etter hva jeg forstår så har du alt derfra.

Som du sier er hun der notert som født i Sverige, men det kan jo være feil.

Limer inn indexeringen her; har image'n om du trenger den.

Name: Fredrika Bergerson
Age in 1910: 67
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1843
BirthPlace: Sweden
Relation to Head of House: Mother
Father's Birth Place: Sweden
Mother's Birth Place: Sweden
Home in 1910: Minneapolis Ward 6, Hennepin, Minnesota
Marital Status: Divorced
Race: White
Gender: Female
Year of Immigration: 1886
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Oscar Bergerson 26
Delia Bergerson 26
Raymond Bergerson 3
Eva Anderson 67
Emil Anderson 30
Fredrika Bergerson 67
Victor Anderson 52




Skal titte litt mer senere i kveld.

Brukeravatar
Margit Bakke
Innlegg: 6309
Registrert: 31 mai 2006 02:50:42
Sted: USA
Kontakt:

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av Margit Bakke » 23 aug 2006 23:33:24

Minnesota Death Index, 1908-2002
Name: Raymond Kenneth Bergerson
Birth Date: 30 Aug 1906
Birth City: Minneapolis
Birth State or Country: Minnesota
Death Date: 13 Aug 2001
Death County: Hennepin
Death City: Edina
Mother's Maiden Name: Anderson
State File Number: 2001-MN-523196


Children born to Raymond:
Name Birth Day Birth County Father Mother
David Raymond Bergerson 23 Nov 1939 Hennepin Raymond Bergerson Katherine Langworthy
Children born to David:
Name Birth Day Birth County Father Mother
Kirsten Finch Bergerson 28 Apr 1968 Hennepin David Raymond Bergerson Nancy Anne Heeter
William Thomas Carrington Bergerson 14 Jul 1964 Hennepin David Raymond Bergerson Nancy Anne Heeter
David Raymond Bergerson Ii 7 Oct 1969 Hennepin David Raymond Bergerson Nancy Anne Heeter
U.S. Public Records Index
Name: David R Bergerson
Birth Date: 23 Nov 1939
Street Address: 2303 Huntington Point Rd E
City: Wayzata
County: Hennepin
State: Minnesota
Zip Code: 55391
Phone Number: 952-471-7175
Household Members:
Name Est. Age Birth Year
David R Bergerson 66 1939
Deborh M Bergerson 38 1967
Deborh R Bergerson 38 1967
Kirsten F Bergerson 38 1968
Nancy A Bergerson 66 1940
William T Bergerson 42 1964

James Richrad Bergerson 29 Aug 1946 Hennepin Raymond Kenneth Bergerson Katherine Cecile Langworthy
Children born to James:
Name Birth Day Birth County Father Mother
Jeremy Ryan Bergerson 15 Jul 1975 Hennepin James Richard Bergerson Marilee Juneal Johnson
Matthew James Bergerson 1 Feb 1972 Hennepin James Richard Bergerson Marilee Juneal Johnson
U.S. Public Records Index
Name: James R Bergerson
Birth Date: 29 Aug 1946
Street Address: 16508 Kingsley Ct
City: Lakeville
County: Dakota
State: Minnesota
Zip Code: 55044
Phone Number: 952-892-5390
Household Members:
Name Est. Age Birth Year
James R Bergerson 60 1946
Jeremy R Bergerson 31 1975
Marilee J Bergerson 59 1946
Matthew J Bergerson 34 1972

John Steven Bergerson 17 Nov 1942 Hennepin Raymond Bergerson Katherine Langworthy
Children born to John:
Name Birth Day Birth County Father Mother
Jamian Steven Bergerson 12 Sep 1969 Hennepin John Steven Bergerson Sara Helen Macgowan
Katie Susan Bergerson 10 Feb 1973 Hennepin John Steven Bergerson Sara Helen Macgowan
Kelly Christine Bergerson 10 Feb 1973 Hennepin John Steven Bergerson Sara Helen Macgowan

