Mediaeval Oxfordshire: the Harcourts of Stanton Harcourt

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Mediaeval Oxfordshire: the Harcourts of Stanton Harcourt

Legg inn av Gjest » 15 aug 2007 18:10:04

Third stop was Stanton Harcourt, where the church and manor house sit
together on a quiet laneway leading off from the Harcourt Arms public
house.

The church is famous for the Harcourt Chapel, which contains a number
of monuments to the family. These include the effigy-tombs of Sir
Robert Harcourt, KG (d 1470) and his wife, Margaret Byron, and of
their grandson, Robert Harcourt (d 1509). The former wears his Garter
robes, while the latter lies underneath the actual banner he bore at
the Battle of Bosworth for Henry VII. These two tombs have been
thoroughly restored.

A further effigy tomb commemorates the wife of Thomas Harcourt (d
1417): Maud Grey, daughter of Lord Grey of Rotherfield. There is also
a wall-tablet commemorating the Hovenden (Haffenden) family.

A most curious object in the chancel is the ancient shrine of St
Edburga, rescued from Bicester Priory in 1537; it retains much of its
original colour.

MAR

Gjest

Re: Mediaeval Oxfordshire: the Harcourts of Stanton Harcourt

Legg inn av Gjest » 15 aug 2007 19:04:49

Michael,

I would appreciate pictures of the Harcourt tombs.

Jim Malone


-----Original Message-----
From: mjcar@btinternet.com
To: gen-medieval@rootsweb.com
Sent: Wed, 15 Aug 2007 12:10 pm
Subject: Mediaeval Oxfordshire: the Harcourts of Stanton Harcourt



Third stop was Stanton Harcourt, where the church and manor house sit
together on a quiet laneway leading off from the Harcourt Arms public
house.

The church is famous for the Harcourt Chapel, which contains a number
of monuments to the family. These include the effigy-tombs of Sir
Robert Harcourt, KG (d 1470) and his wife, Margaret Byron, and of
their grandson, Robert Harcourt (d 1509). The former wears his Garter
robes, while the latter lies underneath the actual banner he bore at
the Battle of Bosworth for Henry VII. These two tombs have been
thoroughly restored.

A further effigy tomb commemorates the wife of Thomas Harcourt (d
1417): Maud Grey, daughter of Lord Grey of Rotherfield. There is also
a wall-tablet commemorating the Hovenden (Haffenden) family.

A most curious object in the chancel is the ancient shrine of St
Edburga, rescued from Bicester Priory in 1537; it retains much of its
original colour.

MAR


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Leo van de Pas

Re: Mediaeval Oxfordshire: the Harcourts of Stanton Harcourt

Legg inn av Leo van de Pas » 16 aug 2007 01:37:15

My original source for 1471 as year of death was Georges Martin "Histoire et
Genealogie de la Maison d'Harcourt", page 223.

However, ES Volume X Tafel 139 gives 1470

I am also VERY fortunate to have "The Most Noble Order of the Garter" by
Peter J. Begent and Hubert Chesshyre and on page 313 he is shown as the
197th Knight of the Garter and he died in 1470

I have changed the year now, but it will take a few weeks before it is shown
on Genealogics.

With best wishes
Leo van de Pas
Canberra, Australia


----- Original Message -----
From: <mjcar@btinternet.com>
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
To: <gen-medieval@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2007 8:47 AM
Subject: Re: Mediaeval Oxfordshire: the Harcourts of Stanton Harcourt


On 15 Aug., 20:50, WJhonson <wjhon...@aol.com> wrote:
In a message dated 08/15/07 10:10:22 Pacific Standard Time,
mj...@btinternet.com writes:
The church is famous for the Harcourt Chapel, which contains a number
of monuments to the family. These include the effigy-tombs of Sir
Robert Harcourt, KG (d 1470) and his wife, Margaret Byron, and of
their grandson, Robert Harcourt (d 1509).

----------------http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00029038&tree=LEO
Leo shows him d 14 Nov 1471 in battle
Also this Robert is an ancestor of Prince Charles

Yes, as it happened I looked it up before posting. The church guide
(P & G Salway, revised edition, 2004) says 1470, and notes he was
"killed in a skirmish with the Lancastrians". The Order of the
Garter: Its Kinghts and Stall Plates, Grace Holmes, Windsor, 1984,
says he "died 14 November 1470".

I have just checked Burke's Peeerage, 107th edition, vol III sub
Vernon, and it also says 14 November 1470.

MAR


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Gjest

Re: Mediaeval Oxfordshire: the Harcourts of Stanton Harcourt

Legg inn av Gjest » 16 aug 2007 03:14:27

On Aug 15, 10:10 am, mj...@btinternet.com wrote:
Third stop was Stanton Harcourt, where the church and manor house sit
together on a quiet laneway leading off from the Harcourt Arms public
house.

