Some Sheffield bits and pieces:
HoP tells us that Thomas Sheffield, "grandfather" of Sir Robert
Rokeley, was living in June 1402 (HoP 1386-1422, vol 4, p 223) when he
sold the manors of Bolsterstone and Penisall for 500 marks.
I know nothing about this Thomas, other than HoP's comment (op. cit. p
221) that his wife was named Alice, and that his daughter was also
said to be named Alice - perhaps this is taken from the 1402 sale
documents. HoP's citation here is probably Yorkshire Arch. Journal,
vol xii, pp 113-4 & 301, but there are other citations in the same
unhelpful conglomeration.
There is a small Sheffield genealogy in Vis. Yorks 1563-4 sub
Stapleton:
Agnes, daughter of Sir Bryan Fitzalan, married (1) Gilbert Stapleton
and (2) Thomas Sheffield, by whom she had:
a. William Sheffield
b. John Sheffield
c. Thomas Sheffield
d. Alexander Sheffield (a clerk)
e. Margaret Sheffield, married John Holme.
Perhaps the Thomas Sheffield listed at (c) above is our man?
There are a number of surviving Rokeley tombs at Worsborough, Yorks,
which I hope to visit shortly. They may have armorial displays that
would assist.
MA-R
Sheffields of Yorkshire
Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper
-
suthen
Re: Sheffields of Yorkshire
Michael,
FWIW I have seen sources (not great ones mind you) that show the
mother of Sir Thomas Reresby d. 1439 of Thrybergh to have been a Lucy
Sheffield, daughter of John.
Hap
FWIW I have seen sources (not great ones mind you) that show the
mother of Sir Thomas Reresby d. 1439 of Thrybergh to have been a Lucy
Sheffield, daughter of John.
Hap
-
John P. Ravilious
Sheffield and Reresby (was Re: Sheffields of Yorkshire)
Dear Hap (and Michael, Kay, Will,..)
The Sheffields and Reresbys are both interesting families, and I
wonder if in fact the John Sheffield ('Esq.') who was father-in-law of
Sir Thomas de Reresby was the younger son of Thomas Sheffield and
Agnes 'fitzAlan'. The chronology would appear to work: Sir Thomas de
Reresby was born ca 1326 - he testified in the Scrope-Grosvenor
controversy of 1386 [see copy of text below] that he was aged '60 and
upwards'. If Thomas Sheffield and Agnes were married say 1321-1325,
John Sheffield was born say 1322-1327, and Lucy Sheffield born say
1338-1345 things would appear 'appropriate'.
Assuming there was one John Sheffield in the period (quite an
assumption), the following would appear to be relevant extractions
from A2A:
A. ' John de Sheffeld ', witness to feoffment dated 16 Dec 1349:
' Between Alice, widow of Edmund de Barneby, of the one part, and Sir
Richard Brand, chaplain, of the other part; of her Manor of Midhope,
with the appurts. in Midhope, Bradefeld, Langsett, Swynden and
Hordern.
Witnesses: Sir John de Heland, Sir Nicholas de Wortelay, John de
Sheffeld, John de Dronfeld, John de Bretton, and others.'
[ Seal: red wax, round, on tag; a flower within 2 interlacing
squares. Endorsed: 23 Ed 3. 192.] - A2A, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Bradford: Spencer-Stanhope Manuscripts [SpSt/1 - SpSt/4],
SpSt/4/11/86/7
B. ' John de Sheffeld ', witness to feoffment dated 12 Jan 1350:
' Between Richard Brand, chaplain, of the one part, and Sir Thomas de
Barneby, of the other part; of his Manor of Midhope, with appurts. in
Midhope, Bradefeld, Langsett, Swynden and Hordern, which the grantor
had from Alice late wife of Edmund de Barneby.
Witnesses: John de Sheffeld, William de Mirfeld, John de
Dronfeld, Roger de Byrlay, Henry de Swynden and others.'
