Blount-Ayala

Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper

Svar
D. Spencer Hines

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av D. Spencer Hines » 27 nov 2007 05:35:50

The following website, which has been labeled suspect in its simplicity,
without footnotes, offers us the descent of Charlemagne, for gateway
to American ancestors... [sic] -- Pogue Arnold

That's a Good Example of Pogue Arnold's penchant for writing in gibberish.

The chart does NOT show us "the descent of Charlemagne".

<http://www.charlemagne.org/ui60.htm>

It shows various alleged lines of descent FROM Charlemagne.

Pogue Arnold doesn't even know the Basic Vocabulary of Genealogy or the
correct usage of prepositions in English.

DSH

Lux et Veritas et Libertas

"Bill Arnold" <billarnoldfla@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:mailman.547.1196136845.28474.gen-medieval@rootsweb.com...

Hi, Gen-Medievalers.

The following website, which has been labeled suspect in its simplicity,
without footnotes, offers us the descent of Charlemagne, for gateway
to American ancestors:

http://www.charlemagne.org/ui60.htm

If, it is not to be trusted, what is a better source for the descent of
Charlemagne, worldwide?

Bill

Bill Arnold

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 06:35:05

"pj.evans" <pj.evans.gen@usa.net>

My sister-in-law also has Kimballs on her tree:
Abner D m Roxana Caldwell, 1845, Charlestown, MA
Stephen G m Rosanna Dolloff, 1818
Ensign m Hannah Granville, 1791
David m Annie Sargent, 1751
Benjamin m Elizabeth Greeley, 1728
John m Hannah Gould, bef 1699
John m Mary Jordan, 1666
Henry m Mary Wyatt, ca 1640
Richard m Ursula Scott, 1613/14

Yeah, but I'm getting a little tired of them. I have four Kimball
lines from this grandmother, plus two from her husband (descendant two
ways of Mary Severance who married James Coffin of Nantucket). Those
lines plus my four or five White of Connecticut, 8 Starbuck, 9 Coffin,
6 Macy, 6 Gardner, and 3 Howland, really cut down on the possible
number of royal descents I could have (I still have five or six, but
they're all rather remote: Edmond Hawes [probably my favorite for
some reason], Mary Gye Maverick, William Sargent, Capt. Anthony
Collamore, Giddings-Lawrence, plus Joan [Price] Cleeves [still not
quite convinced about that one]).

Oh, how true.
I have Starbuck, Coffins, and Macys as in-laws and step-parents of
various ancestors. They _did_ get around.

BA: PJ, what is the source of the pedigree of Kimball:
[above]? These are not all LDS records?

Abner D m Roxana Caldwell, 1845, Charlestown, MA
Stephen G m Rosanna Dolloff, 1818
Ensign m Hannah Granville, 1791
David m Annie Sargent, 1751
Benjamin m Elizabeth Greeley, 1728
John m Hannah Gould, bef 1699
John m Mary Jordan, 1666
Henry m Mary Wyatt, ca 1640
Richard m Ursula Scott, 1613/14

Bill
PS Surely, not all these marriages took place in Charlestown, MA?
Should not places of the marriages be listed for authentication?
I do not see their connection to gen-medieval, but having NE ancestors
myself, I am interested,
*****






____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 06:36:03

--- "D. Spencer Hines" <panther@excelsior.com> wrote:

The following website, which has been labeled suspect in its simplicity,
without footnotes, offers us the descent of Charlemagne, for gateway
to American ancestors... [sic] -- Pogue Arnold

That's a Good Example of Pogue Arnold's penchant for writing in gibberish.

The chart does NOT show us "the descent of Charlemagne".

http://www.charlemagne.org/ui60.htm

It shows various alleged lines of descent FROM Charlemagne.

Pogue Arnold doesn't even know the Basic Vocabulary of Genealogy or the
correct usage of prepositions in English.


BA: Rather than contribute constructively and answer the question, we have
another ad hominem from our resident deconstructionist: no *cap* for him.
O, The Insipid One believes he can parse sentences, now, does he? I am going
to depart from my stated goal of not responding to The Insipid One, by reminding
him my first name is *not* Pogue. He has labeled every other respondent
on gen-medieval, male/female, with this inexplicable firstname of *Pogue* as if
we have to stand still and accept his nonsense. I guess the *D* in front of DSH
stands for Dipsh*t! There are only 6 vowels in English, so I assume he can figure
out the *krypto* message.

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better sports nut! Let your teams follow you
with Yahoo Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9 ... QtBI7ntAcJ

D. Spencer Hines

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av D. Spencer Hines » 27 nov 2007 07:43:59

The following website, which has been labeled suspect in its simplicity,
without footnotes, offers us the descent of Charlemagne, for gateway
to American ancestors... [sic cubed]

If, it is not to be trusted, what is a better source for the descent of
Charlemagne, worldwide? [sic cubed]

-- Pogue Arnold

Hilarious!

....Talk about Garbled Grammar and Syntax coupled with Hare-Brained
Rhetoric...

That's a Good Example of Pogue Arnold's penchant for Writing In Gibberish
[WIG].

And he tells us he is a teacher of ENGLISH....

Hilarious!

The chart does NOT show us "the descent of Charlemagne".

<http://www.charlemagne.org/ui60.htm>

It shows us various alleged LINES of descent FROM Charlemagne.

Pogue Arnold doesn't even know the Basic Vocabulary of Genealogy or the
correct usage of prepositions in English.

Dumb as a sack of hammers -- that's our Pogue Arnold.

But Entertaining...

In His Fatuous Posturing, Posing and Pirouetting.

DSH

Lux et Veritas et Libertas

"Bill Arnold" <billarnoldfla@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:mailman.547.1196136845.28474.gen-medieval@rootsweb.com...

Hi, Gen-Medievalers.

The following website, which has been labeled suspect in its simplicity,
without footnotes, offers us the descent of Charlemagne, for gateway
to American ancestors:

http://www.charlemagne.org/ui60.htm

If, it is not to be trusted, what is a better source for the descent of
Charlemagne, worldwide?

Bill

Mary Jane Battaglia

Re: Tiplady

Legg inn av Mary Jane Battaglia » 27 nov 2007 07:49:24

To all you kind Scholars who have responded to my query re "Tiplady:"



THANK YOU! Now my head is really spinning at all the possibilities.



Renias' comments re the innkeeper angle had occurred to me..especially
the current interpretation of "tippler", but that's just speculation right
now. And David Green's comments re "libertine" and Augustus M.Toplady
connections had been suggested to me but not taken seriously (ha). The
ancient use of the name "Johanna Tippelereday" as suggested by taf is now
filed away should I ever get back that far.



Renias' information re where and when the name is/was found should
prove helpful and will be studied.. Clues from my own research (Documented.
I actually saw the entries in the Beverly Parish book the birth of my great
grandmother, Maria and her twin, Emily in 1838) indicate that Christopher
and Elizabeth produced 8 children, the first three (William, Mary Ann and
Rebecca) were born in Beverly/Hull region while the rest (George Cook
Tiplady, John, Elizabeth, Ruth Ann, Joseph and Frances) were born in the
Stepney area, London where Christopher was a cordwainer. The youngest,
Frances, was my ancestor. She was baptized in her teens (1813) at St
Dunsten, Miles End, New Town.



(Please excuse, but a personal note we still cherish: While in
London we sought out this church. It had a huge metal plaque on
the front

indicating that it had been remodeled (renovated)......
in....1200AD!

We were impressed!)



Some of the Tipladys moved back the Beverly/Hull area where, in1830,
Frances married Robert Brown, a brick layer, (the census indicated that
only he had not been born this same County). Names of their children were:
Charles, Alfred, Maria, Emily, Edwin, Fredrick, Herbert, Jessie Elizabeth,
and Emma. (I consider children's names as "clues.") Somewhere between 1841
and 1850 the family left for the US. No more census records.



When I first started searching for the Tiplady name I found somewhere
in the York area that there was a connection with the occupation of
"weavers." Then I learned that weavers usually came from Belgium. Jochem
Heicke may be on to something with the suggestion of "t'Pladi" etc. This
seems quite reasonable. Also, I would like to think the portrait is of
Elizabeth Jessie Cook. If so, she was quite attractive and the painting
seems professional.



Again, thanks to you all. It seems that I will just have to follow
Goddard's suggestion and go back seeking out parish records and work
backward. Maybe I'll get lucky.



mjb



hnM@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:733b442b-6781-4c29-ab4e-ada37215d80f@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

On Nov 26, 9:57 am, "Mary Jane Battaglia" <mjb...@mindspring.com
wrote:
I apologize for getting off topic and time, but in view of your
members' expertise and resources, perhaps someone could enlighten me with
the meaning or history of the strange name of one of my ancestors:
Christopher TIPLADY.
He lived in Yorkshire and, at Sutton in Holderness in 1786, married
an Elizabeth Jessie Cook. I have a family artifact, a lovely painted
brooch with the portrait of a young woman of that time. The initials
"EJC" are etched on the bottom edge of the picture. What was the custom
of that time? Did the initials indicate the name of the person or the
painter?
mjb

The Yorkshire family name of Tiplady is said to be derived from the
town of Topcliffe in the North Riding. Variants are Topley, Tiplady,
Topler, Topliffe, Topcliff, Topclive, Toppley, Topleif, Toplief.

Regards,

John

-------------------------------
To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
GEN-MEDIEVAL-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the
quotes in the subject and the body of the message

John Watson

Re: Tiplady

Legg inn av John Watson » 27 nov 2007 09:30:05

On Nov 27, 2:49 pm, "Mary Jane Battaglia" <mjb...@mindspring.com>
wrote:
To all you kind Scholars who have responded to my query re "Tiplady:"

THANK YOU! Now my head is really spinning at all the possibilities.

Renias' comments re the innkeeper angle had occurred to me..especially
the current interpretation of "tippler", but that's just speculation right
now. And David Green's comments re "libertine" and Augustus M.Toplady
connections had been suggested to me but not taken seriously (ha). The
ancient use of the name "Johanna Tippelereday" as suggested by taf is now
filed away should I ever get back that far.

Renias' information re where and when the name is/was found should
prove helpful and will be studied.. Clues from my own research (Documented.
I actually saw the entries in the Beverly Parish book the birth of my great
grandmother, Maria and her twin, Emily in 1838) indicate that Christopher
and Elizabeth produced 8 children, the first three (William, Mary Ann and
Rebecca) were born in Beverly/Hull region while the rest (George Cook
Tiplady, John, Elizabeth, Ruth Ann, Joseph and Frances) were born in the
Stepney area, London where Christopher was a cordwainer. The youngest,
Frances, was my ancestor. She was baptized in her teens (1813) at St
Dunsten, Miles End, New Town.

(Please excuse, but a personal note we still cherish: While in
London we sought out this church. It had a huge metal plaque on
the front

indicating that it had been remodeled (renovated)......
in....1200AD!

We were impressed!)

Some of the Tipladys moved back the Beverly/Hull area where, in1830,
Frances married Robert Brown, a brick layer, (the census indicated that
only he had not been born this same County). Names of their children were:
Charles, Alfred, Maria, Emily, Edwin, Fredrick, Herbert, Jessie Elizabeth,
and Emma. (I consider children's names as "clues.") Somewhere between 1841
and 1850 the family left for the US. No more census records.

When I first started searching for the Tiplady name I found somewhere
in the York area that there was a connection with the occupation of
"weavers." Then I learned that weavers usually came from Belgium. Jochem
Heicke may be on to something with the suggestion of "t'Pladi" etc. This
seems quite reasonable. Also, I would like to think the portrait is of
Elizabeth Jessie Cook. If so, she was quite attractive and the painting
seems professional.

Again, thanks to you all. It seems that I will just have to follow
Goddard's suggestion and go back seeking out parish records and work
backward. Maybe I'll get lucky.

mjb

h...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:733b442b-6781-4c29-ab4e-ada37215d80f@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

On Nov 26, 9:57 am, "Mary Jane Battaglia" <mjb...@mindspring.com
wrote:
I apologize for getting off topic and time, but in view of your
members' expertise and resources, perhaps someone could enlighten me with
the meaning or history of the strange name of one of my ancestors:
Christopher TIPLADY.
He lived in Yorkshire and, at Sutton in Holderness in 1786, married
an Elizabeth Jessie Cook. I have a family artifact, a lovely painted
brooch with the portrait of a young woman of that time. The initials
"EJC" are etched on the bottom edge of the picture. What was the custom
of that time? Did the initials indicate the name of the person or the
painter?
mjb

The Yorkshire family name of Tiplady is said to be derived from the
town of Topcliffe in the North Riding. Variants are Topley, Tiplady,
Topler, Topliffe, Topcliff, Topclive, Toppley, Topleif, Toplief.