Peter Wright Bergerson 2 May 1937 Hennepin Raymond Kenneth Bergerson Katherine Langsworthy
Children born to Peter:
Name Birth Day Birth County Father Mother
Mark Andrew Bergerson 21 Sep 1965 Hennepin Peter Wright Bergerson Carol Jean Hill
Robert Scott Bergerson 22 Apr 1962 Hennepin Peter Wright Bergerson Carol Jean Hill
U.S. Public Records Index
Name: Peter W Bergerson
Birth Date: 2 May 1937
Street Address: 1299 Black Oaks Ct N
City: Minneapolis
County: Hennepin
State: Minnesota
Zip Code: 55447
Phone Number: 763-258-2945
Household Members:
Name Est. Age Birth Year

Pete W Bergerson 69 1937
Name: Peter W Bergerson
Birth Date: 2 May 1937
Street Address: 1299 Black Oaks Ct N
City: Minneapolis
County: Hennepin
State: Minnesota
Zip Code: 55447
Phone Number: 952-475-0111

Margit in Minnesota

Brukeravatar
Margit Bakke
Innlegg: 6309
Registrert: 31 mai 2006 02:50:42
Sted: USA
Kontakt:

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av Margit Bakke » 23 aug 2006 23:47:37

Buried at Lakewood Cemetery in Minneapolis:

http://www.lakewoodcemetery.com/f_welcome.htm

DELIA BERGERSON
Age 80
Death Date 11/12/1962
Place of Death Unavailable
Disposition Date 11/14/1962
Site Id 46-60-2

OSCAR BERGERSON
Age 80
Death Date 11/25/1965
Place of Death Unavailable
Disposition Date 11/29/1965
Site Id 46-60-1

Margit in Minnesota

dn12258
Innlegg: 250
Registrert: 21 jan 2005 17:17:39
Sted: LENA

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av dn12258 » 24 aug 2006 10:24:36

Margit;

Susanne is looking for Fredrikka in Norway......


Susanne;

jeg har sett etter henne i Folketellingen 1865 og basert meg på at opplysningen i US Census om at hun var født i 1843 er rett.

Videre har jeg forutsatt at hun var født i Sverige; men øyensynlig også har hatt en tilknytning til Norge.

Ut fra de kriteriene er disse damene interesante(men ikke bevist!)

Jeg har måttet lime inn; fikk trøbbel med lenken denne gangen:



1865-telling for 0722 Nøtterøy
Distriktsnr. Skuledistrikt Sokn Prestegjeld Gard Matr.nr. Merknad (gard)
263 2 Bergan Nøterø Nøterø Bjerkø 85a Bruges sammen med Løb No 66 Bjonnæs
Personnr. Nytt hushald Førenamn Etternamn Fam. stilling Yrke Sivilstand Alder Kjønn Fødestad Hestar Stort kveg Får Rug Bygg Havre Poteter
1656 1 1 Amund Korneliussen hf Matros og Gaardeier g 43 m Notero Pr. 1 3 2 1/2 1/2 3 5
1657 2 Olava Olsdatter Hans Kone g 42 k Notero Pr.
1658 3 Ole Amundsen Deres Søn ug 11 m Notero Pr.
1659 4 Anna Oline Amundsdatter Deres Datter ug 4 k Notero Pr.
1660 5 Hilda Amundsdatter Deres Datter ug 1 k Notero Pr.
1661 6 Fredrikke Andersdatter Tjenestepige ug 22 k Sverige
1662 7 1 Gregers Evensen Føderaadsmand g 53 m Borre Pr.
1663 8 Helene Jorgensdatter Hans Kone g 79 k Notero Pr.


