Euphemia, Countess of Ross (was Re: Magna Carta line of Eufe

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Euphemia, Countess of Ross (was Re: Magna Carta line of Eufe

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 okt 2004 04:40:37

[Re-sent due to display errors in original SGM message]

Wednesday, 27 October, 2004


Dear MichaelAnne, et al.,

Your recent discovery and posts re: the identification of Isabel de
Dunbar, wife of (1) Roger fitz John of Warkworth, and (2) Simon Baard
(Bayard), and of her niece Euphemia (de Dunbar) (Comyn) Murray was extremely
interesting, and I think helpful in expanding on our knowledge of these
families.

In scouting about among the English and Scots nobility (not exclusive
designations) of the period for related possibilities, I noted the as yet
unidentified Euphemia, wife of William, Earl of Ross (d. 28 Jan 1322/3).
Earl William is well known for his career, both in support of King John
Baliol to and including the Battle of Dunbar in 1296 (he was imprisoned by
the English, 1296-1303), his capture of Queen Elizabeth (de Burgh) of Scots
and her party at Tain in 1306, and his eventual reconciliation with King
Robert before 1320 [1]. Concerning his wife Euphemia, virtually all we have
had to date is the statement in Scots Peerage that

" He died at Delny 28 January 1322-34, having married a lady named
Euphemia, who warmly supported the English party. " [2]

We know that Isabel de Dunbar, wife of Roger fitz John of Warkworth, had
a granddaughter named Euphemia (later wife of Ralph de Neville, Lord Neville
of Raby - see the chart below), whose name was clearly derived from Isabel's
mother Euphemia. It seems most likely that there was a nearer relation than
a great-grandmother who served as namesake for the young Euphemia de
Clavering. I suggest that this was Euphemia, Countess of Ross, whom I
identify as most likely a daughter of Isabel de Dunbar, on the strength of
the following:

1. Euphemia, wife of William Comyn of Kilbride, was clearly of the Dunbar
family (she is identified as a niece of Isabel de Dunbar, and grand-
daughter of Euphemia le Stewart), and her marriages are known. She
could not have been the wife of the Earl of Ross, and it is highly
unlikely we would find another daughter of Patrick, Earl of Dunbar
with the same name (a rare occurrence).

2. Several names are introduced into the family of the Earl of Ross
with the marriage of William and Euphemia:

A. Hugh, derived from the Baliol family (Hugh de Baliol of Bynam
was the maternal grandfather of Roger fitz John of Warkworth).
By this chart, Hugh de Eure was an uncle of Countess Euphemia;
and Euphemia named her eldest son Hugh (the future Earl of Ross
and brother in law of King Robert I of Scots).

B. John, a popular name in the Warkworth family. Euphemia is
shown as a granddaughter of John fitz Robert of Warkworth; her
nephew was Sir John de Clavering, whose name was not derived
from his mother's family (la Zouche). It is also possible that
John was named in part for Euphemia's alleged cousin John
Baliol, King of Scots, to whom William of Ross was so loyal.

C. Isabella, the name of Euphemia's probable mother Isabel de
Dunbar as shown below.

3. William, Earl of Ross was clearly aligned with the party of John
Baliol, and that of the Comyns. A grandson of William Comyn, Earl
of Buchan (d. 1233), he was closely related to the later. In
addition to his own career supporting John Baliol prior to
Bannockburn, his 2nd son John Ross was married to Margaret Comyn,
the younger coheiress of John Comyn, Earl of Buchan (daughter of
his brother Sir Alexander Comyn and not of the Earl, an error in
SP VII:235). If Euphemia was the daughter of Roger fitz John
and Isabel de Dunbar as shown, this would further explain
William's adherence to the Baliol party.

The following chart reflects the known and conjectured relationships
discussed above (the conjectured connections shown by broken
lines: _ _ _ _ _ _).



Robert fitz = Margaret HUGH de Baliol = CECILY de
Roger I de Chesney d. 1229 I Fontaines
I ____________________I__
I I I
Patrick = EUPHEMIA JOHN fitz = Ada JOHN de = Devorguilla
E of I Stewart Robert I de Baliol Baliol I of Galloway
Dunbar I _________I______ ______________I____________
______I_____ I I I I I I I I
I I I I I I I I I I
Patrick ISABEL = Roger fitz HUGH HUGH JOHN CECILY <siblings>
E of de Dunbar I John of de dsp King
Dunbar I Warkworth Eure of Scots
= Cecilia I
I I_____________________________
_I________ _ _ _ _ ________________I _ _ _ _
I I I I I
Patrick John EUPHEMIA Robert fitz Roger EUPHEMIA = William
E of = 1)William of Warkworth d. 1310 I E of Ross
Dunbar Comyn of 1st Lord FitzRoger I d. 1322/3
Kilbride = Margery la Zouche I
I I
__________________I__ _____________________I____________
I I I I I I I
Sir JOHN de Clavering EUPHEMIA HUGH JOHN = ISABELLA Dorothea I
Lord Clavering = Ralph de E of Margaret affianced _____I
d. bef 1331/2 Neville of Ross Comyn to Edward I
Raby, d. 1331 k.1333 Bruce Walter
I I
I I
V V


Certainly documentation supporting (or disputing) the above, e.g.
charter references to relationships between the Earl of Ross' family and
those of Baliol or Warkworth, would go far in proving or disproving the
claimed connection.

Should anyone have such relevant documentation, comment or criticism,
that would be appreciated.

Cheers,

John *




NOTES

[1] SP VII:233-235, sub _The Ancient Earls of Ross_ .

[2] Ibid. p. 235, cites "Cal. Doc. Scot., ii. No. 920; also see Stevenson's
Hist. Docs., ii."

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