Regards,

John

-------------------------------
To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
GEN-MEDIEVAL-requ...@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the
quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Mary Jane,

Glad to be of assistance, although I have no idea if the Topcliffe
derivation of the Tiplady name is correct or not.

I have a few Tipladys in my tree, but from a bit further north than
yours around Hurworth on Tees. Your Tipladys seem to have originated
in the Holderness (Burton Pidsea, Withernwick, Welwick) area of the
East Riding from a quick look through IGI, but that's just a guess.

Regards,

John

Renia

Re: Tiplady

Legg inn av Renia » 27 nov 2007 11:09:03

Mary Jane Battaglia wrote:


When I first started searching for the Tiplady name I found
somewhere in the York area that there was a connection with the
occupation of "weavers." Then I learned that weavers usually came from
Belgium.

You are thinking of the 12/13th century Flemish* weavers. Weaving was a
hot industry in Yorkshire in the 18th century, until the building of
huge mills in Yorkshire and Lancashire, which displaced many thousands
of weavers and helped the surge towards emigration. The building of the
mills meant the end of the economic line for many weavers who worked at
home. They just couldn't compete with those Dark Satanic Mills.

http://www.leeds.gov.uk/armleymills/armdark.html

*Flanders comprised parts of what are now Belgium, France and The
Netherlands.

Renia

Re: Tiplady

Legg inn av Renia » 27 nov 2007 11:11:06

Mary Jane Battaglia wrote:

To all you kind Scholars who have responded to my query re "Tiplady:"


Again, thanks to you all. It seems that I will just have to follow
Goddard's suggestion and go back seeking out parish records and work
backward. Maybe I'll get lucky.

It's the only way, backwards from what you know to what you don't know.
How many of us have searched merrily backwards along one surname, just
to find that surname changed unexpectedly for any given number of reasons?

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 13:40:07

Hi, Gen-Medievalers :0

BA: The following website, which has been labeled suspect in its simplicity,

http://www.charlemagne.org/ui60.htm

without footnotes, offers us the descent of Charlemagne, for gateway
to American ancestors.

BA: Dipsh*t still has not shown something better as a true and certain
constructionist in the way of a website we can all consult, if such exists:
instead Dipsh*t picks sn*t
of/from his nose to consult and lint
of/from his infamous naval navel :0

Dipsh*t S. Hines scribbled on a lavatory wall: The chart does NOT show us
"the descent of Charlemagne". It shows us various alleged LINES of descent
FROM Charlemagne.

BA: Yawn: this is *what* I wake up to with my coffee? Another student
of gibberish teaching me how to *parse* sentences after 70-years of
dealing with the stuff: I even told all my students since I first met them
that I was born of a woman who was parsing crossword puzzles at my
conception! Now, an off-key member of the choir is preaching to The
Preacher. Will someone find him a room in the Tower of London with
some Bracelets of Iron?

BA: The preposition *of* can show association with its possessed noun:
and all gen-medievalers know the true *possessed* member in our midst
is Dipsh*t, himself, the maker of Pogues, whatever those *nouns* are in
the deranged mind of The Insipid One, as only himself guesses he knows!

BA: The preposition *of* means to "derive or come from" as well as
"originating at or from" or "caused by or resulting from" according to OED:
which The Insipid One most likely reads/thinks means *Ode* and I am sure
he'll try to write another insipid one to his readership: himself! I guess he
never heard of William of Orange or Robert Peck, the Elder, of Wakefield :)

Bill
PS can anyone name the best website for Descendants *of* Charlemagne,
or must we wait until The Lion speaks, and we will then have his
companion work to *Plantagenet Ancestry.*

*****



____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Bill Arnold

Re: A NOTE ON SCHOLARSHIP

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 14:12:03

HI, GEN-MEDIEVALERS :0

It took me awhile to figure out this website,
so now I can read my emails and check them
against:

http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/G ... =Redisplay

What you are looking at in the *clickable* is the full
redisplay with *names* of the senders and *dates* of the message
and in *reverse chronology* so that the top message is the latest
in the batch to gen-medieval. I am sure there are other lists
where our messages are displayed, but I do not intentionally
post there: if anyone wishes to send us a clickable so that
we can view posts that are cross-posted automatically, it would
be appreciated in the interest of scholarship.

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better sports nut! Let your teams follow you
with Yahoo Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9 ... QtBI7ntAcJ

Renia

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Renia » 27 nov 2007 14:24:33

Bill Arnold wrote:

Hi, Gen-Medievalers :0

BA: The following website, which has been labeled suspect in its simplicity,

http://www.charlemagne.org/ui60.htm

without footnotes, offers us the descent of Charlemagne, for gateway
to American ancestors.

BA: Dipsh*t still has not shown something better as a true and certain
constructionist in the way of a website we can all consult, if such exists:
instead Dipsh*t picks sn*t
of/from his nose to consult and lint
of/from his infamous naval navel :0

Dipsh*t S. Hines scribbled on a lavatory wall: The chart does NOT show us
"the descent of Charlemagne". It shows us various alleged LINES of descent
FROM Charlemagne.

BA: Yawn: this is *what* I wake up to with my coffee? Another student
of gibberish teaching me how to *parse* sentences after 70-years of
dealing with the stuff: I even told all my students since I first met them
that I was born of a woman who was parsing crossword puzzles at my
conception! Now, an off-key member of the choir is preaching to The
Preacher. Will someone find him a room in the Tower of London with
some Bracelets of Iron?

BA: The preposition *of* can show association with its possessed noun:
and all gen-medievalers know the true *possessed* member in our midst
is Dipsh*t, himself, the maker of Pogues, whatever those *nouns* are in
the deranged mind of The Insipid One, as only himself guesses he knows!

BA: The preposition *of* means to "derive or come from" as well as
"originating at or from" or "caused by or resulting from" according to OED:
which The Insipid One most likely reads/thinks means *Ode* and I am sure
he'll try to write another insipid one to his readership: himself! I guess he
never heard of William of Orange or Robert Peck, the Elder, of Wakefield :)

But the descent "of" Charlemagne would mean his own descent, that is,
Charlemagne's own ancestors, not his descendants. Either that, or it
means his descent down the stairs or down the shaky corridors of power.

If we want a descent from Charlemagne, then that's how we describe it -
a descent FROM Charlemagne.

On the other hand, descendants OF Charlemagne, as below, is probably
what you meant in the first place.


Bill
PS can anyone name the best website for Descendants *of* Charlemagne,
or must we wait until The Lion speaks, and we will then have his
companion work to *Plantagenet Ancestry.*

He's not a lion. He's a mere fallible human being like the rest of us
here. I believe Leo's site has a few Charlemagne descents, or you could
try Rootsweb Worldconnect, which is probably awash with them, not all of
them accurate.

Renia

Re: A NOTE ON SCHOLARSHIP

Legg inn av Renia » 27 nov 2007 14:26:14

Bill Arnold wrote:

HI, GEN-MEDIEVALERS :0

It took me awhile to figure out this website,
so now I can read my emails and check them
against:

http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/G ... =Redisplay

What you are looking at in the *clickable* is the full
redisplay with *names* of the senders and *dates* of the message
and in *reverse chronology* so that the top message is the latest
in the batch to gen-medieval. I am sure there are other lists
where our messages are displayed, but I do not intentionally
post there: if anyone wishes to send us a clickable so that
we can view posts that are cross-posted automatically, it would
be appreciated in the interest of scholarship.

http://groups.google.com/

Bill Arnold

Re: A NOTE ON SCHOLARSHIP

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 16:25:06

--- Renia <renia@DELETEotenet.gr> wrote:

Bill Arnold wrote:

HI, GEN-MEDIEVALERS :0

It took me awhile to figure out this website,
so now I can read my emails and check them
against:

http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/G ... =Redisplay

What you are looking at in the *clickable* is the full
redisplay with *names* of the senders and *dates* of the message
and in *reverse chronology* so that the top message is the latest
in the batch to gen-medieval. I am sure there are other lists
where our messages are displayed, but I do not intentionally
post there: if anyone wishes to send us a clickable so that
we can view posts that are cross-posted automatically, it would
be appreciated in the interest of scholarship.

http://groups.google.com/


BA: I found at google, soc.gen.brit and soc.gen.med and alt.talk.royalty, so I still
am curious how posts from us get there, or from there get here, and why they
arrive ten days late? Are my suspicions correct: it is a result of cross-posting?

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Renia

Re: A NOTE ON SCHOLARSHIP

Legg inn av Renia » 27 nov 2007 16:34:31

Bill Arnold wrote:
--- Renia <renia@DELETEotenet.gr> wrote:


Bill Arnold wrote:


HI, GEN-MEDIEVALERS :0

It took me awhile to figure out this website,
so now I can read my emails and check them
against:

http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/G ... =Redisplay

What you are looking at in the *clickable* is the full
redisplay with *names* of the senders and *dates* of the message
and in *reverse chronology* so that the top message is the latest
in the batch to gen-medieval. I am sure there are other lists
where our messages are displayed, but I do not intentionally
post there: if anyone wishes to send us a clickable so that
we can view posts that are cross-posted automatically, it would
be appreciated in the interest of scholarship.

http://groups.google.com/



BA: I found at google, soc.gen.brit and soc.gen.med and alt.talk.royalty, so I still
am curious how posts from us get there, or from there get here, and why they
arrive ten days late? Are my suspicions correct: it is a result of cross-posting?

Yes. The Gen-Medieval list is routed through the soc.genealogy.medieval
(sgm) newsgroup so the messages seen on gen-med are also seen on sgm.
Newsgroups, such as sgm, are read through your newsreader. For me, that
is the same as I use to read emails, in my case, Netscape.

Soc.genealogy.medieval is also available to read and search on Google
Groups (URL above). Whereas sgm messages arrive instantly to the
newsgroup (in most cases) the same messages don't appear on Google
Groups for quite a few hours. Don't know how gen-med works, but
presumably the posts are "gathered" and sent to you via your email
system once (or more?) a day.

Sending messages to newsgroups through newsreaders enables someone to
crosspost messages. I could crosspost this to soc.history.medieval if I
wanted to, but I don't want to.

I've never posted much through Google Groups (forgotten password and all
that and old email adress now dead) so I don't know if you can crosspost
from there as well.

Why posts arrive 10 days late, I can't say. I've not really seen it
before. Maybe it's something to do with your computer, but I don't know.
Perhaps Todd Farmerie (Taf) or Done Stone know? I think they're still
the listowners of gen-med.

Ian Goddard

Re: Tiplady

Legg inn av Ian Goddard » 27 nov 2007 16:37:11

Mary Jane Battaglia wrote:

Again, thanks to you all. It seems that I will just have to follow
Goddard's suggestion and go back seeking out parish records and work
backward. Maybe I'll get lucky.



Another resource is http://www.a2a.org.uk which is an index to many UK
archives. I tried looking for early Tipladys (or should that be
Tipladies) there without success. In passing I did find a couple for
Holderness in the C18th and that in the previous century a George
Tiplady was sentenced to be whipped through the streets of York for
stealing a sheep.


--
Ian

Hotmail is for spammers. Real mail address is igoddard
at nildram co uk

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 16:40:04

On Nov 27, 4:36 am, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:

PS can anyone name the best website for Descendants *of* Charlemagne,
or must we wait until The Lion speaks, and we will then have his
companion work to *Plantagenet Ancestry.*

Asking for the 'best website' is sort of like asking for the fastest
snail. Try Brandenburg's _Die Nachtommen Karls des Grossen_, which,
while dated, is both systematic and fully referenced. As to what The
Loin may produce, well, I have yet to see any demonstrated expertise
in the 10th century French material that would be key to interpreting
various problematic connections, so perhaps your hero worship is ill-
placed in this context.

taf

Bill Arnold

Re: A NOTE ON SCHOLARSHIP

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 16:52:04

Renia: Why posts arrive 10 days late, I can't say. I've not really seen it
before. Maybe it's something to do with your computer, but I don't know.
Perhaps Todd Farmerie (Taf) or Done Stone know? I think they're still
the listowners of gen-med.

