THORNTON FAMILY

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Sue J

THORNTON FAMILY

Legg inn av Sue J » 21 sep 2004 23:38:07

Hi List,

Here is a good family line that maybe some experts can pick apart and
tell me if there are errors. I have tried looking for wills, etc. but
have not had success. I have tried on my own to verify these line
which belong to my husband's family. Thanks for any constructive
suggestions and pointing out of errors. I know the surname Grey was
actually De Grey.

Sue in Florida macduff@infionline.net

Descendants of Robert Thornton


Generation No. 1

1. ROBERT1 THORNTON He married ISABEL GREY.

Child of ROBERT THORNTON and ISABEL GREY is:
2. i. WILLIAM2 THORNTON, b. Bet. 1379 - 1408, England; d.
1488, England.


Generation No. 2

2. WILLIAM2 THORNTON (ROBERT1) was born Bet. 1379 - 1408 in England,
and died 1488 in England. He married AGNES ALDBOROUGH Bet. 1420 -
1452 in England, daughter of RICHARD ALDBOROUGH and AGNES PLUMPTON.
She was born Bet. 1388 - 1411 in England, and died 1488 in England.

Notes for AGNES ALDBOROUGH:
10th in descent from Edward I

Children of WILLIAM THORNTON and AGNES ALDBOROUGH are:
3. i. WILLIAM3 THORNTON, b. Abt. 1430, England; d. 1514,
England.
ii. FRANCIS THORNTON, b. Bet. 1540 - 1564, England; d.
1566, England; m. UNKNOWN, Bet. 1540 - 1564, England.


Generation No. 3

3. WILLIAM3 THORNTON (WILLIAM2, ROBERT1) was born Abt. 1430 in
England, and died 1514 in England. He married PICKERING Bet. 1461 -
1492 in England, daughter of SIR JOHN PICKERINE. She was born Bet.
1414 - 1443 in England, and died 1514 in England.

Notes for PICKERING:
Daughter of Sir John Pickerine d. 1488
will dated York 8/28/1487
Letter from Wm. T. Pryor citing letter from Chalifant of Colorado
Springs, Co. in 29 Oct 1968


Child of WILLIAM THORNTON and PICKERING is:
4. i. ROBERT4 THORNTON, b. 1454, England; d. 1566, England.


Generation No. 4

4. ROBERT4 THORNTON (WILLIAM3, WILLIAM2, ROBERT1) was born 1454 in
England, and died 1566 in England. He married JANE LAYTON Abt. 1477
in England.

Child of ROBERT THORNTON and JANE LAYTON is:
5. i. FRANCIS5 THORNTON, b. Abt. 1498, East Newton,
Yorkshire, England; d. April 12, 1566, De Lavier, Yorkshire, England.


Generation No. 5

5. FRANCIS5 THORNTON (ROBERT4, WILLIAM3, WILLIAM2, ROBERT1) was born
Abt. 1498 in East Newton, Yorkshire, England, and died April 12, 1566
in De Lavier, Yorkshire, England. He married JOAN DE LOVIER Bet. 1511
- 1545 in Yorkshire, England. She was born Abt. 1498 in East Newton,
Yorkshire, England, and died in England.

Notes for FRANCIS THORNTON:
p. 458 of Gen of VA Fam. Tyler's Quarterly Pi-T... "Gent of The Hill",
Yorkshire.
Wm. T. Pryor Letter of 29 Oct 1986 citing Chalifant 1016 E. Yampa,
Colorada.

Children of FRANCIS THORNTON and JOAN DE LOVIER are:
i. THOMAS6 THORNTON, b. Abt. 1524, Cambridgeshire,
England; d. Abt. 1600, Yorkshire, England.

Notes for THOMAS THORNTON:
Not verified:

birth of 1524 and birthplace from Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary Ann
Nicholson
death of 1600 and place ditto Craig Varner

ii. JOHN THORNTON, b. Abt. 1526, Cambridgeshire, England.

Notes for JOHN THORNTON:
Not verified:
Birth of 1526 and birthplace from the Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary Ann
Nicholson

iii. MARGERY THORNTON, b. Abt. 1528, Cambridgeshire,
England.