En annen kandinat her:




1865-telling for 0118 Aremark
Distriktsnr. Side Skuledistrikt Sokn Prestegjeld Gard Merknad (gard) Overskrift
487 6 135 2 Ødemark Aremark Vaagelsby 162 1
Personnr. Hushald Førenamn Etternamn Fam. stilling Yrke Sivilstand Alder Kjønn Fødestad Hestar Stort kveg Får Svin Kveite Rug Bygg Havre Erter Poteter
2897 8 1 Jens Niels. Husfader Gaardbr og Selveier g 66 m Aremark 3 14 8 2 2 2 1 14 1/4 4
2898 9 Marte Iversd. hans Kone g 52 k Aremark
2899 10 Christen Jens. deres Søn ug 29 m Aremark
2900 11 Johan Jens. deres Søn ug 26 m Aremark
2901 12 Otto Jens. deres Søn ug 15 m Aremark
2902 13 Hans Jens. deres Søn ug 9 m Aremark
2903 14 Jens Jens. deres Søn ug 7 m Aremark
2904 15 Helleborg Jensd. deres Datter ug 23 k Aremark
2905 16 Anne Christine Jensd.* deres Datter ug 13 k Aremark
2906 17 Frederikke Andersd. deres Tjenestepige ug 23 k Sverige


Jeg har forsøkt å finne en emigrasjon som kan knyttes mot disse; men har ikke noe sikkert enda.

Jeg har ikke funnet henne igjen i Norge i 1900 ; men det er heller ikke noe bevis på at jeg har funnet rett dame
Sist redigert av dn12258 den 24 aug 2006 15:22:46, redigert 3 ganger totalt.

Brukeravatar
Margit Bakke
Innlegg: 6309
Registrert: 31 mai 2006 02:50:42
Sted: USA
Kontakt:

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av Margit Bakke » 24 aug 2006 14:05:33

Thanks Tor for letting me know in English. :?
My dictionary does not always have all the words that are written here, I suspect some are in dialect.
Margit in Minnesota

dn12258
Innlegg: 250
Registrert: 21 jan 2005 17:17:39
Sted: LENA

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av dn12258 » 24 aug 2006 14:33:06

Margit;

maybe you have to keep on....



Susanne says Fredrikke was born i Norway June 1853 and immigrated 1892 together with Augusta and Oscar.

However; as you also know the 1910 Census says she was born about 1843 and immigration year was 1886.

If we could find them at other Census it might help.

As Susanne says; Fredrikke is noted as "divorced" at Census 1910.
Who was Mr. "Bergerson"??
Where/when did they get married?
Was Frederikka married once before?

Who was the father of Augusta and Oscar; Mr. Bergerson??
Other sources can also help us to identify her birth country; Norway or Sweden (Census 1910 says Sweden; the family says probably Norway)

Maybe Susanne turns up again soon with more information.

(How is the weather in Minnesota today; at the look-a-like" East Toten, Oppland CO it is raining, raining - afte the driest and warmest summer for about 100 years!)

NOTICE: I had a link to Norwegian Census 1865 yesterday. For some reason it turned up wrong. I have corrected (pasted in)
Have a look at it.

Brukeravatar
Margit Bakke
Innlegg: 6309
Registrert: 31 mai 2006 02:50:42
Sted: USA
Kontakt:

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av Margit Bakke » 24 aug 2006 18:00:34

Tor:
Very dry here in Minnesota also. Maybe flooding tonight they say.

1865 Census Fredrikke's born in 1843:

Municipality First name Surname Birthplace
Aremark Frederikke Andersdatter Sverige

Målselv Fredrikka Johanna Andersdatter Lofodens Præstegjeld

Børsa Fredrikka Andreasdatter Børsen

1865 Census Fredrikke's born in 1853:

Varteig Fredrikke Andersen Sarpsborg

Oscar's death says his Mother's surname as Anderson.