BA: this morning as a test, I had my email open and the gen-medieval
archives open, and as soon as my email arrived back in my *inbox* within
a minute it also appeared at the top of the reverse-chronology gen-medieval
archives. So: that much is clear: no delay, instant at both addressess.
The message you received yesterday re: Leo's website I posted days
ago, and answered after Leo responded to it. So, I know it is *not*
my computer. I read all messages at Yahoo! anyway or on archives.
Apparently, it was bounced from another message board in a cross-post.
I see a lot of that skimming through the archives at soc.gen.med and
alt.talk.royalty. As an aside, The Insipid One has a *reputation* which
precedes him over there, and I guess beyond those two.

Bill
PS In Canada they have the *Loony* on their dollar, and I wonder who's
loony idea it was to call gen-medievalers "Pogue X" and "Pogue Y"?

*****




____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 16:58:04

BA: can anyone name the best website for Descendants *of* Charlemagne,
or must we wait until The Lion speaks, and we will then have his
companion work to *Plantagenet Ancestry.*

TAF: Asking for the 'best website' is sort of like asking for the fastest
snail. Try Brandenburg's _Die Nachtommen Karls des Grossen_, which,
while dated, is both systematic and fully referenced. As to what The
Loin [sic] may produce, well, I have yet to see any demonstrated expertise
in the 10th century French material that would be key to interpreting
various problematic connections, so perhaps your hero worship is ill-
conceived in this context.

BA: I take it, it's *not* in English? Perhaps, it has *no* American descendants?
As for your remarks about The Lion, I have heard it said since I was a kid-
in-knickers that "jealousy reeks among the lower classes" :0

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Gjest

Re: A NOTE ON SCHOLARSHIP

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 17:10:04

On Nov 27, 7:22 am, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
--- Renia <re...@DELETEotenet.gr> wrote:

http://groups.google.com/

BA: I found at google, soc.gen.brit and soc.gen.med and alt.talk.royalty, so I still
am curious how posts from us get there, or from there get here, and why they
arrive ten days late? Are my suspicions correct: it is a result of cross-posting?

You are mixing apples and oranges.

Posts to GEN-MEDIEVAL get to soc.gen.med (and vice versa) via the
gateway. This is not crossposting, which refers specifically to
multiple USENET groups (newsgroups). Anything addressed to GEN-MED
will go to soc.gen.med and nowhere else. How they get to, say,
alt.talk.royalty is that people send them there. They do this either
by adding the group to the distribution list for their post, or by
responding to a post that includes that list, without removing the
extraneous groups. (This is why the inane food thread has gone on so
long - none of the current posters are s.g.m people, they just can't
be bothered to remove s.g.m from the distribution list. This also
means that they won't see any posts made to GEN-MED, as they don't
read soc.gen.med, and that is the only place a GEN-MED message will
appear.) If a single post is sent to multiple newsgroups, that is
crossposting. This is almost always going to happen from soc.gen.med.
No post sent to GEN-MED will be crossposted unless you manually add a
Newsgroups: header and type in the other groups. Even responses to
GEN-MED posts that were originally crossposted will go only to GEN-
MED, because the GEN-MED server strips the newsgroup information
before sending out the posts.

As to taking ten days, this is probably a bit of an exageration, but
time delays are a quirk of the internet (or rather the cumulative
quirks). A post to GEN-MED has to be emailed to RootsWeb. While
usually email is virtually instantaneous, there are times when a
message can take hours or even days to arrive, usually due to a
problem with your own mail server. Likewise, sometimes Rootsweb has
problems processing messages. In such cases (a server failure, for
example) the messages are saved up until the problem is resolved, then
they are released. Once RootsWeb passes it through the gateway, it is
now on a news server, and they work by a different mechanism - while
email is directed, sending a message to a specific recipient, news
spreads virally, from computer to computer with no direction. When
two news servers 'meet' (in some cases systematically, in others more
randomly, as their systems happen to be contacting to pass emails, for
example) they simply compare the messages that they have on file and
copy any that they did not yet receive. Thus it can take time for the
news messages to propagate across the net, and there can be islands
that take days for the messages to permeate. Finally, to appear in
the Google Groups archive, the messages have to be stripped back out
of the newsgroup and placed into a web format. While this usually
happens within minutes, it can sometimes take hours or days (I have
had messages, submitted directly to Google, take 18 hrs to appear).

taf

Ian Goddard

Re: IGI SEARCH: WAS Tiplady

Legg inn av Ian Goddard » 27 nov 2007 17:13:15

Renia wrote:

When you see someone born, baptised or married "about", on that page,
then you know automatically, the entry has been made by an Latter Day
Saints (LDS) member who doesn't know when the event happened. These
sorts of entries can be highly unreliable.

Another bad sign is something like "Mrs John Smith". It means that John
Smith is named as the father (usually the entry of a baptism or burial
of an infant) but the mother wasn't. So someone helpfully assumes that
not only must there have been a Mrs John Smith but that she was born at
some guesstimated time earlier.

There are a few other oddities. I ran up against what was listed as the
baptism of wife of John Goddard as "Christiana" when her actual name
(they were my ggg grandparents) was Mary. In fact the curate had made a
number of entries on the lines of "Ch wife of xxxx" in the baptism
register including multiple ones for the same person. I concluded
(there was some discussion in soc.gen.britain) that this was recording
the rite known as Churching of women.

OTOH one sometimes wonders if an entry is based on some good information
other than the registers.

Click on the Source Call Number, and you can see what the source or
record is. If it is from a Parish Register (PR) or Bishop's Transcript
(BT), you are on safer ground. Usually, these Parish Registers are ones
already printed and available in libraries from which the IGI has
extracted the data.

One reason I added a degree of caution is that the coverage is erratic,
especially for the early period. Survival is one factor and
unwillingness of some dioceses or vicars to allow filming or
transcription is another. This can bias mapping. For instance the
C16th registers for Goddard in Yorkshire have entries for Almondbury and
Kirkburton parishes but not Emley although there are manorial records
for Goddards in Emley. It's simply that Emley registers only survive
back to the early C17th.

Nevertheless I think this geographical approach is a potent one and
there's scope for understanding how families spread before the
Industrial Revolution. For instance, looking at the Goddard name again
and including early C17th records there seems to me to be an association
with areas in which the FitzWilliams had an interest - were manorial
lords moving people, or at least encouraging movement, between their
manors. This approach is not genealogy sensu stricto but it can enable
those of us who can't identify medieval ancestors to understand
something of our origins.

--
Ian

Hotmail is for spammers. Real mail address is igoddard
at nildram co uk

Bill Arnold

Re: A NOTE ON SCHOLARSHIP

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 17:15:06

--- taf@clearwire.net wrote:

On Nov 27, 7:22 am, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
--- Renia <re...@DELETEotenet.gr> wrote:

http://groups.google.com/

BA: I found at google, soc.gen.brit and soc.gen.med and alt.talk.royalty, so I still
am curious how posts from us get there, or from there get here, and why they
arrive ten days late? Are my suspicions correct: it is a result of cross-posting?

You are mixing apples and oranges.

Posts to GEN-MEDIEVAL get to soc.gen.med (and vice versa) via the
gateway. This is not crossposting, which refers specifically to
multiple USENET groups (newsgroups). Anything addressed to GEN-MED
will go to soc.gen.med and nowhere else. How they get to, say,
alt.talk.royalty is that people send them there. They do this either
by adding the group to the distribution list for their post, or by
responding to a post that includes that list, without removing the
extraneous groups. (This is why the inane food thread has gone on so
long - none of the current posters are s.g.m people, they just can't
be bothered to remove s.g.m from the distribution list. This also
means that they won't see any posts made to GEN-MED, as they don't
read soc.gen.med, and that is the only place a GEN-MED message will
appear.) If a single post is sent to multiple newsgroups, that is
crossposting. This is almost always going to happen from soc.gen.med.
No post sent to GEN-MED will be crossposted unless you manually add a
Newsgroups: header and type in the other groups. Even responses to
GEN-MED posts that were originally crossposted will go only to GEN-
MED, because the GEN-MED server strips the newsgroup information
before sending out the posts.

As to taking ten days, this is probably a bit of an exageration, but
time delays are a quirk of the internet (or rather the cumulative
quirks). A post to GEN-MED has to be emailed to RootsWeb. While
usually email is virtually instantaneous, there are times when a
message can take hours or even days to arrive, usually due to a
problem with your own mail server. Likewise, sometimes Rootsweb has
problems processing messages. In such cases (a server failure, for
example) the messages are saved up until the problem is resolved, then
they are released. Once RootsWeb passes it through the gateway, it is
now on a news server, and they work by a different mechanism - while
email is directed, sending a message to a specific recipient, news
spreads virally, from computer to computer with no direction. When
two news servers 'meet' (in some cases systematically, in others more
randomly, as their systems happen to be contacting to pass emails, for
example) they simply compare the messages that they have on file and
copy any that they did not yet receive. Thus it can take time for the
news messages to propagate across the net, and there can be islands
that take days for the messages to permeate. Finally, to appear in
the Google Groups archive, the messages have to be stripped back out
of the newsgroup and placed into a web format. While this usually
happens within minutes, it can sometimes take hours or days (I have
had messages, submitted directly to Google, take 18 hrs to appear).

taf


BA: Hey, TAF, thanks for the thougtful response. I really appreciate it.

Bill

*****







____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Renia

Re: IGI SEARCH: WAS Tiplady

Legg inn av Renia » 27 nov 2007 17:28:53

Ian Goddard wrote:



Click on the Source Call Number, and you can see what the source or
record is. If it is from a Parish Register (PR) or Bishop's Transcript
(BT), you are on safer ground. Usually, these Parish Registers are
ones already printed and available in libraries from which the IGI has
extracted the data.


One reason I added a degree of caution is that the coverage is erratic,
especially for the early period. Survival is one factor and
unwillingness of some dioceses or vicars to allow filming or
transcription is another. This can bias mapping. For instance the
C16th registers for Goddard in Yorkshire have entries for Almondbury and
Kirkburton parishes but not Emley although there are manorial records
for Goddards in Emley. It's simply that Emley registers only survive
back to the early C17th.


I have transcribed some Parish Registers myself and noticed considerable
differences between the entries in the PRs and the entries in the
Bishops Transcripts. Sometimes the BTs give more info, sometimes quite
different info, other times, less info. Seems to depend on the mood of
the rector/clerk at the time he made his copies. I've also come across
several instances where the son's name has been transposed as the son's
on the PR, e.g. Thomas son of Thomas, where the father was really Peter.

The coverage of PRs is erratic because some PRs are not for the whole
period. For example, the printed PR for Thirsk only goes from 1557-1727.
After that, it's down to hard slog on the microfilm. Other printed PRs
cover the later period. Of course, many PRs have that nasty Commonwealth
Gap to deal with. Don't most of our ancestors just happen to have been
getting married and having babies during that period? Frustrating.

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 17:37:03

On Nov 27, 7:56 am, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
BA: can anyone name the best website for Descendants *of* Charlemagne,
or must we wait until The Lion speaks, and we will then have his
companion work to *Plantagenet Ancestry.*

TAF: Asking for the 'best website' is sort of like asking for the fastest
snail. Try Brandenburg's _Die Nachtommen Karls des Grossen_, which,
while dated, is both systematic and fully referenced. As to what The
Loin [sic] may produce, well, I have yet to see any demonstrated expertise
in the 10th century French material that would be key to interpreting
various problematic connections, so perhaps your hero worship is ill-
conceived in this context.

BA: I take it, it's *not* in English? Perhaps, it has *no* American descendants?
As for your remarks about The Lion, I have heard it said since I was a kid-
in-knickers that "jealousy reeks among the lower classes" :0

Brandenburg follows C's descendants for 14 generations. Even at that
point there are so many questionable connections that the process was
starting to look iffy.

What I said about The Loin was a fair analysis - his 'thing', in so
much as he has a 'thing', is dealing with English records in a mid-to-
late-medieval context, through to pre-colonial. You don't see him
posting on Anglo-Saxon connections, and you don't see him posting on,
say, relationships in 10th century Provence or Bavaria. This is part
of the reason there is no good source for what you want. It would take
a specialist in each geographical area, and whatever you might think
of The Loin's expertise for addressing Anglo-Norman and late-Medieval
English relationships, he has virtually none in these other regions,
nor do specialists in those areas have expertise in England. (. . .
and you are looking for it all on one web page) I am still trying to
figure out where your expertise lies, so at least I can have a target
for all of my pent up lower-class jealousy.

Finally as to the thought of you in knickers, that is one I didn't
need.

taf

D. Spencer Hines

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av D. Spencer Hines » 27 nov 2007 17:47:41

Correct.