Notes for MARGERY THORNTON:
Not verified:

Birth of abt. 1528 and birthplace from the Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary
Ann Nicholson.

iv. MARGARET THORNTON, b. Abt. 1530, Cambridgeshire,
England.

Notes for MARGARET THORNTON:
Not Verified:

birth of abt. 1530 and birthplace from Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary Ann
Nicholson

v. JOAN THORNTON, b. Abt. 1532, Cambridgeshire, England.

Notes for JOAN THORNTON:
Not verified:
birth of abt. 1532 and birthplace from Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary Ann
Nicholson.

6. vi. WILLIAM THORNTON.


Generation No. 6

6. WILLIAM6 THORNTON (FRANCIS5, ROBERT4, WILLIAM3, WILLIAM2, ROBERT1)
He married BARBARA WESTBY. She was born Abt. 1532 in Eastcombe,
Yorkshire, England, and died in England.

Child of WILLIAM THORNTON and BARBARA WESTBY is:
7. i. WILLIAM7 THORNTON, SR., b. Abt. 1530, Eastcombe,
Yorkshire, England; d. May 30, 1600, Yorkshire, England.


Generation No. 7

7. WILLIAM7 THORNTON, SR. (WILLIAM6, FRANCIS5, ROBERT4, WILLIAM3,
WILLIAM2, ROBERT1) was born Abt. 1530 in Eastcombe, Yorkshire,
England, and died May 30, 1600 in Yorkshire, England. He married
ELIZABETH ROWLAND Abt. 1560 in Boroughbridge, Yorkshire, England.

Children of WILLIAM THORNTON and ELIZABETH ROWLAND are:
8. i. WILLIAM8 THORNTON, JR., b. March 27, 1649, Yorkshire,
England; d. February 15, 1726/27, Gloucester, Virginia.
ii. ELIZABETH THORNTON.
iii. MARY THORNTON.
iv. BARBARA THORNTON.


Generation No. 8

8. WILLIAM8 THORNTON, JR. (WILLIAM7, WILLIAM6, FRANCIS5, ROBERT4,
WILLIAM3, WILLIAM2, ROBERT1) was born March 27, 1649 in Yorkshire,
England, and died February 15, 1726/27 in Gloucester, Virginia. He
married (1) ELIZABETH FITZGUGH August 24, 1671. He married (2)
PRUDENCE WILLIS April 11, 1688 in Yorkshire, England. He married
(3) JANE PRESLEY October 20, 1720.

Notes for WILLIAM THORNTON, JR.:
Notes:

taken from Sue Jones, researcher

from "Ancestry World Tree"


Children of WILLIAM THORNTON and PRUDENCE WILLIS are:
i. SUSAN9 THORNTON, b. June 11, 1689.
ii. FRANCIS THORNTON, b. 1692; d. 1737.
iii. SETH THORNTON, b. October 13, 1694.
9. iv. PRUDENCE THORNTON, b. March 31, 1699, Gloucester
County, Virginia; d. Bet. 1754 - 1794.
v. WILLIAM THORNTON III, b. March 31, 1699, Petsworth
Parish, Gloucester, Virginia; d. 1742.
vi. JOHN THORNTON, b. April 17, 1701.
vii. JOHANNA THORNTON, b. December 03, 1703.


Child of WILLIAM THORNTON and JANE PRESLEY is:
viii. MARY9 THORNTON.

Gjest

Re: THORNTON FAMILY

Legg inn av Gjest » 22 sep 2004 00:16:18

"Notes for JOAN THORNTON:
Not verified:
birth of abt. 1532 and birthplace from Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary Ann
Nicholson."

Sue, imho, the problem with sourcing in this manner, is that there is really no easy way to relocate the original information. A person cannot go to ancestry.com and search for "contributions by Mary Ann Nicholson" so therefore they have to search for "Joan Thornton" and hunt-and-peck to the right database if it even still exists.