[ Seal: brown wax, round, on tag; a standing figure under an arch.
Endorsed: Brand Midhop ----. 24 Ed 3.] -A2A, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Bradford: Spencer-Stanhope Manuscripts [SpSt/1 - SpSt/4],
SpSt/4/11/86/8
No document that I've seen to date shows John (de) Sheffield
being identified as a knight. I have noted that the ascribed wife of
Richard Symmes of Barnsley (Judith de Reresby) is apparently a
chronological error, and quite possibly a granddaughter, or great-
granddaughter, of the subject Sir Thomas de Reresby.
Cheers,
John
---------------------------------------
from Nicolas, De controversia in curia militari inter Ricardum Le
Scrope et Robertum Grosvenor milites, p. 307:
' SIR THOMAS RERESBY was the son of Thomas Reresby
of Thribergh in Yorkshire, Esq. by Cicely daughter of Richard,
and sister and coheiress of John Gotham of Brinsforth in that
county,<2> and was born about the year 1326.
His deposition proves that the greater part of his life was
passed in military expeditions ; and it affords some interesting
information
respecting many of them. Sir Thomas Reresby married
Lucy daughter of John Sheffield, Esq. and by her had four
sons ; Thomas, Francis, Edmond, and James ; and a daughter,
Judith, who married Richard Symmes of Barnsley.<2> Sir Thomas
Reresby, the eldest son, died in 1439, and was the ancestor of the
family who entered their pedigree at the Visitation of Yorkshire
in 1584.<2>
Sir Thomas Reresby, aged sixty and upwards, said that he
had seen Sir Richard Scrope always armed in the arms Azure, a
bend Or, and others of his blood, some on banners and others
armed in them with differences; that he was retained with Sir
Henry Scrope for the expedition by sea, when the Prince of
Wales first went into Guyenne, and the said Sir Henry was with
his banner with the Earl of Northampton ; that the late King
Edward kept the sea at that time with the deceased Duke of Lancaster,
and with his sons the Earl of Richmond, the Lord Lionel,
the Lord Edmond of Langley, and others, amongst whom Sir
Henry Scrope was many times armed Azure, a bend Or, with a label
Argent ; that Sir Richard was also so armed before Paris, in the
expedition
of the late King ; and when he and his cousins were armed,
they always used these arms and no other, and their ancestors before
them, as he had heard his ancestors say ; and his ancestors heard
it from their ancestors, that the said arms have been
continually ...... '
Footnotes:
<2> Brooke's MS. Collections, f. 304. Vincent's MS.
n? 110. f. 44. Glover's
Visitation of Yorkshire, f. 56. In the Harleian MS. 1487, f. 240, the
father of
the Deponent is called a Knight. '
On Sep 28, 1:40?pm, suthen <sut...@redshift.com> wrote:
The Sheffields and Reresbys are both interesting families, and I
wonder if in fact the John Sheffield ('Esq.') who was father-in-law of
Sir Thomas de Reresby was the younger son of Thomas Sheffield and
Agnes 'fitzAlan'. The chronology would appear to work: Sir Thomas de
Reresby was born ca 1326 - he testified in the Scrope-Grosvenor
controversy of 1386 [see copy of text below] that he was aged '60 and
upwards'. If Thomas Sheffield and Agnes were married say 1321-1325,
John Sheffield was born say 1322-1327, and Lucy Sheffield born say
1338-1345 things would appear 'appropriate'.
Assuming there was one John Sheffield in the period (quite an
assumption), the following would appear to be relevant extractions
from A2A:
A. ' John de Sheffeld ', witness to feoffment dated 16 Dec 1349:
' Between Alice, widow of Edmund de Barneby, of the one part, and Sir
Richard Brand, chaplain, of the other part; of her Manor of Midhope,
with the appurts. in Midhope, Bradefeld, Langsett, Swynden and
Hordern.