The "English professor" has been hoist with his own petar.

DSH

"Renia" <renia@DELETEotenet.gr> wrote in message
news:fih5qa$hpc$1@mouse.otenet.gr...

But the descent "of" Charlemagne would mean his own descent, that is,
Charlemagne's own ancestors, not his descendants. Either that, or it means
his descent down the stairs or down the shaky corridors of power.

If we want a descent from Charlemagne, then that's how we describe it - a
descent FROM Charlemagne.

On the other hand, descendants OF Charlemagne, as below, is probably what
you meant in the first place.

D. Spencer Hines

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av D. Spencer Hines » 27 nov 2007 17:55:41

Douglas Richardson DOES reportedly have SIX children -- but referring to him
as "The Loin" is a bit over the top....

Pent-up Sexual Jealousy on taf's part?

DSH

Lux et Veritas et Libertas

<taf@clearwire.net> wrote in message
news:fd795276-fe8e-47b7-96ae-44318510e353@d4g2000prg.googlegroups.com...

What I said about The Loin was a fair analysis - his 'thing', in so
much as he has a 'thing', is dealing with English records in a mid-to-
late-medieval context, through to pre-colonial. You don't see him
posting on Anglo-Saxon connections, and you don't see him posting on,
say, relationships in 10th century Provence or Bavaria. This is part
of the reason there is no good source for what you want. It would take
a specialist in each geographical area, and whatever you might think
of The Loin's expertise for addressing Anglo-Norman and late-Medieval
English relationships, he has virtually none in these other regions,
nor do specialists in those areas have expertise in England. (. . .
and you are looking for it all on one web page) I am still trying to
figure out where your expertise lies, so at least I can have a target
for all of my pent up lower-class jealousy.

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 17:59:03

TAF: What I said about The Loin was a fair analysis - his 'thing', in so
much as he has a 'thing', is dealing with English records in a mid-to-
late-medieval context, through to pre-colonial. You don't see him
posting on Anglo-Saxon connections, and you don't see him posting on,
say, relationships in 10th century Provence or Bavaria. This is part
of the reason there is no good source for what you want. It would take
a specialist in each geographical area, and whatever you might think
of The Loin's expertise for addressing Anglo-Norman and late-Medieval
English relationships, he has virtually none in these other regions,
nor do specialists in those areas have expertise in England. (. . .
and you are looking for it all on one web page) I am still trying to
figure out where your expertise lies, so at least I can have a target
for all of my pent up lower-class jealousy.


BA: You are using *Loin* to refer to the *Lion* intentionally, I gather.
Why? Obviously, you understand that both Douglas Richardson and
Gary Boyd Roberts have *reputations* as authors which precede them.
You ought to show that respect. You may challenge their works or
their messages, but you ought to show reputations the respect they
deserve. As to my expertise, I have many things I have become good
at, just as I am sure you have, and I have the same question about
your background. But need I query it? No. I am on gen-medieval
for previously stated reasons. Go ahead: click the clickable:

http://www.emilydickinson.org/edis/scho ... holars.htm

Bill
PS the reference to "jealousy reeks among the lower classes" was
not about me, but addressed to those who are jealous of the
accomplishments of Douglas Richardson. Surely, you must have
a copy of the tome *Plantagenet Ancestry* on your library shelf?

Bill




____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Bill Arnold

Re: MIGRATION PATTERNS FROM DNA

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 18:00:06

--- taf@clearwire.net wrote:

On Nov 27, 8:26 am, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi, Gen-Medievalers :0

DNA, down the road will assist even gen-medieval work:


Bill, could you do us a favor. (This is a serious request, not a
criticism, and applies to everyone). If you wish to post on something
new, please draft a new message, rather than hitting reply to an
existing message on another topic. Threading is used by both USENET
(soc.gen.med) and the GEN-MED archives. This links related posts
together and lets you see who is responding to whom. When you respond
with something unrelated, even if you change the Subject: line of the
post, it is still recorded as being part of the same thread. Thus
this post on migratory patterns will be viewed and archived as part of
the discussion of the Order of Charlemagne, which will make it harder
to find, and defeats the whole purpose of threading to begin with.
Simply start a brand new message, and send it off to the same address.

taf


BA: Understood. Sorry, I had not understood.

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Gjest

Re: IGI SEARCH: WAS Tiplady

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 18:01:04

On Nov 27, 8:13 am, Ian Goddard <godda...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
Renia wrote:

When you see someone born, baptised or married "about", on that page,
then you know automatically, the entry has been made by an Latter Day
Saints (LDS) member who doesn't know when the event happened. These
sorts of entries can be highly unreliable.

Another bad sign is something like "Mrs John Smith". It means that John
Smith is named as the father (usually the entry of a baptism or burial
of an infant) but the mother wasn't. So someone helpfully assumes that
not only must there have been a Mrs John Smith but that she was born at
some guesstimated time earlier.

Part of this was an issue with the software. You couldn't enter a
child with just one parent, you had to establish a 'family' with a
'marriage' between a father and mother, and then add the children.
Likewise, a date (some date, any date) and place were absolutely
required, forcing such bad behavior.

taf

Renia

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Renia » 27 nov 2007 18:01:25

D. Spencer Hines wrote:

Douglas Richardson DOES reportedly have SIX children -- but referring to him
as "The Loin" is a bit over the top....

Pent-up Sexual Jealousy on taf's part?

It was Bill's nickname for him. I thought you read EVERY post?


DSH

Lux et Veritas et Libertas

taf@clearwire.net> wrote in message
news:fd795276-fe8e-47b7-96ae-44318510e353@d4g2000prg.googlegroups.com...


What I said about The Loin was a fair analysis - his 'thing', in so
much as he has a 'thing', is dealing with English records in a mid-to-
late-medieval context, through to pre-colonial. You don't see him
posting on Anglo-Saxon connections, and you don't see him posting on,
say, relationships in 10th century Provence or Bavaria. This is part
of the reason there is no good source for what you want. It would take
a specialist in each geographical area, and whatever you might think
of The Loin's expertise for addressing Anglo-Norman and late-Medieval
English relationships, he has virtually none in these other regions,
nor do specialists in those areas have expertise in England. (. . .
and you are looking for it all on one web page) I am still trying to
figure out where your expertise lies, so at least I can have a target
for all of my pent up lower-class jealousy.



Renia

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Renia » 27 nov 2007 18:02:06

Renia wrote:

D. Spencer Hines wrote:

Douglas Richardson DOES reportedly have SIX children -- but referring
to him as "The Loin" is a bit over the top....

Pent-up Sexual Jealousy on taf's part?


It was Bill's nickname for him. I thought you read EVERY post?


My mistake. No it wasn't.

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 18:26:06

On Nov 27, 8:56 am, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
TAF: What I said about The Loin was a fair analysis - his 'thing', in so

much as he has a 'thing', is dealing with English records in a mid-to-
late-medieval context, through to pre-colonial. You don't see him
posting on Anglo-Saxon connections, and you don't see him posting on,
say, relationships in 10th century Provence or Bavaria. This is part
of the reason there is no good source for what you want. It would take
a specialist in each geographical area, and whatever you might think
of The Loin's expertise for addressing Anglo-Norman and late-Medieval
English relationships, he has virtually none in these other regions,
nor do specialists in those areas have expertise in England. (. . .
and you are looking for it all on one web page) I am still trying to
figure out where your expertise lies, so at least I can have a target
for all of my pent up lower-class jealousy.

BA: You are using *Loin* to refer to the *Lion* intentionally, I gather.
Why?

To make the point that the use of any such ridiculous nicknames as
"The Lion" is childish and unhelpful. That being said, as long as you
continue to do so, you can hardly complain when others do.

Obviously, you understand that both Douglas Richardson and
Gary Boyd Roberts have *reputations* as authors which precede them.

1) Not all reputations are earned.

2) Not all reputations are good, or even uniform

3) What role does Mr. Roberts play in this discussion? I don't recall
questioning his conclusions, . . . or was he just thrown in to appear
another arbitrary victim?

You ought to show that respect. You may challenge their works or
their messages, but you ought to show reputations the respect they
deserve.

Reputations are inanimate, frequently ephemeral conceptions and not
due respect. You might find that the reputations of a lot of people
are mixed, and that it no more serves truth and respectful behavior to
lionize them as to condemn them. As to what they deserve, that opens
a whole can of worms. What does a person deserve who refutes a critic
by asking "Do you hate all men, or just those in a position of
authority". Respect goes both ways - if the critic should respect the
author, the author should respect the critic.

As to my expertise, I have many things I have become good
at, just as I am sure you have, and I have the same question about
your background. But need I query it? No.

Yet you have.


PS the reference to "jealousy reeks among the lower classes" was
not about me,

No kidding.

but addressed to those who are jealous of the
accomplishments of Douglas Richardson.

It is a fallacy to suggest that criticism of content must result from
jealousy - it sort of begs the question.

Surely, you must have
a copy of the tome *Plantagenet Ancestry* on your library shelf?

No, I have other financial priorities.

taf

taf

Ian Goddard

Re: IGI SEARCH: WAS Tiplady

Legg inn av Ian Goddard » 27 nov 2007 18:53:40

taf@clearwire.net wrote:
Part of this was an issue with the software. You couldn't enter a
child with just one parent, you had to establish a 'family' with a
'marriage' between a father and mother, and then add the children.
Likewise, a date (some date, any date) and place were absolutely
required, forcing such bad behavior.

taf

Thanks for that illumination. A prime example of the consequences of
making too many assumptions about the domain when writing S/W!

--
Ian

Hotmail is for spammers. Real mail address is igoddard
at nildram co uk

Douglas Richardson

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Douglas Richardson » 27 nov 2007 19:02:02

On Nov 27, 10:25 am, t...@clearwire.net wrote:

< 3) What role does Mr. Roberts play in this discussion? I don't
recall
< questioning his conclusions, . . . or was he just thrown in to
appear
< another arbitrary victim?

taf

Surely Mr. Farmerie jests. Whenever someone visits the library here
in Salt Lake City and they tell me the person that has helped them the
most, the person they always name is Gary Boyd Roberts.

Mr. Roberts is a giant in this generation. I've had the privilege of
knowing Gary personally for over thirty years. His knowledge is
simply encyclopedic. I always learn something from him. He and Mr.
MacEwen in Maine are in a league by themselves.

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 19:10:04

In a message dated 11/27/2007 5:25:10 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
renia@DELETEotenet.gr writes:

He's not a lion. He's a mere fallible human being like the rest of us
here. I believe Leo's site has a few Charlemagne descents, or you could
try Rootsweb Worldconnect, which is probably awash with them, not all of
them accurate.>>>


--------------------------

Allow me a slight correction here, by replacing "not all of them accurate"
with "the vast majority of them so inaccurate, you'll spend the remainder of
your life correcting or verifying them"

I.E. Worldconnect is a waste of time for descent from Charlemagne.

On my site I link various compilation genealogy sites which are much better.
Will



**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-produc ... 0000000001)

Gjest

Re: MIGRATION PATTERNS FROM DNA

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 19:18:10

In a message dated 11/27/2007 8:27:45 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
billarnoldfla@yahoo.com writes:

"If there were a large number of migrations, and most of the source groups
didn't have the
variant, then we would not see the widespread presence of the mutation in
the Americas," Noah
Rosenberg, a geneticist who worked on the study, was quoted as saying.>>>
------------------
Good now I can prove that I'm Indian and apply for all my back-pay.
I'll be rich!

Will





**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-produc ... 0000000001)

Gjest

Re: A NOTE ON SCHOLARSHIP

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 19:19:02

In a message dated 11/27/2007 7:51:44 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
billarnoldfla@yahoo.com writes:

The message you received yesterday re: Leo's website I posted days
ago, and answered after Leo responded to it. So, I know it is *not*
my computer. I read all messages at Yahoo! anyway or on archives.
Apparently, it was bounced from another message board in a cross-post.>>


-----------------------------
A "cross-post" to me, is a person who is deliberately adding multiple
entities to the "send" box.
The way that Gen-Med and soc.med are linked however is [supposed-to-be] an
automatic computer function of the Rootsweb servers. Not humans, computers.

They get behind, they crash, they lose their minds, or whatever. Much later
you get flooded with fifty emails in one day, when they catch up or get
rebooted or whatever their issue is.