IMHO, a better way to source this would be something like
Database mnichols52 on http://www.ancestry.com Ancestral World Tree project, nicholsm@yahoo.com "Mary Ann Nicholson", extracted on 12 Jun 2004

In this way a person has the option to email this source directly, OR to search this database explicitly. And also has the knowledge of the time the record was created or at least the time you extracted it.

On http://www.ancestry.com you can search just a single database of the contribution of one person, but you must know the exact name of that database, rather than the name of the person contributing it.

Just my two cents.
Will Johnson

Gjest

Re: THORNTON FAMILY

Legg inn av Gjest » 22 sep 2004 00:44:37

You'll have to forgive me, but I'm at work right now so my notes are all at
home, but as I'm descended from the Prudence Thornton you identify as
generation no. 9 in your lineage, I am somewhat familiar with the material
you've posted. I believe Brice Clagett has examined the claims linking the
Virginia immigrant William Thornton (d. 1708 Stafford Co., VA) to the Thornton
family of East Newton, Yorkshire, so he may have some comments to add as well.

First, I should point out that it appears to me that the sources you've used
have confused or merged two different Thornton families into one. The ancestry
of the Thorntons of East Newton, Yorks., has been published in at least one
Visitation and also appears in at least one published edition of the diary (or
letters, can't remember which off the top of my head) of Mrs. (Alice?)
Thornton, the mistress of the manor during the English Civil War. She pops up
in a number of social histories dealing with 17th century women and family so
she shouldn't be hard to track down.

Anyway, I think the Cambridgeshire Thorntons belong to either another family
entirely or at the very least to a different branch of the East Newton bunch.

It also seems to me that the dates assigned to generations 6 and 7 are off,
William Thornton of generation 7 (shown as being born c. 1530) obviously can't
be the son of Barbara Westby (born ca. 1532) in generation 6. Indeed, if
memory serves, the William Thornton of East Newton who married Barbara Westby
is the one who died ca. 1600. Likewise, the William Thornton who settled in
Virginia (and who died ca. 1708 in Stafford Co., VA) is usually shown as a
grandson or even great-grandson of the latter couple (i.e., William Thornton
and Barbara Westby).

Another problem, by the way, is that the immigrant's wife Elizabeth isn't
really known to have been a Rowland, that's at best a guess (or family
tradition) based upon the fact that one of their sons was named Rowland
Thornton. As far as I know, there is no actual documentation proving anything
vis-a-vis her maiden name.

Finally, and most importantly for this list, as far as I know, no one has ever
been able to document the immigrant's descent from the Thorntons of East
Newton. Apparently either the immigrant or his descendants used the same or
similar arms, but as we all know, that doesn't prove they had a right to use
them. Likewise, I've seen arguments that some of the plantations owned by the
immigrant and his descendants seem to reflect a link back to the family of
East Newton through the names they were given, but again, that doesn't
actually prove that the families were related. If more recent research has
come out on the ancestry of the immigrant William Thornton, I'd love to hear
about it, but, considering that his descendants include at least two
presidents (Madison and Taylor) and several military types of some note
(including Generals Marshall and Patton), it would suprise me if no one on
this list hadn't already mentioned it before now...

Oh well, maybe one of these days.

Jeff Duvall



Quoting Sue J <macduff@infionline.net>:

Hi List,

Here is a good family line that maybe some experts can pick apart and
tell me if there are errors. I have tried looking for wills, etc. but
have not had success. I have tried on my own to verify these line
which belong to my husband's family. Thanks for any constructive
suggestions and pointing out of errors. I know the surname Grey was
actually De Grey.

Sue in Florida macduff@infionline.net

Descendants of Robert Thornton


Generation No. 1

1. ROBERT1 THORNTON He married ISABEL GREY.

Child of ROBERT THORNTON and ISABEL GREY is:
2. i. WILLIAM2 THORNTON, b. Bet. 1379 - 1408, England; d.
1488, England.