Minnesota Death Index, 1908-2002
Name: Oscar Bergerson
Birth Date: 20 Jan 1885
Death Date: 25 Nov 1965
Death County: Hennepin
Mother's Maiden Name: Anderson
State File Number: 027757
Certificate Number: 027757
Certificate Year: 1965
Record Number: 1621103

Margit in Minnesota

Brukeravatar
Margit Bakke
Innlegg: 6309
Registrert: 31 mai 2006 02:50:42
Sted: USA
Kontakt:

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av Margit Bakke » 24 aug 2006 18:50:38

1900 United States Federal Census
Name: Oscar N Bergerson
Home in 1900: Minneapolis Ward 6, Hennepin, Minnesota
Age: 15
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1885 (Born January 1885)
BirthPlace: Sweden
Relationship to head-of-house: Clerk
Race: White
Occupation: View Image
Immigration year: 1892
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
John Larson 41
Hulda Larson 34
Frank Benson 39
Oscar N Bergerson 15

Born in Sweden of Norwegian Father and Swedish Mother.

I do not find anyone else with the information given.

Margit in Minnesota

dn12258
Innlegg: 250
Registrert: 21 jan 2005 17:17:39
Sted: LENA

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av dn12258 » 24 aug 2006 19:20:34

OK;

then it looks like Fredrikka was born in Sweden.

However; when did she come to Norway??
Maybe she came after the Census 1865 was taken?


I know Susanne is asking for information about Fredrikka; but if we knew the name of the children's father (Mr Bergerson??) it might help us to find Fredrikka.
Susanne says:"och Oscar N Bergerson, född 1885-01-20 (enligt amerikansk dödsattest i Bergen, Norge; i denna attest anges moderns flicknamn till Anderson"

If that's correct maybe I should look for Mr. Bergerson in the Bergen area.
I can't find them as married in Bergen:digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=vigd1816&spraak=n&metanr=149

I have also been looking for Fredrikka and the children at the Emigrant Archives; no result so far.

So far we have only found her in US Census 1910 where she is noted as divorced.
Was she divorced from Mr. B. in Norway??

There's a lot of questions - let's hope Susanne turns up soon.

Why haven't we found F. in US Census 1900?
I have tried with many search critereias and I suppose you have done it too.

dn12258
Innlegg: 250
Registrert: 21 jan 2005 17:17:39
Sted: LENA

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av dn12258 » 24 aug 2006 21:06:13

I haven't found Oscar baptized in Bergen City.

However; the information saying "Bergen Norway" don't have to accurate.



digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=39&filnamn=doep1816&sokpostnr=41#a0

Brukeravatar
Margit Bakke
Innlegg: 6309
Registrert: 31 mai 2006 02:50:42
Sted: USA
Kontakt:

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av Margit Bakke » 24 aug 2006 21:24:16

Tor,
I checked them also and marriages. Nothing. I think she has to come with more information. :(

Margit in Minnesota

gj03525
Innlegg: 7
Registrert: 23 aug 2006 09:01:53
Sted: SVERIGE

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av gj03525 » 25 aug 2006 17:05:10

Hi Tor and Margit!

I figured the easiest way will be for me to write in English, as that way you will both understand what I am saying. Thanks for your interest in this matter and sorry to have kept you waiting .... I have been busy working .... smile. As Tor concluded, I am looking for fredrika in Norway, as I have been unable to find her in any Swedish sources. Her US life is fairly well documented I would say, apart from the fact that I do not know how she and her children came into the country. Also it is only an assumption that she travelled with her children to the US.

Anyway, all the info I have on the Bergerson Family are from US sources and it's also basically second hand information, that is I haven't reseached them myself but I have paper copies of all the relevant US census records, death records etc. it is true that the dates for borth Fredrika's birth and her year of immigration to the US varies between the various censues. However, one piece of information which you may find of interest is that Fredrika is listed in the 1910 census on two places: in Minneapolis ward 6 with her son Oscar and his family BUT also with her daughter Augusta (Gustie) and her family in Ward 11, Chicago, Cook Co, Illinois. The relevant info from that census is :

Lind, Gustie, wife, female, white, age 27, 2nd marriage for 3 years, had 4 children with 4 children living, born in Sweden, parents born in Sweden, emigrated in 1893
Burgeson, Ericka, mother-in-law, female, white, age 67, divorced, had 5 children with 3 living, born in Sweden, parents born in Sweden, emigrated in 1893.