Will Johnson



**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-produc ... 0000000001)

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 19:52:04

On Nov 27, 10:01 am, Douglas Richardson <royalances...@msn.com> wrote:
On Nov 27, 10:25 am, t...@clearwire.net wrote:

3) What role does Mr. Roberts play in this discussion? I don't
recall
questioning his conclusions, . . . or was he just thrown in to
appear
another arbitrary victim?

Surely Mr. Farmerie jests.

He does not - you are just reading into his post something which is
not there. Mr. Arnold threw Mr. Roberts into a discussion seemingly
at random, with the implication that others had failed to show him
proper respect, when no criticism had been directed his way. (Mr.
Richardson, you should stop beating your dog! To question where that
comment came from in no way questions the qualities of dogs. Get the
idea?)

taf

Gjest

Re: John Redman b.1620/23 d. 1673, need lineage from Raymond

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 20:46:02

In a message dated 11/27/2007 7:50:24 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
donmatson@hotmail.com writes:

I have a Redman genealogy>>


------------------------------------------------
Source?



**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-produc ... 0000000001)

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 20:47:04

TAF: What role does Mr. Roberts play in this discussion? I don't
recall questioning his conclusions, . . . or was he just thrown in to
appear another arbitrary victim?

Douglas Richardson: Surely Mr. Farmerie jests.

TAF: He does not - you are just reading into his post something which is
not there. Mr. Arnold threw Mr. Roberts into a discussion seemingly
at random, with the implication that others had failed to show him
proper respect, when no criticism had been directed his way. (Mr.
Richardson, you should stop beating your dog! To question where that
comment came from in no way questions the qualities of dogs. Get the
idea?)

BA: I will speak for myself. In several posts to this list, I have stated
that Douglas Richardson in his book *Plantagenet Ancestry* thanks
Gary Boyd Roberts, John Ravilious and Renia Simonds. In my posts
I noted that before I came to gen-medieval I knew *The Lions* Douglas
Richardson and Gary Boyd Roberts. In literature: when someone is a
well-known and respected author, they are known as *Lions.* I had
also jested that on this list many members are mere wilderbeasts
attacking a lion. That is *not* as mixed metaphor, but a well understand
metaphor. Wilderbeasts usually go the other way when confronted by
a lion. Thus: I did *not* throw Gary Boyd Roberts into the discussion
willy-nilly. I have also written that Gary Boyd Roberts was a gentleman
and a scholar in his communication with me on the telephone. Not
knowing me, he could have easily ignored me. But he was polite
and granted my query about royal descents ample response. I have
found that both these gentlemen and scholars have books and
reputations which precede them. How many times must I remind
this list that *reputations* of authors are earned, and both these
gentlemen have *earned* their sterling reputations as world-class
genealogists well-published and recognized in the field for their
work. As such, they are literary lions and those are not nicknames
but a standard accolade known in literary circles. If my posts are
search in the *text* for these names, it will be readily apparent
that that is what I have meant and I stand by my previous posts
and this one as well.

Bill

*****









____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Douglas Richardson

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Douglas Richardson » 27 nov 2007 20:53:02

On Nov 27, 11:51 am, t...@clearwire.net wrote:

< Mr. Richardson, you should stop beating your dog!
<
< taf

Um ... I don't own a dog.

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 22:10:05

On Nov 27, 11:45 am, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
How many times must I remind
this list that *reputations* of authors are earned,

Umm, I just said that.

and both these
gentlemen have *earned* their sterling reputations as world-class
genealogists well-published and recognized in the field for their
work.

Leaving the irrelevant one out, the reputation the other has *earned*
is a mixed one. There are experts in the field (people who have no
reason for jealousy) who do not hold your opinion. Given that you
admit to being a newcomer, it is understandable that you only have
experience with one side of the coin. Look, I really did not enter
into this with the purpose of smearing someone, but you can't just
declare someone to have an unimpeachable reputation and have that be
fact.

As such, they are literary lions and those are not nicknames
but a standard accolade known in literary circles.

1) this is not a literary circle.

2) even in a literary circle, I highly doubt you would simply say "The
Lion did (this)" or "The Lion did (that)", unless it was so small a
circle as to be a line or a triangle (a closed groups with cute little
nicknames for all kinds of people).

taf

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 22:49:02

BA: As such, they are literary lions and those are not nicknames
but a standard accolade known in literary circles.

TAF: this is not a literary circle.

BA: If there are authors on board, then it is a literary circle. The literature might
be historical, non-fiction, but it is still literary.

Thus: a well-known author is a *Lion* and in his literary circle, it is appropriate
to refer to him as *The Lion.*

Bill

*****

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literature

literary
Dictionary

lit·er·ar·y (lĭt'ə-rĕr'ē)
adj.
Of, relating to, or dealing with literature: literary criticism.
Of or relating to writers or the profession of literature: literary circles.
Versed in or fond of literature or learning.
Appropriate to literature rather than everyday speech or writing.
Bookish; pedantic.
[Latin litterārius, of reading and writing, from littera, lītera, letter. See letter.]

http://surfandestroy.blogspot.com/2007/ ... -dies.html

Definitions
lion
noun
2. The male of this species, as opposed to the female.
3. Someone who is brave.
4. Someone who is the centre of public attention.
5a. astron.
The constellation of Leo;
Form: the Lion
5b. astrol.
The sign of the zodiac, Leo.
Form: the Lion
Idiom: the lion's share
The largest share.
Idiom: put one's head in the lion's mouth
To put oneself in a dangerous position. See leonine, lioness.
Etymology: 13c: from French luin, direct from Latin leo.

lioness
noun lionesses
1. A female lion.
2. A brave or celebrated woman.

lion-heart
noun
1. Someone who is very brave.
Derivative: lion-hearted
adj
Very brave or tenacious.
Thesaurus: brave, courageous, heroic, intrepid, valiant, bold, dauntless, daring; Antonym:
fearful, timid.

lionize
lionise
verb
lionized, lionizing
1. To treat someone as a celebrity or hero.
Thesaurus: praise, acclaim, honour, celebrate, idolize, adulate, eulogize, exalt, worship.

Content Under License from Crystal Reference, copyright 2003.

Copyright 1998-2007 AllSites LLC. All rights reserved.












____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Bill Arnold

Re: Mysteries of the E-mail world

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 22:55:06

--- Leo van de Pas <leovdpas@netspeed.com.au> wrote:

Not so long ago (half an hour?) I sent the e-mail about Charlemagne and his descendants. I have
not received it as yet, but I have already received five responses so far.

BA: Leo, I already have it, and you can see it was posted to gen-medieval at:

http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/G ... =Redisplay

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better sports nut! Let your teams follow you
with Yahoo Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9 ... QtBI7ntAcJ

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 22:57:02

On Nov 27, 1:46 pm, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
BA: As such, they are literary lions and those are not nicknames
but a standard accolade known in literary circles.

TAF: this is not a literary circle.

BA: If there are authors on board, then it is a literary circle. The literature might
be historical, non-fiction, but it is still literary.

So an NFL game is a literary circle if their are authors present?


Thus: a well-known author is a *Lion* and in his literary circle, it is appropriate
to refer to him as *The Lion.*

Except it isn't *his* circle, and he has no more right to this title
than the several other "authors" who participate. In fact, you are
doing it to express preference - to compare him to all of the lonely
people in the cheap seats, which says more about your novice
understanding of the dynamic than of "The Loins" role in this group.

taf

wjhonson

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av wjhonson » 27 nov 2007 22:58:02

On the Walter Aston line, I happened to just stumble across the entry
in the Vis London which is on Google Books here
http://books.google.com/books?id=xDIEAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA29
Vis London, 1633, 4, 5, "Aston"

for you all to remember what it says.

Of all the names given the oddest one is perhaps Simon Aston, so he
might be the easiest one to search. I tried various things in A2A
getting nothing useful. I did note the oddity of "Nason" connected to
"Rougham" I wonder if this has been verified?

At any rate, does anyone have details on the life of Simon Aston, the
brother of Walter Aston who is said-by-some to have gone to Virginia.

Thanks
Will Johnson

Renia

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Renia » 27 nov 2007 23:02:01

Bill Arnold wrote:

BA: As such, they are literary lions and those are not nicknames
but a standard accolade known in literary circles.

TAF: this is not a literary circle.

BA: If there are authors on board, then it is a literary circle. The literature might
be historical, non-fiction, but it is still literary.

Thus: a well-known author is a *Lion* and in his literary circle, it is appropriate
to refer to him as *The Lion.*

I think few here would see this as a literary circle.

It's a history circle, specialising in medieval genealogy. This is a
researchers newsgroup, not a writer's newsgroup. The writers publish
elsewhere.

Otherwise you might as well say DSH's other newsgroup,
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.interracial is a literary circle, because
that doubtless has "authors on board".

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 27 nov 2007 23:25:05

Dear Bill,
Todd has written a number of articles on and off his and
Don Stone`s list (this one) perhaps even predating "The Lion" They have been
very informative particularly in the Medieval Spanish Connections. A bit bad
mannered to call one of your hosts low class, Don`t You think ?
Sincerely,
James W Cummings
Dixmont, Maine USA



**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-produc ... 0000000001)

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 27 nov 2007 23:56:02

Renia: I think few here would see this as a literary circle. It's a
history circle, specialising in medieval genealogy. This is a
researchers newsgroup, not a writer's newsgroup. The writers
publish elsewhere.

BA: I stand by the standard categories of *literature* to classify
genealogy among the literary genres: history, and indeed we are
all writers writing about history. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literature

Bill

*****



____________________________________________________________________________________
Get easy, one-click access to your favorites.
Make Yahoo! your homepage.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 nov 2007 02:40:03

On Nov 27, 2:50 pm, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
Renia: I think few here would see this as a literary circle. It's a
history circle, specialising in medieval genealogy. This is a
researchers newsgroup, not a writer's newsgroup. The writers
publish elsewhere.

BA: I stand by the standard categories of *literature* to classify
genealogy among the literary genres: history, and indeed we are
all writers writing about history. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literature


you can certainly use definitions that would justify calling what we
do here literature, but in so doing, you strain the word to the point
that it loses meaning - it makes every group a writers' group, and
thereby being a writers' group is synonymous with being a group, and
it holds no distinction.

As a general rule, internet newsgroups do not have a habit of
referring to a specific member as The Lion, except perhaps in
derision.

taf

Gjest

Re: MIGRATION PATTERNS FROM DNA

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 nov 2007 03:00:03

On Nov 27, 10:15 am, WJhon...@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 11/27/2007 8:27:45 A.M. Pacific Standard > Good now I can prove that I'm Indian and apply for all my back-pay.
I'll be rich!

When you find out about that "backpay", let me know. I sure never got
any & I'm 5/7 Indian. I'm; always hearing about this mystery money
we're supposed to have - funny thing is that it's always people who
know nothing about it who talk about it the most and who believe that
folks get money just for being Indian. If you know where I can get
some, let me know. Money's tight these days.

Nathaniel Taylor

Re: MIGRATION PATTERNS FROM DNA

Legg inn av Nathaniel Taylor » 28 nov 2007 03:03:25

In article
<0fc9e4ff-92eb-49f8-b294-24eeed043762@e25g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
lostcooper@yahoo.com wrote:

. . . I'm 5/7 Indian. . .

Interesting denominator, genealogically speaking. Any parthenogenesis /
immaculate conception among your great-grandparents?

Nat Taylor
http://www.nltaylor.net

Denis Beauregard

Re: MIGRATION PATTERNS FROM DNA

Legg inn av Denis Beauregard » 28 nov 2007 04:46:06

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 21:03:25 -0500, Nathaniel Taylor
<nltaylor@nltaylor.net> wrote in soc.genealogy.medieval:

In article
0fc9e4ff-92eb-49f8-b294-24eeed043762@e2 ... groups.com>,
lostcooper@yahoo.com wrote:

. . . I'm 5/7 Indian. . .

Interesting denominator, genealogically speaking. Any parthenogenesis /
immaculate conception among your great-grandparents?

Perhaps, instead of 8 different great-grand-parents, he has only 7.
A bit less harmfull than a cousin's marriage. Nonetheless, if this
is the case, I would merely duplicate the double gg-parent to say
5/8 or 6/8 Indian.

As for the payback money, I think one rule is to live in the
reservation. And the other rules are surely not related to
that medieval newsgroup ;-)

I am myself something like 1/256 Native.