Generation No. 2

2. WILLIAM2 THORNTON (ROBERT1) was born Bet. 1379 - 1408 in England,
and died 1488 in England. He married AGNES ALDBOROUGH Bet. 1420 -
1452 in England, daughter of RICHARD ALDBOROUGH and AGNES PLUMPTON.
She was born Bet. 1388 - 1411 in England, and died 1488 in England.

Notes for AGNES ALDBOROUGH:
10th in descent from Edward I

Children of WILLIAM THORNTON and AGNES ALDBOROUGH are:
3. i. WILLIAM3 THORNTON, b. Abt. 1430, England; d. 1514,
England.
ii. FRANCIS THORNTON, b. Bet. 1540 - 1564, England; d.
1566, England; m. UNKNOWN, Bet. 1540 - 1564, England.


Generation No. 3

3. WILLIAM3 THORNTON (WILLIAM2, ROBERT1) was born Abt. 1430 in
England, and died 1514 in England. He married PICKERING Bet. 1461 -
1492 in England, daughter of SIR JOHN PICKERINE. She was born Bet.
1414 - 1443 in England, and died 1514 in England.

Notes for PICKERING:
Daughter of Sir John Pickerine d. 1488
will dated York 8/28/1487
Letter from Wm. T. Pryor citing letter from Chalifant of Colorado
Springs, Co. in 29 Oct 1968


Child of WILLIAM THORNTON and PICKERING is:
4. i. ROBERT4 THORNTON, b. 1454, England; d. 1566, England.


Generation No. 4

4. ROBERT4 THORNTON (WILLIAM3, WILLIAM2, ROBERT1) was born 1454 in
England, and died 1566 in England. He married JANE LAYTON Abt. 1477
in England.

Child of ROBERT THORNTON and JANE LAYTON is:
5. i. FRANCIS5 THORNTON, b. Abt. 1498, East Newton,
Yorkshire, England; d. April 12, 1566, De Lavier, Yorkshire, England.


Generation No. 5

5. FRANCIS5 THORNTON (ROBERT4, WILLIAM3, WILLIAM2, ROBERT1) was born
Abt. 1498 in East Newton, Yorkshire, England, and died April 12, 1566
in De Lavier, Yorkshire, England. He married JOAN DE LOVIER Bet. 1511
- 1545 in Yorkshire, England. She was born Abt. 1498 in East Newton,
Yorkshire, England, and died in England.

Notes for FRANCIS THORNTON:
p. 458 of Gen of VA Fam. Tyler's Quarterly Pi-T... "Gent of The Hill",
Yorkshire.
Wm. T. Pryor Letter of 29 Oct 1986 citing Chalifant 1016 E. Yampa,
Colorada.

Children of FRANCIS THORNTON and JOAN DE LOVIER are:
i. THOMAS6 THORNTON, b. Abt. 1524, Cambridgeshire,
England; d. Abt. 1600, Yorkshire, England.

Notes for THOMAS THORNTON:
Not verified:

birth of 1524 and birthplace from Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary Ann
Nicholson
death of 1600 and place ditto Craig Varner

ii. JOHN THORNTON, b. Abt. 1526, Cambridgeshire, England.

Notes for JOHN THORNTON:
Not verified:
Birth of 1526 and birthplace from the Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary Ann
Nicholson

iii. MARGERY THORNTON, b. Abt. 1528, Cambridgeshire,
England.

Notes for MARGERY THORNTON:
Not verified:

Birth of abt. 1528 and birthplace from the Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary
Ann Nicholson.

iv. MARGARET THORNTON, b. Abt. 1530, Cambridgeshire,
England.

Notes for MARGARET THORNTON:
Not Verified:

birth of abt. 1530 and birthplace from Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary Ann
Nicholson

v. JOAN THORNTON, b. Abt. 1532, Cambridgeshire, England.

Notes for JOAN THORNTON:
Not verified:
birth of abt. 1532 and birthplace from Ancestry.com gedcom of Mary Ann
Nicholson.

6. vi. WILLIAM THORNTON.


Generation No. 6

6. WILLIAM6 THORNTON (FRANCIS5, ROBERT4, WILLIAM3, WILLIAM2, ROBERT1)
He married BARBARA WESTBY. She was born Abt. 1532 in Eastcombe,
Yorkshire, England, and died in England.

