Fun and games medieval style

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Leo van de Pas

Fun and games medieval style

Legg inn av Leo van de Pas » 17 aug 2007 23:44:22

Enguerrand I de Coucy repudiated his wife Ada de Marle for her adultery. At least he waited until after Ada died when he abducted Sibil de Porcean, wife of Godefroid, comte de Namur. He married her despite the fact that she was still married to Godefroid (who later divorced her and married again.

For his actions Enguerrand was excommunicated by the Church. He sought to make amends by taking part in the First Crusade; between 1096 and 1099 he fought heroically in the Holy Land.

During one battle with the Moslems he mislaid his banner; he tore off his coat of scarlet lined with squirrel fur, and cut out a new emblem from it. Thus was born the celebrated description of his arms: "Fasse de vair et de gueulle de six pieces" (fessy of squirrel fur and gules of six parts), which would bear the name of Coucy on many battlefields.

Enguerrand's excommunication was lifted through the help of his kinsman, also called Enguerrand, the bishop of Laon.

Volucris

Re: Fun and games medieval style

Legg inn av Volucris » 19 aug 2007 23:34:32

Leo,

On the biographical side of the family de Coucy, Barbara Tuchman wrote
in 1978 a book called "A distant mirror". It came out in 1980 under
the Dutch translation "De waanzinnige 14de eeuw".

Hans Vogels

On 18 aug, 00:44, "Leo van de Pas" <leovd...@netspeed.com.au> wrote:
Enguerrand I de Coucy repudiated his wife Ada de Marle for her adultery. At least he waited until after Ada died when he abducted Sibil de Porcean, wife of Godefroid, comte de Namur. He married her despite the fact that she was still married to Godefroid (who later divorced her and married again.

For his actions Enguerrand was excommunicated by the Church. He sought to make amends by taking part in the First Crusade; between 1096 and 1099 he fought heroically in the Holy Land.

During one battle with the Moslems he mislaid his banner; he tore off his coat of scarlet lined with squirrel fur, and cut out a new emblem from it. Thus was born the celebrated description of his arms: "Fasse de vair et de gueulle de six pieces" (fessy of squirrel fur and gules of six parts), which would bear the name of Coucy on many battlefields.

Enguerrand's excommunication was lifted through the help of his kinsman, also called Enguerrand, the bishop of Laon.

Volucris

Re: Fun and games medieval style

Legg inn av Volucris » 20 aug 2007 19:04:38

Leo,

Additional to the previous post I noticed a few lines on the
'bastard' (according to a certain monk Guibert of Nogent) Thomas van
Marle and his stepmother Sybille, wive of his father the lord of
Coucy, and the lives and times in France around 1112.

It can be read in Georges Duby's, 'Ridder, vrouw en priester. De
middeleeuwse oorsprong van het moderne huwelijk', 2e druk 1987 ( La
Chevalier, la Femme et le Prêtre. Le mariage dans la France féodale,
1981), chapter VIII Guibert van Nogent.

Hans Vogels


On 20 aug, 00:34, Volucris <voluc...@kpnplanet.nl> wrote:
Leo,

On the biographical side of the family de Coucy, Barbara Tuchman wrote
in 1978 a book called "A distant mirror". It came out in 1980 under
the Dutch translation "De waanzinnige 14de eeuw".

Hans Vogels

On 18 aug, 00:44, "Leo van de Pas" <leovd...@netspeed.com.au> wrote:



Enguerrand I de Coucy repudiated his wife Ada de Marle for her adultery.. At least he waited until after Ada died when he abducted Sibil de Porcean, wife of Godefroid, comte de Namur. He married her despite the fact that she was still married to Godefroid (who later divorced her and married again.

For his actions Enguerrand was excommunicated by the Church. He sought to make amends by taking part in the First Crusade; between 1096 and 1099 he fought heroically in the Holy Land.

During one battle with the Moslems he mislaid his banner; he tore off his coat of scarlet lined with squirrel fur, and cut out a new emblem from it. Thus was born the celebrated description of his arms: "Fasse de vair et de gueulle de six pieces" (fessy of squirrel fur and gules of six parts), which would bear the name of Coucy on many battlefields.

Enguerrand's excommunication was lifted through the help of his kinsman, also called Enguerrand, the bishop of Laon. - Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht niet weergeven -

- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht weergeven -

Peter Stewart

Re: Fun and games medieval style

Legg inn av Peter Stewart » 21 aug 2007 04:27:39

"Volucris" <volucris@kpnplanet.nl> wrote in message
news:1187633078.425213.121350@w3g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
Leo,

Additional to the previous post I noticed a few lines on the
'bastard' (according to a certain monk Guibert of Nogent)
Thomas van Marle and his stepmother Sybille, wive of his
father the lord of Coucy, and the lives and times in France
around 1112.

Guibert of Nogent casts doubt on the paternity of Thomas, almost certainly
(though even this has been interpreted differently), but at no point does he
call him a bastard.

It appears more likely that a question was current, when Enguerrand was
trying to disinherit Thomas at the behest of Sybille, over which of Ada's
two successive husbands had actually sired the boy, rather than any scandal
that he had been conceived from an extramarital liaison.

Peter Stewart

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