My experience with US censuses is that you often have to regard the info as fairly approximate - there were great risks involved with taking the info by interviews, in particular with people who spoke a poor English. However, if different info leads in the same direction I would say it talks in favour. Also my experience is that the US 1900 census, where birth dates were given by month and actual year of birth, not an age, is more reliable. But still, these are just guesses of course. of course a labor woman of that time could be divorced, however I find it very unlikely, don't you? Wouldn't it be more likely that she was widowed or separated from her husband, as she earned the living for herself and her daughter in 1900 as a wash woman? In US 1900 census Ward 6, Minneapolis Borgeson, Fredrika, head, white, female, born June 1853, age 47, married for 8 years, 3 children, 3 children living, born in Norway, parents born in Norway, imigrated in 1892, washowman. Daugheter Augsyta, born in Sweden, father born in Sweden, mother born in Norway, emiragted in 1892. The immigration year 1892 also matches with the entries for brother Oscar.

Further Augusta Bergerson Lind's death certificate states that she was born in Minnesota, which took a lot of research by a friend to state as highly unlikly, especially due to the various US census entries.

Somehow I would hope it would be possible to find the family emigrating from Sweden or Norway? I have looked in various Swedish sources without luck so that is why I am turning my hope to you with a better knowledge of Norwegian sources than I have! Please ask if there is anymore information you need; however I fear the info I have given is just about all I have at hand.

All the best from a sunny southern Sweden (Kalmar area) - we also had a very dry summer, but now there has been rain for quite a while so we're anxious to see some sun again! /Susanne

gj03525
Innlegg: 7
Registrert: 23 aug 2006 09:01:53
Sted: SVERIGE

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av gj03525 » 25 aug 2006 17:14:45

Hi again!

I forgot to mention in my last entry that, when searching at DIStref I found two entries on Augusta Bergersen Duluth and St Louis Minnesota USA 1895. As I have not submitted any data to the Norwegian DIS (however I am a member of the Swedish DIS) I could not get access to who has provided that information. It seem a bit unlikely that it would "my" Augusta, but who knows? Can anyone verify or not that it is not about he same Augusta Bergerson mentioned in my query above? Thanks!! Best regards from Susanne

dn12258
Innlegg: 250
Registrert: 21 jan 2005 17:17:39
Sted: LENA

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av dn12258 » 25 aug 2006 19:29:32

Hi Susanne;

A short reply at your last entry:

Sorry; it's another woman:
Augusta Bergersen
f.1863 Åsnes, Hedmark
1895 Duluth, Minnesota, USA

I'll have a further look at the other entry later on.

dn12258
Innlegg: 250
Registrert: 21 jan 2005 17:17:39
Sted: LENA

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av dn12258 » 25 aug 2006 22:36:55

If the children were born in Norway and if they emigrated from a Norwegian port they might have used the fathers patronymic; not his surname....

And Frederikka cuuld have been noted as Andersen/Andersdatter(daughter)

If Frederikka imigrated after Mr. Bergerson as a "Mrs. Anderson" the children could have been noted as "Anderson" by the immigration officer.....

I have many examples on many different surnames at the same imigrant!
Confusing?
Yes; but let's hope it's not so complicated; but so far I haven't found some of them leaving Norweigian ports.



If you don't know the old naming traditions; have a look here:
www.norwayheritage.com/articles/anmviewer.asp?a=2&print=yes

I have also been looking for them at Ellis Island (from 1892) and at other US imigrant ports. Many with the same names; but wrong age.

I also have been looking for them at Castle Garden (not the easiest source...)