Child of WILLIAM THORNTON and BARBARA WESTBY is:
7. i. WILLIAM7 THORNTON, SR., b. Abt. 1530, Eastcombe,
Yorkshire, England; d. May 30, 1600, Yorkshire, England.


Generation No. 7

7. WILLIAM7 THORNTON, SR. (WILLIAM6, FRANCIS5, ROBERT4, WILLIAM3,
WILLIAM2, ROBERT1) was born Abt. 1530 in Eastcombe, Yorkshire,
England, and died May 30, 1600 in Yorkshire, England. He married
ELIZABETH ROWLAND Abt. 1560 in Boroughbridge, Yorkshire, England.

Children of WILLIAM THORNTON and ELIZABETH ROWLAND are:
8. i. WILLIAM8 THORNTON, JR., b. March 27, 1649, Yorkshire,
England; d. February 15, 1726/27, Gloucester, Virginia.
ii. ELIZABETH THORNTON.
iii. MARY THORNTON.
iv. BARBARA THORNTON.


Generation No. 8

8. WILLIAM8 THORNTON, JR. (WILLIAM7, WILLIAM6, FRANCIS5, ROBERT4,
WILLIAM3, WILLIAM2, ROBERT1) was born March 27, 1649 in Yorkshire,
England, and died February 15, 1726/27 in Gloucester, Virginia. He
married (1) ELIZABETH FITZGUGH August 24, 1671. He married (2)
PRUDENCE WILLIS April 11, 1688 in Yorkshire, England. He married
(3) JANE PRESLEY October 20, 1720.

Notes for WILLIAM THORNTON, JR.:
Notes:

taken from Sue Jones, researcher

from "Ancestry World Tree"


Children of WILLIAM THORNTON and PRUDENCE WILLIS are:
i. SUSAN9 THORNTON, b. June 11, 1689.
ii. FRANCIS THORNTON, b. 1692; d. 1737.
iii. SETH THORNTON, b. October 13, 1694.
9. iv. PRUDENCE THORNTON, b. March 31, 1699, Gloucester
County, Virginia; d. Bet. 1754 - 1794.
v. WILLIAM THORNTON III, b. March 31, 1699, Petsworth
Parish, Gloucester, Virginia; d. 1742.
vi. JOHN THORNTON, b. April 17, 1701.
vii. JOHANNA THORNTON, b. December 03, 1703.


Child of WILLIAM THORNTON and JANE PRESLEY is:
viii. MARY9 THORNTON.




Sue J

RE: THORNTON FAMILY

Legg inn av Sue J » 22 sep 2004 02:34:02

Hi List,

I have removed the parents of Robert and changed his death date.
Apparently he died in 1514. That sounds a little better. I do not
know if there is still a mix of two families if I leave the rest
alone. From what I found on Familysearch, etc. Robert was actually
one of the children of William Thornton and Agnes Aldborough of
Newton. If this is still a mixup of two families, I would love to
know where to stop and what the line should look like. I hate errors.
:-) If the rest of my line looks good, that would be wonderful.
Thanks so far for the help and the pointing out of errors.

Sue in Florida macduff@infionline.net
-----Original Message-----
From: Dolly Ziegler [mailto:dsz@bcpl.net]
Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2004 4:31 PM
To: Sue J
Cc: Dolly Ziegler
Subject: Re: THORNTON FAMILY

Hello, Sue. A private reply:

This generation appears to have a problem:


Child of WILLIAM THORNTON and PICKERING is:
4. i. ROBERT4 THORNTON, b. 1454, England; d. 1566, England.

died age 112? Unlikely. There's at least one generation missing --
and
perhaps the direct line is broken.

Many others on the tree you posted seem to have lived to unusually
old ages (unusual for that time and places.) You may want to be
suspicious that the compiler(s) have fallen into the "name's the same"
error.

It's very difficult to give up on an interesting way-way-back
ancestral line. I've had to do it more than once because I had relied
on other people's published research. Alas!