Witnesses: Sir John de Heland, Sir Nicholas de Wortelay, John de
Sheffeld, John de Dronfeld, John de Bretton, and others.'
[ Seal: red wax, round, on tag; a flower within 2 interlacing
squares. Endorsed: 23 Ed 3. 192.] - A2A, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Bradford: Spencer-Stanhope Manuscripts [SpSt/1 - SpSt/4],
SpSt/4/11/86/7
B. ' John de Sheffeld ', witness to feoffment dated 12 Jan 1350:
' Between Richard Brand, chaplain, of the one part, and Sir Thomas de
Barneby, of the other part; of his Manor of Midhope, with appurts. in
Midhope, Bradefeld, Langsett, Swynden and Hordern, which the grantor
had from Alice late wife of Edmund de Barneby.
Witnesses: John de Sheffeld, William de Mirfeld, John de
Dronfeld, Roger de Byrlay, Henry de Swynden and others.'
[ Seal: brown wax, round, on tag; a standing figure under an arch.
Endorsed: Brand Midhop ----. 24 Ed 3.] -A2A, West Yorkshire Archive
Service, Bradford: Spencer-Stanhope Manuscripts [SpSt/1 - SpSt/4],
SpSt/4/11/86/8
No document that I've seen to date shows John (de) Sheffield
being identified as a knight. I have noted that the ascribed wife of
Richard Symmes of Barnsley (Judith de Reresby) is apparently a
chronological error, and quite possibly a granddaughter, or great-
granddaughter, of the subject Sir Thomas de Reresby.
Cheers,
John
---------------------------------------
from Nicolas, De controversia in curia militari inter Ricardum Le
Scrope et Robertum Grosvenor milites, p. 307:
' SIR THOMAS RERESBY was the son of Thomas Reresby
of Thribergh in Yorkshire, Esq. by Cicely daughter of Richard,
and sister and coheiress of John Gotham of Brinsforth in that
county,<2> and was born about the year 1326.
His deposition proves that the greater part of his life was
passed in military expeditions ; and it affords some interesting
information
respecting many of them. Sir Thomas Reresby married
Lucy daughter of John Sheffield, Esq. and by her had four
sons ; Thomas, Francis, Edmond, and James ; and a daughter,
Judith, who married Richard Symmes of Barnsley.<2> Sir Thomas
Reresby, the eldest son, died in 1439, and was the ancestor of the
family who entered their pedigree at the Visitation of Yorkshire
in 1584.<2>
Sir Thomas Reresby, aged sixty and upwards, said that he
had seen Sir Richard Scrope always armed in the arms Azure, a
bend Or, and others of his blood, some on banners and others
armed in them with differences; that he was retained with Sir
Henry Scrope for the expedition by sea, when the Prince of
Wales first went into Guyenne, and the said Sir Henry was with
his banner with the Earl of Northampton ; that the late King
Edward kept the sea at that time with the deceased Duke of Lancaster,
and with his sons the Earl of Richmond, the Lord Lionel,
the Lord Edmond of Langley, and others, amongst whom Sir
Henry Scrope was many times armed Azure, a bend Or, with a label
Argent ; that Sir Richard was also so armed before Paris, in the
expedition
of the late King ; and when he and his cousins were armed,
they always used these arms and no other, and their ancestors before
them, as he had heard his ancestors say ; and his ancestors heard
it from their ancestors, that the said arms have been
continually ...... '
Footnotes:
<2> Brooke's MS. Collections, f. 304. Vincent's MS.
n? 110. f. 44. Glover's
Visitation of Yorkshire, f. 56. In the Harleian MS. 1487, f. 240, the
father of
the Deponent is called a Knight. '
On Sep 28, 1:40?pm, suthen <sut...@redshift.com> wrote:
Michael,
FWIW I have seen sources (not great ones mind you) that show the
mother of Sir Thomas Reresby d. 1439 of Thrybergh to have been a Lucy
Sheffield, daughter of John.
Hap