Susanne;
I presume you know about this CD?
www.genealogi.se/emigrant/emibas/

Margit; both your given name and your surname is Norwegian?
And Susanne writes perfect English; my English is poor. Sorry.

Brukeravatar
Margit Bakke
Innlegg: 6309
Registrert: 31 mai 2006 02:50:42
Sted: USA
Kontakt:

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av Margit Bakke » 25 aug 2006 23:17:13

Hei Tor!

Here is an explanation that I had my cousin who was born in Norway and now lives in Canada write for me for a book I did a few years ago on our area here at Flom, Minnesota. Everyone here says it is very easy to understand. :D

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com ... aming.html

Yes my name and surname are Norwegian, both my husband and I have 100% Norwegian Ancestry as do many in this area of Minnesota that I live in.

I am going to check emigration again and Ellis Island under different spelling this evening.

Your English is much better then my Norwegian. :shock:

Margit in Minnesota

Brukeravatar
dn24818
Innlegg: 228
Registrert: 22 jan 2010 13:19:24
Sted: FINNSNES

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av dn24818 » 26 aug 2006 18:59:23

Have you checked out this?

Minnesota Death Certificates Index

BERGERSON, RICKA
Date of Birth: na
Place of Birth: na
Mother Maiden Name: na


certid# 1924-MN-020900

Date of Death: 10/17/1924
County of Death: HENNEPIN
Surname Soundex: B626

gj03525
Innlegg: 7
Registrert: 23 aug 2006 09:01:53
Sted: SVERIGE

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av gj03525 » 26 aug 2006 19:49:39

Thanks for all efforts to help ..... smile.

Some comments. Yes, I have noted the Ricka Bergersen who died in 1924 in Hennepin. As a last resort I will send for her death certificate, but I have my doubts as Fredrika Bergerson is not listed as living with her son or daughter in the 1920 censuses. That would indicate that she died before 1920. Her grandson Jim Lind (Augusta's son), who was born in 1916 told me his granny died when he was very young. In the 1920 census Oscar lived in South Dakota (Sioux Falls, Minnehaha Co.) with wife and two children and no sign of his mother. (By the way, here Oscar is listed as born in Norway and both his parents being born in Norway). No sign of her at her daughter's address in Chicago either.

Yes, I have done genealogy research for many years in Sweden, so the Emibas, CD Emigranten and 1890 and 1900 censuses were obvious first tries for my search. No signs of either Augusta or her mother or brother. Which leads me to the conclusion, on the assumption that the note of Augusta being born in SWE is correct, that she moved from Sweden before 1890.

Being a Swede, I am well familiar with the use of patrymicon and I agree fully, this is a hard one - as both Fredrika (Frederikke?) could surely have been registered by various surnames on her emmigration. Still, I think I have tried to be fairly innovate and have searched for Andersson, Andersdotter etc as well, also different spellings for her first name. Also searching for Frederika travelling together with Augusta and Oscar has not given any hits. As for not finding her on Ellis Island - one reason could be that she came by way of Canada or some other US port than New York.

Family in the US know very little of their ancestors past lives. As so often was the case, either Augusta nor her husband spoke much of "the old country" and when the children became interested there was noone left to ask all those questions. They do claim Augusta was Norwegian though. One possible explanation as to why Sweden and Norway are used in different sources could be that Noway was in a union with Sweden until 1905 - that could make room for some misinterpretations (However I am sure no woman born in Norway would give her birth country as Sweden if she was properly asked!).

I am thankful for everyone trying to help out - somewhere out there, there is this little necessary clue that would make it possible to go further. I also have a feeling that I would find this little family - also with a Mr Bergerson or maybe Berger X? - neatly listed somewhere in the church records. Problem is "just" in what parish .....

Some questions to you familiar with Norwegian sources: There is no general census type for the whole country after 1865? No index for all Norwegian ports of emigration? I did try to search the various ports listed on the Norwgeian Archives web site (no luck), but I may have missed some I guess. There is not in Norway similar church records to the Swedish ones?