Hope this is useful. Cheers, Dolly in Maryland

Gjest

RE: THORNTON FAMILY

Legg inn av Gjest » 22 sep 2004 05:55:25

"From what I found on Familysearch, etc. Robert was actually
one of the children of William Thornton and Agnes Aldborough of
Newton. "

Sue again imho "familysearch" is not a source.
Within the website http://www.familysearch.org there are several quite different sources. Quite a large amount of the IGI is just individuals like you and me, with no credentials, submitting family group sheets.

The ancestral file is not much better. However you should indicate IGI, Ancestral File, Pedigree Resource File, etc so people have a feel for the quality of the citation.

Part of the IGI is actual extracts from actual primary records, and is so marked in the source citation within each entry. THAT is your true source citation reference, although you should list IGI as secondary just in case there's a typographical error in the IGI from the primary.

Will Johnson

Tim Powys-Lybbe

RE: THORNTON FAMILY

Legg inn av Tim Powys-Lybbe » 22 sep 2004 10:55:12

In message of 22 Sep, WJhonson@aol.com wrote:

"From what I found on Familysearch, etc. Robert was actually
one of the children of William Thornton and Agnes Aldborough of
Newton. "

Sue again imho "familysearch" is not a source.
Within the website http://www.familysearch.org there are several quite
different sources. Quite a large amount of the IGI is just
individuals like you and me, with no credentials, submitting family
group sheets.

The ancestral file is not much better. However you should indicate
IGI, Ancestral File, Pedigree Resource File, etc so people have a
feel for the quality of the citation.

Part of the IGI is actual extracts from actual primary records, and
is so marked in the source citation within each entry. THAT is your
true source citation reference, although you should list IGI as
secondary just in case there's a typographical error in the IGI from
the primary.

Might I also recommend Roy Stockdill's account of research in general
and IGI in particular on:

http://www.genuki.org.uk/gs/Newbie.html

Part 5 of this is highly informative on IGI.

--
Tim Powys-Lybbe tim@powys.org
For a miscellany of bygones: http://powys.org

Douglas Beahm

Re: THORNTON FAMILY

Legg inn av Douglas Beahm » 22 sep 2004 13:26:41

The most recent article that I have seen on the Thornton family of
Gloucester Co., VA is:

_Magazine of Virginia Genealogy_, Vol. 39, No. 1, pp. 5-29
_The Hills, Gloucester County Home of the Immigrant William Thornton_, R.
James Thornton (James R. Thornton)

As far as I know, the parentage of the immigrant, William Thornton, is
still unproven.

Gjest

Re: THORNTON FAMILY (slightly OT)

Legg inn av Gjest » 22 sep 2004 20:14:09

A couple of weeks ago Bob Thornton (of Atlanta) posted a message to the
Thornton Family List on GenForum indicating that DNA analysis has shown a
close link between William Thornton "the Immigrant" (originally to Gloucester
Co., VA but died ca. 1708 in Stafford Co., VA) and another early Virginia
Immigrant named Henry Thornton. This second fellow (Henry Thornton) seems to
be descended from a Middlesex family who may have originally come from
Cheshire. Depending on how closely related to the two men were (and that's
still unknown as far as I know) we may be much closer to determining William's
ancestry than ever before. The interesting thing is that it may turn out that
William Thornton has no connection to the Thorntons of East Newton, Yorkshire,
at all. For anyone interested in reading more about this, here's the url for
the Thornton DNA Project: http://www.starthorn.com/ThorntonDNA/


It is probably also worth noting that this website also links to a very
detailed analysis of William Thornton's career in Virginia which has also been
compiled by Bob Thornton.

Jeff Duvall

Quoting Douglas Beahm <dbeahm@earthlink.net>:

The most recent article that I have seen on the Thornton family of
Gloucester Co., VA is:

_Magazine of Virginia Genealogy_, Vol. 39, No. 1, pp. 5-29
_The Hills, Gloucester County Home of the Immigrant William Thornton_, R.
James Thornton (James R. Thornton)

As far as I know, the parentage of the immigrant, William Thornton, is
still unproven.


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