The church is famous for the Harcourt Chapel, which contains a number
of monuments to the family. These include the effigy-tombs of Sir
Robert Harcourt, KG (d 1470) and his wife, Margaret Byron, and of
their grandson, Robert Harcourt (d 1509). The former wears his Garter
robes, while the latter lies underneath the actual banner he bore at
the Battle of Bosworth for Henry VII. These two tombs have been
thoroughly restored.

A further effigy tomb commemorates the wife of Thomas Harcourt (d
1417): Maud Grey, daughter of Lord Grey of Rotherfield. There is also
a wall-tablet commemorating the Hovenden (Haffenden) family.

A most curious object in the chancel is the ancient shrine of St
Edburga, rescued from Bicester Priory in 1537; it retains much of its
original colour.

MAR

Do you have photos of the second tomb mentioned, that of Thomas
Harcourt & Maud Grey? I descend from their son, Thomas, but not from
Robert & Margaret. Thanks, Bronwen

Gjest

Re: Mediaeval Oxfordshire: the Harcourts of Stanton Harcourt

Legg inn av Gjest » 16 aug 2007 09:05:55

On 16 Aug., 03:14, lostcoo...@yahoo.com wrote:
On Aug 15, 10:10 am, mj...@btinternet.com wrote:





Third stop was Stanton Harcourt, where the church and manor house sit
together on a quiet laneway leading off from the Harcourt Arms public
house.

The church is famous for the Harcourt Chapel, which contains a number
of monuments to the family. These include the effigy-tombs of Sir
Robert Harcourt, KG (d 1470) and his wife, Margaret Byron, and of
their grandson, Robert Harcourt (d 1509). The former wears his Garter
robes, while the latter lies underneath the actual banner he bore at
the Battle of Bosworth for Henry VII. These two tombs have been
thoroughly restored.

A further effigy tomb commemorates the wife of Thomas Harcourt (d
1417): Maud Grey, daughter of Lord Grey of Rotherfield. There is also
a wall-tablet commemorating the Hovenden (Haffenden) family.

A most curious object in the chancel is the ancient shrine of St
Edburga, rescued from Bicester Priory in 1537; it retains much of its
original colour.

MAR

Do you have photos of the second tomb mentioned, that of Thomas
Harcourt & Maud Grey? I descend from their son, Thomas, but not from
Robert & Margaret. Thanks, Bronwen

Yes - the effigy-tomb of Maud nee Grey. It retains some of its
original colouring (the figure and the heraldic shields have been
retouched though) and is particularly notable because the gown shows
the Harcourt arms. The iron railings are also thought to be
original. Would you like a copy, Bronwen?

Regards, Michael

Gjest

Re: Mediaeval Oxfordshire: the Harcourts of Stanton Harcourt

Legg inn av Gjest » 16 aug 2007 09:18:01

On 15 Aug., 18:10, mj...@btinternet.com wrote:

A further effigy tomb commemorates the wife of Thomas Harcourt (d
1417): Maud Grey, daughter of Lord Grey of Rotherfield. There is also
a wall-tablet commemorating the Hovenden (Haffenden) family.

I have been asked whether there is evidence on Maud Grey's tomb to
connect her with the Marmions.

The base of the tomb contains five heraldic shields. The first and
fifth are Harcourt, and the third is Grey. The second coat is badly
defaced, but appear to display Harcourt impaling Grey.

The fourth coat is "vair, a fess gules". According to Glover's Roll
(on Brian Timms's excellent site) these are the arms of Marmion.

Note of caution: the church guide states of this tomb: "the colour on
the figure is 19th century, but the traces of heraldic and other
painted decoration on the wall above the tomb are mediaeval" - ie the
guide does not make it clear whether the arms on the base of the tomb
are original or restored. Because of their freshness, I should think
the latter.

MAR

Douglas Richardson

Re: Mediaeval Oxfordshire: the Harcourts of Stanton Harcourt

Legg inn av Douglas Richardson » 16 aug 2007 18:40:05

Dear Will ~

You appear to have spotted an error in the van de Pas database. The
year 1470 is the correct date of Sir Robert Harcourt's death, as
stated in the sources below:

http://books.google.com/books?id=yoV67I ... xNgk-YfxQE

http://books.google.com/books?id=fuAhAA ... 0+Stafford

http://books.google.com/books?id=m8Ojo6 ... T8pFcIeERg

If you find the date is otherwise, please advise me. Thanks!

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

On Aug 15, 2:05 pm, WJhonson <wjhon...@aol.com> wrote:
< <<In a message dated 08/15/07 12:50:42 Pacific Standard Time,
WJhonson writes:http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?
personID=I00029038&tree=LEO
< Leo shows him d 14 Nov 1471 in battle
< Also this Robert is an ancestor of Prince Charles >>
<
< ----------------------
< Douglas in MCA states that this Robert was "slain by the adherents
of the Staffords... 14 Nov 1470"
<
< Seehttp://books.google.com/books?id=wHZ ... Edwn4I8Q...
<
< Will Johnson

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