All the best from a rainy Sweden/Susanne

dn12258
Innlegg: 250
Registrert: 21 jan 2005 17:17:39
Sted: LENA

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av dn12258 » 26 aug 2006 22:35:53

Susanne;

well; I'm glad you also have done the same search as I (when you didn't find them it proves I did a "OK job" too!)

Yes; it is a problem; we don't know for sure in whitch coutry she was born.
I think her names is more "swedish" than Norwegian; but you'll find a lot Fredrikka Andersen in Norway too.

About Norwegian sources:

Census: 1660-65 (only male; not all young boys) 1801, 1865, 1875 (for some townships) and 1900. Also some local Census was taken (1891 and others)

Church records: Like Sweden. Some are fully indexed; and a prosject is going on to get them scanned.



digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/WebDebatt.exe?slag=listtema&debatt=brukar

Emigrant Records: Searchable port by port:

digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/WebMeta.exe?slag=vismeny&fylkenr=&knr=&katnr=5&aar=&dagens=&emnenr=1

At Digitalarkivet (the links above) you'll find most of the info available on the net.

All this info is free.



Other sources available at local Genealogical Societies.

We know the birth month and year for Oscar. it says he was born in Bergen (or nearby maybe)

Everey week new scanned images from the church record are added; let's hope he turns up soon.

But why can't we find Fredrikka; Augusta and Oscar at the Emigrant Archives?
They are "almost" complete in Norway; but as far as I know not in Sweden.

If Fredrikka was divorced before she left Norway/Sweden maybe she went alone and the kids came after next year??
They were very young; but of course they could have gone together with some family members or friends.[

Another good site:
url=http://www.rhd.uit.no/]www.rhd.uit.no/[/url]

Susanne; in your first entry you wrote ".....och Oscar N Bergerson, född 1885-01-20 "

Where did you find the "N"??

gj03525
Innlegg: 7
Registrert: 23 aug 2006 09:01:53
Sted: SVERIGE

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av gj03525 » 27 aug 2006 14:20:13

Tor – thanks a lot for the general info on Norwegian sources, it was helpful. With 25 years of experience of Swedish research and some 10 years of US research I feel fairly confident with those sources, while Norway was totally new too me.

The N comes from the 1900 US census, where Oscar is recorded as Oscar N Bergenson. Still, the N does not apprear in none of the following censuses, nor in his death certificate. So it may have been a mistake in the 1900 census!

Too bad that there were no general Norwgeian censuses taken in 1885 or 1890, that way we might have been able to track down the family somewhere!

Yes, it is true that the Swedish Emibas – based on info taken from local parishes, of persons leaving their homes with the intention to emigrate – is not complete for all parts of Sweden yet. Still, the CD Emigranten covers most departures from Göteborg and also Copenhagen. But of course, our elusive family could have gone by another company than the large ones. But I assume that if they were registred in a Swedish parish and had a Norwgeian port for their emigration, they would be listed in your Norwegian sources?

I have been kicked out twice from the internet, while trying to write this entry, so having rewritten it three times I may have missed something I intended to write. But here goes ….

Best regards, Susanne

Brukeravatar
Margit Bakke
Innlegg: 6309
Registrert: 31 mai 2006 02:50:42
Sted: USA
Kontakt:

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av Margit Bakke » 27 aug 2006 14:32:21

Hi Tor and Susanne,

I have my great grandfather who left Norway in 1872. I have his bible that he was given on the trip. In the bible it says the following, yet I have not found him leaving Norway on the emigration lists.

Presented to:
John O. Nysetvold
on the Steam Ship India
Mylini Captain
at sea, in lat 77º, long 82º
8 Mai 1872.

Koster 5 cents

John Olsen Nysetvold
fodt 16 Marts 1850
Foslait Norge 19th April 1872 kommen til Amerika 19th Mai.
skrevet 8th Oc 1872

As was told to me, some people took a "cattle boat" to catch another boat to Amerika so I may never find him leaving other then in the Churchbooks when they come online, so I will wait for this. :)

I checked more for your people and found nothing. I also checked the:
Folketelling for Bergen, 1885
Folketelling for Bergen, 1891
and found nothing.