Denis

--
0 Denis Beauregard -
/\/ Les Français d'Amérique du Nord - http://www.francogene.com/genealogie--quebec/
|\ French in North America before 1722 - http://www.francogene.com/quebec--genealogy/
/ | Maintenant sur cédérom, début à 1770 (Version 2008)
oo oo Now on CD-ROM, beginnings to 1770 (2008 Release)

Bill Arnold

Re: Fw: The Lion of SGM

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 05:17:03

Leo van de Pas <leovdpas@netspeed.com.au> wrote:
Dear Leo, I don't know why anyone would object to Douglas Richardson being called the Lion of the
newsgroup, this seems quite apposite to me. Lions in the wild are often aimless, mangy, injured
creatures expelled from their own prides, and those few that are accepted by females tend to
wander around putting their stink over every rock and bush in a limited range, sniffing out &
eating each other's young while their mothers are off hunting, and lasting only a breeding
season or two before a stronger rival comes along. Not unlike the big smelly, lazy genealogical
cat from SLC in many ways. Somehow, I do not think this is what Bill Arnold had in mind.
With best wishes
Leo van de Pas

BA: As I noted in my post on *libel* it is the public figure, such as Norman Mailer, "The Lion,"
among a different circle of literary beasts, who had an interesting life with an interesting wife,
a story which makes your hair curl. But his life was public, and summered in my ancestral Ptown.
One wonders if Leo van de Pas knows his laws and his rights and the rights of others? Perhaps
other members of other *Prides* are not public figures, and seek their privacy while still being
"The Lion" in a different circle of literary beasts. As a journalist, known for "Trust me on
this,"
I invoke: Only Time and <G> knows!

Bill
"Thoth"
The Pride Scribe

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 05:20:04

Renia: I think few here would see this as a literary circle. It's a
history circle, specialising in medieval genealogy. This is a
researchers newsgroup, not a writer's newsgroup. The writers
publish elsewhere.

BA: I stand by the standard categories of *literature* to classify
genealogy among the literary genres: history, and indeed we are
all writers writing about history. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literature

TAF: you can certainly use definitions that would justify calling what we
do here literature, but in so doing, you strain the word to the point
that it loses meaning - it makes every group a writers' group, and
thereby being a writers' group is synonymous with being a group, and
it holds no distinction. As a general rule, internet newsgroups do not have
a habit of referring to a specific member as The Lion, except perhaps in
derision.

BA: No, I cannot agree that I "strain the word to the point that it loses meaning
--it makes every group a writers' group...." If you had written "it makes every
writers' group a writers' group," then you would have been accurate to the
general definition as witnessed at wikipedia, and elsewhere. It is a fraud to
drop the adjective "writers'" from our group! That is what we are, and therefore
with history as our focus, albeit genealogical, we are a literary circle of genealogical
writers.

Bill
"Thoth"
Pride Scribe

*****





____________________________________________________________________________________
Get easy, one-click access to your favorites.
Make Yahoo! your homepage.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

D. Spencer Hines

Re: MIGRATION PATTERNS FROM DNA

Legg inn av D. Spencer Hines » 28 nov 2007 06:40:06

Yes, that may well be what he means.

And I may be 1/32nd -- Cherokee.

And proud of it.

DSH

"Denis Beauregard" <denis.b-at-francogene.com@fr.invalid> wrote in message
news:4sopk395du4imie5il365fa5rdtih09j17@4ax.com...

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 21:03:25 -0500, Nathaniel Taylor
nltaylor@nltaylor.net> wrote in soc.genealogy.medieval:

In article
0fc9e4ff-92eb-49f8-b294-24eeed043762@e2 ... groups.com>,
lostcooper@yahoo.com wrote:

. . . I'm 5/7 Indian. . .

Interesting denominator, genealogically speaking. Any parthenogenesis /
immaculate conception among your great-grandparents?

Perhaps, instead of 8 different great-grand-parents, he has only 7.
A bit less harmfull than a cousin's marriage. Nonetheless, if this
is the case, I would merely duplicate the double gg-parent to say
5/8 or 6/8 Indian.

As for the payback money, I think one rule is to live in the
reservation. And the other rules are surely not related to
that medieval newsgroup ;-)

I am myself something like 1/256 Native.


Denis

--
0 Denis Beauregard -
/\/ Les Français d'Amérique du Nord -
http://www.francogene.com/genealogie--quebec/
|\ French in North America before 1722 -
http://www.francogene.com/quebec--genealogy/
/ | Maintenant sur cédérom, début à 1770 (Version 2008)
oo oo Now on CD-ROM, beginnings to 1770 (2008 Release)

Gjest

Re: MIGRATION PATTERNS FROM DNA

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 nov 2007 07:23:02

On Nov 27, 6:03 pm, Nathaniel Taylor <nltay...@nltaylor.net> wrote:
In article
0fc9e4ff-92eb-49f8-b294-24eeed043...@e2 ... groups.com>,

lostcoo...@yahoo.com wrote:
. . . I'm 5/7 Indian. . .

Interesting denominator, genealogically speaking. Any parthenogenesis /
immaculate conception among your great-grandparents?

Nat Taylorhttp://www.nltaylor.net

Just adding up fractions. Oh yes, I flunked math four times. So I went
into anthropology.

Gjest

Re: MIGRATION PATTERNS FROM DNA

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 nov 2007 07:32:02

On Nov 27, 7:46 pm, Denis Beauregard <denis.b-at-> As for the payback
money, I think one rule is to live in the
reservation.


No. The only rule that counts is that you have to be enrolled in a
tribe with which the U.S. Congress has a treaty-based relationship
(i.e., federal recognition). The U.S. can't & doesn't say who is or is
not Indian, but they do decide which indigenous governments have a
history of treating with them. The "payments" made to enrolled members
of federally recognized tribes are not because of racial identity;
they are because of a history of government-to-government relations
that features war, conquest & agreements made in treaties for payments
as well as for concessions. Where an enrolled member of a federally
recognized tribe lives is irrelevant. Reservation residents may
receive nothing while urbanites may receive annual payments. All
depends on what the treaty says & whether or not the feds abide by it.
(Also, reservations are reserved BY indigenous governments after
ceding the remainder of their homeland; they are not lands given to
Indians by the U.S. This is stating the status with a sense of
political purity that has rarely entered into real life, but
nonetheless, that is how it is supposed to be. )

Tim Cartmell

Re: Pennington & Longvillers ancestry of Huddleston of Millo

Legg inn av Tim Cartmell » 28 nov 2007 11:23:03

Dear John P. Ravilious,

There has been some speculation regarding this John de Pennington as marrying Joan de Multon of Egremont. I posed the question to SGM back in 2004, see attached weblink.

http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/ge ... 1088869978

Have you discovered anything further that may indicate a marriage connection between the Pennington and Multon families?

Thanks,

Timothy J. Cartmell



---------------------------------
Ask a question on any topic and get answers from real people. Go to Yahoo! Answers.

Bill Arnold

Re: MIGRATION PATTERNS FROM DNA

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 13:31:03

DSH: Yes, that may well be what he means.
And I may be 1/32nd -- Cherokee.
And proud of it.

BA: But of course, everybody in the south who traces their personal
ancestry back to Colonial Days has a great-great-great-grandmother
who was captured by white traders and she was a full-blood Cherokee,
and this you can *see* because the testator of this unproven information
has high cheekbones. OK: O Insipid One, as you so often rant: PROVE IT!
SOURCES! BIRTH RECORDS, DEATH RECORDS, MARRIAGE RECORDS!!!

Bill

*****



____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Bill Arnold

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 16:16:03

--- John Brandon <starbuck95@hotmail.com> wrote:

Corrections (i.e., replace with ...):

609. Anne (----) Hutchinson [304/1218], b. ca. 1595 d. 4 Dec. 1669
Lynn, Massachusetts [widow of --- Hutchinson, by whom she had several
children]

688. Henry Cobb [344/1376], b. --- d. between 22 Feb 1678/9-3 Jun
1679 Barnstable, Massachusetts; m. (1) Patience Hirst; m. (2) 12 Dec.
1649 Barnstable, Massachusetts

689. Sarah Hinckley [344/1378], b. ca. 1629 Tenterden, Kent; d. ---


BA: No doubt, this multi-generation pedigree comes from hard work.
But I am very surprised that no one on gen-medieval, particularly Will
Johnson, who prides himself as a professional genealogist, has let this
series of posts fly by with seeking sources of the author?

Bill

*****



____________________________________________________________________________________
Get easy, one-click access to your favorites.
Make Yahoo! your homepage.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

John Brandon

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av John Brandon » 28 nov 2007 16:35:04

BA: No doubt, this multi-generation pedigree comes from hard work.
But I am very surprised that no one on gen-medieval, particularly Will
Johnson, who prides himself as a professional genealogist, has let this
series of posts fly by with seeking sources of the author?

Bill

"Trust me on this," to quote a certain senile old fool.

No ... but seriously ... there are some great benefits to being
shunned and totally ignored. :-)

A few folks have responded in private, notably Martin Hollick, who
sent me a scan of Gilbert Titcomb's 1991 TAG article on John Tukey of
Falmouth/ Portland, ME, which helped to prove the connection of Mary
Scott Cobb to her parents (Ebenezer and Sarah Woodward Scott) and
grandparents (Smith and Thankful Pope Woodward).

Titcomb did not mention, however, the existence of Ebenezer and Mary
(Scott) Cobb or of their son Smith Woodward Cobb.

There was also a man named Ebenzer Scott Thomes floating around in
Maine at nearly this period, which might also support the claim. My
ancestress Abigail (Cobb) (Thomes) Noyes was married first to a Thomas
Thomes. I wonder if he was her cousin, perhaps a son of a Mr. Thomes
who married Anna or Sarah, another of the daughters of Ebenezer Scott,
by wife Sarah Woodward? Merely speculating here ...

Bill Arnold

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 16:51:03

--- John Brandon <starbuck95@hotmail.com> wrote:

BA: No doubt, this multi-generation pedigree comes from hard work.
But I am very surprised that no one on gen-medieval, particularly Will
Johnson, who prides himself as a professional genealogist, has let this
series of posts fly by with seeking sources of the author?

Bill

"Trust me on this," to quote a certain senile old fool.

No ... but seriously ... there are some great benefits to being
shunned and totally ignored. :-)

A few folks have responded in private, notably Martin Hollick, who
sent me a scan of Gilbert Titcomb's 1991 TAG article on John Tukey of
Falmouth/ Portland, ME, which helped to prove the connection of Mary
Scott Cobb to her parents (Ebenezer and Sarah Woodward Scott) and
grandparents (Smith and Thankful Pope Woodward).

Titcomb did not mention, however, the existence of Ebenezer and Mary
(Scott) Cobb or of their son Smith Woodward Cobb.

There was also a man named Ebenzer Scott Thomes floating around in
Maine at nearly this period, which might also support the claim. My
ancestress Abigail (Cobb) (Thomes) Noyes was married first to a Thomas
Thomes. I wonder if he was her cousin, perhaps a son of a Mr. Thomes
who married Anna or Sarah, another of the daughters of Ebenezer Scott,
by wife Sarah Woodward? Merely speculating here ...


BA: Well, to be blunt, as another senile ole fool wrote, no...just kidding:
I am doing my NE ancestors 11 generations before Joseph Peck, who if
you were not kidding about that, we share. I did not see any sources,
and found that significant. Care to share?

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

John Brandon

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av John Brandon » 28 nov 2007 16:56:02

BA: Well, to be blunt, as another senile ole fool wrote, no...just kidding:
I am doing my NE ancestors 11 generations before Joseph Peck, who if
you were not kidding about that, we share. I did not see any sources,
and found that significant. Care to share?

Bill

No. Now bugger off, please.

Renia

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Renia » 28 nov 2007 17:14:34

Bill Arnold wrote:

--- John Brandon <starbuck95@hotmail.com> wrote:


Corrections (i.e., replace with ...):

609. Anne (----) Hutchinson [304/1218], b. ca. 1595 d. 4 Dec. 1669
Lynn, Massachusetts [widow of --- Hutchinson, by whom she had several
children]

688. Henry Cobb [344/1376], b. --- d. between 22 Feb 1678/9-3 Jun
1679 Barnstable, Massachusetts; m. (1) Patience Hirst; m. (2) 12 Dec.
1649 Barnstable, Massachusetts

689. Sarah Hinckley [344/1378], b. ca. 1629 Tenterden, Kent; d. ---



BA: No doubt, this multi-generation pedigree comes from hard work.
But I am very surprised that no one on gen-medieval, particularly Will
Johnson, who prides himself as a professional genealogist, has let this
series of posts fly by with seeking sources of the author?

Not everyone has an interest in these people. Where there is no
interest, there is no response, though as John has stated, people will
write privately and get that information, if they want it.

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 nov 2007 17:15:05

On Nov 27, 7:37 pm, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
TAF: you can certainly use definitions that would justify calling what we
do here literature, but in so doing, you strain the word to the point
that it loses meaning - it makes every group a writers' group, and
thereby being a writers' group is synonymous with being a group, and
it holds no distinction.

BA: No, I cannot agree that I "strain the word to the point that it loses meaning
--it makes every group a writers' group...." If you had written "it makes every
writers' group a writers' group," then you would have been accurate to the
general definition as witnessed at wikipedia, and elsewhere. It is a fraud to
drop the adjective "writers'" from our group!

No, it is not fraud, but I keep forgetting you have your own unique
definitions of things.

That is what we are, and therefore
with history as our focus, albeit genealogical, we are a literary circle of genealogical
writers.

What rubbish. This is no more a writers' group than an after-work
drinking session at the pub is a 'public speaking forum' Yes, they
are in public, and when they communicate it is by speaking, but that
doesn't make it a public speaking forum.

One central flaw is that you define genealogy as literature to begin
with, but it is not. Yes, one can write about genealogy, and that
writing can be described as literature (using one of the more loose
definitions of the word) but that doesn't make all genealogists
writers, any more than the fact that you can write about fishing makes
all fishermen writers.

taf

Renia

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Renia » 28 nov 2007 17:58:59

Bill Arnold wrote:

Renia: I think few here would see this as a literary circle. It's a
history circle, specialising in medieval genealogy. This is a
researchers newsgroup, not a writer's newsgroup. The writers
publish elsewhere.

BA: I stand by the standard categories of *literature* to classify
genealogy among the literary genres: history, and indeed we are
all writers writing about history. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literature

TAF: you can certainly use definitions that would justify calling what we
do here literature, but in so doing, you strain the word to the point
that it loses meaning - it makes every group a writers' group, and
thereby being a writers' group is synonymous with being a group, and
it holds no distinction. As a general rule, internet newsgroups do not have
a habit of referring to a specific member as The Lion, except perhaps in
derision.

BA: No, I cannot agree that I "strain the word to the point that it loses meaning
--it makes every group a writers' group...." If you had written "it makes every
writers' group a writers' group," then you would have been accurate to the
general definition as witnessed at wikipedia, and elsewhere. It is a fraud to
drop the adjective "writers'" from our group! That is what we are, and therefore
with history as our focus, albeit genealogical, we are a literary circle of genealogical
writers.

Bill
"Thoth"
Pride Scribe

Rubbish.

D. Spencer Hines

Re: Richard Cecil

Legg inn av D. Spencer Hines » 28 nov 2007 19:09:36

Thanks.

DSH

<WJhonson@aol.com> wrote in message
news:mailman.43.1196273011.13616.gen-medieval@rootsweb.com...

Yes I think I wrote the majority of that Wikipedia article. I can't
quite recall. You can click on the History tab at the top to see
who all contributed.

Will

Gjest

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 nov 2007 19:13:03

In a message dated 11/28/2007 7:12:26 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
billarnoldfla@yahoo.com writes:

BA: No doubt, this multi-generation pedigree comes from hard work.
But I am very surprised that no one on gen-medieval, particularly Will
Johnson, who prides himself as a professional genealogist, has let this
series of posts fly by with seeking sources of the author?


-----------------
Contrary to the opinion of some, I don't challenge every post :)

I checked a few dozen of these names but didn't find them already in my
database. For the most part, I chart descendents of Richard Cecil, plus all the
families interconnected with them, but only covering the Tudor and Jacobean
period.

Then I also *try* to chart all the ancestors of all those people. So that's
a full-time job right there.

I don't really get into the Colonists unless they are somehow related to the
above. With sources.

Will Johnson



**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-produc ... 0000000001)

Gjest

Re: Richard Cecil

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 nov 2007 19:14:04

Yes I think I wrote the majority of that Wikipedia article. I can't quite
recall. You can click on the History tab at the top to see who all
contributed.

Will



**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-produc ... 0000000001)

Gjest

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 nov 2007 19:15:04

In a message dated 11/28/2007 7:47:55 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
billarnoldfla@yahoo.com writes:

BA: Well, to be blunt, as another senile ole fool wrote, no...just kidding:
I am doing my NE ancestors 11 generations before Joseph Peck, who if
you were not kidding about that, we share. I did not see any sources,
and found that significant. Care to share?>>>


---------------------------
What about your Arnold ancestors?



**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-produc ... 0000000001)

John Brandon

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av John Brandon » 28 nov 2007 19:16:03

I checked a few dozen of these names but didn't find them already in my
database. For the most part, I chart descendents of Richard Cecil, plus all the
families interconnected with them, but only covering the Tudor and Jacobean
period.

No Cecil descents here, so you're off the hook young William.

Gjest

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 nov 2007 19:35:06

On Nov 28, 7:11 am, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:

BA: No doubt, this multi-generation pedigree comes from hard work.
But I am very surprised that no one on gen-medieval, particularly Will
Johnson, who prides himself as a professional genealogist, has let this
series of posts fly by with seeking sources of the author?


Perhaps you didn't notice - none of the individuals named and numbered
are actually Medieval. That is likely to negatively impact the degree
of participation of people who have collected here due to a shared
interest in medieval genealogy.

taf

John Brandon

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av John Brandon » 28 nov 2007 21:22:47

Perhaps you didn't notice - none of the individuals named and numbered
are actually Medieval. That is likely to negatively impact the degree
of participation of people who have collected here due to a shared
interest in medieval genealogy.

True ... and it's going to go all the way up to number 2000 (ie., a
loooong way yet to go). So perhaps it's best if people only comment
in private emails sent to me.

(But it is *genealogy*, Toddy, not just endless pointless bitching at
someone who will never catch on [BA] ...)

Douglas Richardson

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Douglas Richardson » 28 nov 2007 21:25:06

On Nov 28, 8:32 am, John Brandon <starbuc...@hotmail.com> wrote:

A few folks have responded in private, notably Martin Hollick.

Mr. Hollick is a gentleman and a scholar. He's sent me material
privately in the past as well.

DR

John Brandon

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av John Brandon » 28 nov 2007 21:26:02

Mr. Hollick is a gentleman and a scholar. He's sent me material
privately in the past as well.

DR

Yep, much appreciated. Just print it off and you're good to go.

Bill Arnold

Re: MIGRATION PATTERNS FROM DNA

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 21:40:08

DSH: Yes, that may well be what he means.
And I may be 1/32nd -- Cherokee.
And proud of it.

BA: But of course, everybody in the south who traces their personal
ancestry back to Colonial Days has a great-great-great-grandmother
who was captured by white traders and she was a full-blood Cherokee,
and this you can *see* because the testator of this unproven information
has high cheekbones. OK: O Insipid One, as you so often rant: PROVE IT!
SOURCES! BIRTH RECORDS, DEATH RECORDS, MARRIAGE RECORDS!!!

Bill

*****




____________________________________________________________________________________
Get easy, one-click access to your favorites.
Make Yahoo! your homepage.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Bill Arnold

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 21:46:03

BA: Well, to be blunt, as another senile ole fool wrote, no...just kidding:
I am doing my NE ancestors 11 generations before Joseph Peck, who if
you were not kidding about that, we share. I did not see any sources,
and found that significant. Care to share?

JB: No. Now bugger off, please.

BA: JB and DSH have something in common!

Bill

*****



____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 21:51:02

Renia: I think few here would see this as a literary circle. It's a
history circle, specialising in medieval genealogy. This is a
researchers newsgroup, not a writer's newsgroup. The writers
publish elsewhere.

BA: I stand by the standard categories of *literature* to classify
genealogy among the literary genres: history, and indeed we are
all writers writing about history. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literature

TAF: you can certainly use definitions that would justify calling what we
do here literature, but in so doing, you strain the word to the point
that it loses meaning - it makes every group a writers' group, and
thereby being a writers' group is synonymous with being a group, and
it holds no distinction. As a general rule, internet newsgroups do not have
a habit of referring to a specific member as The Lion, except perhaps in
derision.

BA: No, I cannot agree that I "strain the word to the point that it loses meaning
--it makes every group a writers' group...." If you had written "it makes every
writers' group a writers' group," then you would have been accurate to the
general definition as witnessed at wikipedia, and elsewhere. It is a fraud to
drop the adjective "writers'" from our group! That is what we are, and therefore
with history as our focus, albeit genealogical, we are a literary circle of genealogical
writers.

Renia: Rubbish.

BA: No wonder you were called a *Hot Head*! But, I can see beneath it all, of
this writer's group, Douglas Richardson is *The Lion* and you are *The Ice Princess.*

Bill

*****



____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Renia

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Renia » 28 nov 2007 21:51:15

Bill Arnold wrote:
Renia: I think few here would see this as a literary circle. It's a
history circle, specialising in medieval genealogy. This is a
researchers newsgroup, not a writer's newsgroup. The writers
publish elsewhere.

BA: I stand by the standard categories of *literature* to classify
genealogy among the literary genres: history, and indeed we are
all writers writing about history. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literature

TAF: you can certainly use definitions that would justify calling what we
do here literature, but in so doing, you strain the word to the point
that it loses meaning - it makes every group a writers' group, and
thereby being a writers' group is synonymous with being a group, and
it holds no distinction. As a general rule, internet newsgroups do not have
a habit of referring to a specific member as The Lion, except perhaps in
derision.

BA: No, I cannot agree that I "strain the word to the point that it loses meaning
--it makes every group a writers' group...." If you had written "it makes every
writers' group a writers' group," then you would have been accurate to the
general definition as witnessed at wikipedia, and elsewhere. It is a fraud to
drop the adjective "writers'" from our group! That is what we are, and therefore
with history as our focus, albeit genealogical, we are a literary circle of genealogical
writers.

Renia: Rubbish.

BA: No wonder you were called a *Hot Head*! But, I can see beneath it all, of
this writer's group, Douglas Richardson is *The Lion* and you are *The Ice Princess.*

We are historical researchers, not writers. Writing is not our foremost
priority. It might be yours, but it isn't ours. Our first priority is
research. We may or may not write up the results of our research in the
future but that does not make this a writer's circle.

If you think this is a literary group or writer's circle, then you are
in the wrong newsgroup.

wjhonson

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av wjhonson » 28 nov 2007 21:56:02

On Nov 28, 12:45 pm, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
BA: No wonder you were called a *Hot Head*! But, I can see beneath it all, of
this writer's group, Douglas Richardson is *The Lion* and you are *The Ice Princess.*

Bill


Renia is both a hot head and an Ice Princess. Renia has the
remarkable ability to manifest every emotion known to mankind and
others ! And all at the same time!

I believe a mini-series on her remarkable abilities will soon appear.

Will "I was serious one time" Johnson

Bill Arnold

Re: The Lion Of SGM

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 21:57:02

Renia: You [DSH] call people bitter and vitriolic, yet you are the master of it. Your
pedantry, your verbal venom and your crossposting madness has driven
away many top people from these two newsgroups (sgm & shm). You win. You
have these groups almost to yourself, now.

BA: DSH has won nothing. If people left, it was for other reasons: perhaps they
were bored or weak-willed. DSH claims ancestry from a Cherokee Indian. Let us
see the proof!

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better sports nut! Let your teams follow you
with Yahoo Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9 ... QtBI7ntAcJ

Renia

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Renia » 28 nov 2007 22:00:04

wjhonson wrote:

On Nov 28, 12:45 pm, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:

BA: No wonder you were called a *Hot Head*! But, I can see beneath it all, of
this writer's group, Douglas Richardson is *The Lion* and you are *The Ice Princess.*

Bill



Renia is both a hot head and an Ice Princess. Renia has the
remarkable ability to manifest every emotion known to mankind and
others ! And all at the same time!

I believe a mini-series on her remarkable abilities will soon appear.

Will "I was serious one time" Johnson


Wemarkabul!!

Mini-series? Who should play me?

Ah, I know. CJ.

Douglas Richardson

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Douglas Richardson » 28 nov 2007 22:01:02

On Nov 28, 1:51 pm, Renia <re...@DELETEotenet.gr> wrote:

We are historical researchers, not writers.

I'm definitely a writer and a researcher. I wear both hats.

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

Renia

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Renia » 28 nov 2007 22:01:59

Douglas Richardson wrote:

On Nov 28, 1:51 pm, Renia <re...@DELETEotenet.gr> wrote:


We are historical researchers, not writers.


I'm definitely a writer and a researcher. I wear both hats.