What is the source that says Bergen or in that area?

Margit in Minnesota

gj03525
Innlegg: 7
Registrert: 23 aug 2006 09:01:53
Sted: SVERIGE

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av gj03525 » 27 aug 2006 19:32:22

Hi Margit!

The birth place Bergen comes from the death certificate for Oscar, issued in MN at his death. As this would have most likely only hearsay information from his children, both Tor and I assume that it could mean some place near Bergen. Or, for that matter, Oscar could have been born some place else and moved to Bergen young and regarded it as a natural place to state when asked "where he came from". So, like most the data I have, it really doesn't prove much, just gives a lot of possilities.

The info on the "cattle boat" was interesting - still a woman most likely travelling with 3 children? But anything is possible of course .....

Best regards, Susanne

Brukeravatar
Margit Bakke
Innlegg: 6309
Registrert: 31 mai 2006 02:50:42
Sted: USA
Kontakt:

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av Margit Bakke » 28 aug 2006 21:38:36

Susanne,
Has anyone ordered Oscar's application for SSDI? There he would have to give his father's and mother's names.
Margit in Minnesota

Name: Oscar Bergerson
SSN: 477-18-0199
Last Residence: 55391 Wayzata, Hennepin, Minnesota, United States of America
Born: 20 Jan 1885
Died: Nov 1965
State (Year) SSN issued: Minnesota (Before 1951 )

The application form (SS-5) contains the following information:

* Full name
* Full name at birth (including maiden name)
* Present mailing address
* Age at last birthday
* Date of birth
* Place of birth (City, county, state)
* Father's full name "regardless of whether living or dead"
* Mother's full name, including maiden name, "regardless of whether living or dead"
* Sex and race
* Ever applied for SS number/Railroad Retirement before? Yes/No
* Current employer's name and address
* Date signed
* Applicant's signature
A standard letter to the Social Security Administration is available with the search results on the Ancestry.com Social Security Death Index. This letter may be printed and mailed to the Social Security Administration to request a copy of your ancestor's SS-5 form. The Social Security Administration now charges $27.00 for each individual copy (an abbreviated NUMIDENT printout is available for $16.00).

Social Security Administration
Office of Earnings Operations
FOIA Workgroup
300 N. Greene Street
P.O. Box 33022
Baltimore, Maryland 21290

Re: Freedom of Information Act Request

Dear Freedom of Information Officer,

I am writing this request under the Freedom of Information Act, 5 U.S.C. Section 552. I hereby request a copy of the SS-5, Application for Social Security Card, or a corresponding NUMIDENT printout (see below) for the following individual:

Bergerson, Oscar
477-18-0199
Birth: 20 Jan 1885
Death: Nov 1965

This individual is deceased, having been listed in the Social Security Administration's Death Master File. I understand the fee for this service is $27 for copy of original SS-5 application OR $16 for copy of an abbreviated NUMIDENT printout when the Social Security Number is provided. I am requesting a (circle one: SS-5 copy OR Numident printout) Included is a check for $______ made out to the Social Security Administration to cover any administrative costs required by this request.

Please respond to my request upon receipt of this initial correspondence. Thank you for your attention and assistance.

Sincerely,




Address:

Daytime Phone Number:

gj03525
Innlegg: 7
Registrert: 23 aug 2006 09:01:53
Sted: SVERIGE

Re: Oscar Bergerson f i Norge 1885

Legg inn av gj03525 » 01 sep 2006 17:10:13

Thanks Margit for the tip - it could be worth a try, even if my (attmittingly not too extensive though .....) experience with those applications is that people do not always fill in all the required information! Best regards from Susanne

Svar

Gå tilbake til «USA/Canada»