Same here, but we come here to discuss our research, not practise our
writing.

And to discuss recipes, what Vancouver's like in the winter . . . und so
weiter.

John Brandon

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av John Brandon » 28 nov 2007 22:02:02

BA: JB and DSH have something in common!

"Oh shut up and go back to the LeSeur peas, you old fool!" (to quote a
tirade Mrs. Devereux delivered in the middle of a grocery store).

Renia

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Renia » 28 nov 2007 22:02:38

Douglas Richardson wrote:

Renia is not an Ice Princess, guys.

I very much appreciate her contributions to the newsgroup.

Thank you, Douglas.

Douglas Richardson

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Douglas Richardson » 28 nov 2007 22:05:04

Renia is not an Ice Princess, guys.

I very much appreciate her contributions to the newsgroup.

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 22:06:02

Will: Renia is both a hot head and an Ice Princess. Renia has the
remarkable ability to manifest every emotion known to mankind and
others ! And all at the same time!

BA: I thought I just *wrote* that. I was going to write that this is the
first *brilliant* thing you have *ever* written, but then that would
inflate your ego too much. This group which claims *research* as
its whip is *SO* inflated with egotistical writers that I cannot believe
half the verbiage they write :0

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Get easy, one-click access to your favorites.
Make Yahoo! your homepage.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Renia

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Renia » 28 nov 2007 22:08:31

Bill Arnold wrote:

BA: JB and DSH have something in common!

JB: "Oh shut up and go back to the LeSeur peas, you old fool!" (to quote a
tirade Mrs. Devereux delivered in the middle of a grocery store).

BA: Who? Getting *testy* now, are we, Monsieur? Watch out, DSH will take
notice. He loves to *needle* wounded wilderbeasts.

I'm fed up with this. As this has become a writer's circle, I should
point out that they are wildebeest/s.

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 22:10:07

Renia: We are historical researchers, not writers.

DR: I'm definitely a writer and a researcher. I wear both hats.

BA: Yes: "The Lion" has spoken!

Bill
"Thoth"
The Pride Scribe

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better sports nut! Let your teams follow you
with Yahoo Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9 ... QtBI7ntAcJ

Bill Arnold

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 22:11:03

BA: JB and DSH have something in common!

JB: "Oh shut up and go back to the LeSeur peas, you old fool!" (to quote a
tirade Mrs. Devereux delivered in the middle of a grocery store).

BA: Who? Getting *testy* now, are we, Monsieur? Watch out, DSH will take
notice. He loves to *needle* wounded wilderbeasts.

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Renia

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Renia » 28 nov 2007 22:13:15

Bill Arnold wrote:

DR: Renia is not an Ice Princess, guys. I very much appreciate her
contributions to the newsgroup.

BA: So do I appreciate her contributions. But, in my book, she is
still *The Ice Princess* of this genealogical writer's group. I defy
anyone to tell me how we *see* each other's research without the
written word :0 ?????

I defy anyone to tell me how we see each other's messages on any
newsgroup without the written word. :-) ?????

By your criteria, every newsgroup is a writer's circle.

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 22:15:05

DR: Renia is not an Ice Princess, guys. I very much appreciate her
contributions to the newsgroup.

BA: So do I appreciate her contributions. But, in my book, she is
still *The Ice Princess* of this genealogical writer's group. I defy
anyone to tell me how we *see* each other's research without the
written word :0 ?????

Bill

*****


____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better sports nut! Let your teams follow you
with Yahoo Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9 ... QtBI7ntAcJ

pj.evans

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av pj.evans » 28 nov 2007 22:20:03

On Nov 28, 1:04 pm, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
BA: JB and DSH have something in common!

JB: "Oh shut up and go back to the LeSeur peas, you old fool!" (to quote a
tirade Mrs. Devereux delivered in the middle of a grocery store).

BA: Who? Getting *testy* now, are we, Monsieur? Watch out, DSH will take
notice. He loves to *needle* wounded wilderbeasts.

Bill


Respectfully suggesting that you stop sounding like a newbie ... even
if you are.
Make that _especially_ if you are. (Lurking is good.)

Bill Arnold

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 22:21:04

Renia: I'm fed up with this. As this has become a writer's circle, I should
point out that they are wildebeest/s.

BA: Try Google: "wildebeests" and/or "wilderbeasts" [pun intended]

Web Results 1 - 10 of about 116 for "wildebeests"+wilderbeasts. (0.24 seconds)


Wilderbeasts Cartoons

Related topics: wildebeest, wildebeests, wilderbeast, wilderbeasts, africa, african, bitten, bite,
bites, bite, biting, wild, sahara, african wildlife, ...
http://www.cartoonstock.com/directory/w ... beasts.asp - 34k - Cached - Similar pages
MTG-L Archives - August 1997, week 5
Re: Stampeding Wildebeests and Cloning around (78 lines) ... Wilderbeasts, gnome etc (46 lines)
From: Russell K Bulmer <[log in to unmask]> ...
oracle.wizards.com/scripts/ wa.exe?A1=ind9708e&L=mtg-l - 22k - Cached - Similar pages
MTG-L Archives -- August 1997, week 5 (#17)
.... From: Russell K Bulmer <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Wilderbeasts, gnome etc ... This means if
you have two Wildebeests that you can point them both at ...
oracle.wizards.com/scripts/wa.exe?A2=ind9708e& L=mtg-l&D=1&O=A&P=1670 - 14k - Cached - Similar
pages
[ More results from oracle.wizards.com ]
[10th] Stampeding Wildebeests - Page 3 - MTG Salvation Forums
Page 3-[10th] Stampeding Wildebeests The Rumor Mill. ... Wilderbeasts are very nice indead. Esp
with mystic snakes in a suspend deck with multiple upkeeps ...
forums.mtgsalvation.com/ showthread.php?t=79685&page=3 - 113k - Cached - Similar pages
What is Plural of wildebeest? - Yahoo! Answers
It can be either wildebeest or wildebeests. It is a personal preference. 6 months ago ...
WILDERBEASTS. DUH DORK.SORRY IT JUST A JOKE! 6 months ago ...
answers.yahoo.com/question/ index?qid=20070510060534AAsuL7i - 35k - Cached - Similar pages
hey tyr
tyr only fucks animals that are larger and furrier then kayte edit: such as wilderbeasts. This
Amendment was last edited on ... wildebeests ok. Dimitrios ...
forums.interestingnonetheless.net/display.php?tid=24158 - 36k - Cached - Similar pages
hey tyr
tyr only fucks animals that are larger and furrier then kayte edit: such as wilderbeasts ...
wildebeests ok. Dimi Administrator Maybe ...
forums.interestingnonetheless.net/ display.php?tid=24158&postid=487599 - 34k - Cached - Similar
pages
[ More results from forums.interestingnonetheless.net ]
Wilderbeast mentality must go !!! : Wilderbeast mentality must go ...
All other wildebeests, ran around, avoiding the obvious enemy within their midst. ... We must
behave like wilderbeasts any more ! Bhagwat Shah © ...
proud-hindu.sulekha.com/blog/ post/2006/02/wilderbeast-mentality-must-go.htm - 39k - Cached -
Similar pages
StarCityGames.com :: View topic - mono green LD
4 Stampeding Wildebeests 4 Eternal witness 2 terravore 3 argothian wurm ... Stampeding
wilderbeasts says return a green creature you control to your hand at ...
http://www.starcitygames.com/phpBB2/viewtopic. php?p=347860&sid=59ca426519898c2193be6e3bee6167a2 - 46k -
Cached - Similar pages
Help Me Third Set, You're My Only Hope [Archive] - Page 7 - Magic ...
.... Wilderbeasts would be in t2 as I was working on decks for regionals. ... Yeah, doesn't change
the fact that Wildebeests guy is pretty bad at the moment. ...
http://www.misetings.com/forums/ archive/index.php/t-12135-p-7.html - 54k - Cached - Similar pages


©2007 Google - Google Home - Advertising Programs - Business Solutions - About Google







____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

Bill Arnold

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 22:26:03

--- "pj.evans" <pj.evans.gen@usa.net> wrote:

On Nov 28, 1:04 pm, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
BA: JB and DSH have something in common!

JB: "Oh shut up and go back to the LeSeur peas, you old fool!" (to quote a
tirade Mrs. Devereux delivered in the middle of a grocery store).

BA: Who? Getting *testy* now, are we, Monsieur? Watch out, DSH will take
notice. He loves to *needle* wounded wilderbeasts.

Bill


PJ: Respectfully suggesting that you stop sounding like a newbie ... even
if you are. Make that _especially_ if you are. (Lurking is good.)

BA: lecture JB, not me.

Bill

*****




____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Bill Arnold

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Bill Arnold » 28 nov 2007 22:27:03

--- Renia <renia@DELETEotenet.gr> wrote:

Bill Arnold wrote:

DR: Renia is not an Ice Princess, guys. I very much appreciate her
contributions to the newsgroup.

BA: So do I appreciate her contributions. But, in my book, she is
still *The Ice Princess* of this genealogical writer's group. I defy
anyone to tell me how we *see* each other's research without the
written word :0 ?????

I defy anyone to tell me how we see each other's messages on any
newsgroup without the written word. :-) ?????



Renia: By your criteria, every newsgroup is a writer's circle.

BA: Now you sound like TAF. No: Ice Princess, *this* group deals with
*literature* and we all are writers writing about it! Stop writing, I wrote
something when I did not. This group, here, this one we inhabit, is
a group of writers writing about genealogy, which is a classified group
under *literature* under the broader category *history* related to specifics
of names, dates, places, and pedigrees and lineages. Need I make that
more plain, Ice Princess?

Bill

*****

Bill

*****





____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better pen pal.
Text or chat with friends inside Yahoo! Mail. See how. http://overview.mail.yahoo.com/

wjhonson

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av wjhonson » 28 nov 2007 22:30:05

On Nov 28, 1:02 pm, Bill Arnold <billarnold...@yahoo.com> wrote:
BA: I thought I just *wrote* that.

What you wrote was too obtuse for our small brains, so I had to expand
and clarify.

I was going to write that this is the
first *brilliant* thing you have *ever* written, but then that would
inflate your ego too much.

Oh my. You are *Years* too late to try to stop that. I'm afraid
there's no hope for me.

This group which claims *research* as
its whip is *SO* inflated with egotistical writers that I cannot believe
half the verbiage they write :0

Pot. Kettle ? Much?
Give me an "F" I deserve it. I'm being bad.

But as to not *believing" half of what the "egotistical writers" here
write, welcome to the skeptics club. Now self-apply :)

Will Johnson

mhollick@mac.com

Re: Gramma's AT

Legg inn av mhollick@mac.com » 28 nov 2007 23:39:02

On Nov 28, 2:44 pm, Douglas Richardson <royalances...@msn.com> wrote:
On Nov 28, 8:32 am, John Brandon <starbuc...@hotmail.com> wrote:

A few folks have responded in private, notably Martin Hollick.

Mr. Hollick is a gentleman and a scholar. He's sent me material
privately in the past as well.

DR

I'm just a humble reference librarian! Passing on information is what
I do for a living. Passing on good genealogical information is what I
do for fun [reminder: get a new life!!]

Gjest

Re: ORDER OF CHARLEMAGNE

Legg inn av Gjest » 28 nov 2007 23:40:02

On Nov 28, 1:37 pm, Renia <re...@DELETEotenet.gr> wrote:

soc.genealogy.medieval
Genealogy in the period from roughly AD500 to AD1600.
Category: People > Genealogy, Language: English
High activity, 503 subscribers, Usenet

503 subscribers? Where are all you lurkers?! :-) Sign in!

Just to clarify, this Google Groups count of 'subscribers' uses a
definition of 'subscribers' that is Arnoldesque. This is actually a
cumulative count of the total number of different addresses the posts
in the group have come from since its inception (or at least as
archived by Google Groups). It gives no indication of the number of
people who read the group but never post (lurkers), nor does the fact
that the number is growing ever larger indicate that the popularity of
the group is increasing - it is a turnstile, not a thermometer.

One does not subscribe to a USENET group in any meaningful sense of
the word, although because the word was already in use for mailing
lists, it has been used by some software to indicate the act of
selecting a newsgroup to be automatically downloaded from one's local
server, something that is not and cannot be counted, because it is
nothing but a setting on your own computer. Google subsequently
adopted this terminology to show what level of diversity there was in
posting source for the group, but it is really not the same thing at
all.

taf

Svar

Gå tilbake til «soc.genealogy.medieval»