Usefulness of Chancery Proceedings in the _Lists & Indexes_

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John Brandon

Usefulness of Chancery Proceedings in the _Lists & Indexes_

Legg inn av John Brandon » 15 aug 2007 17:26:07

Leslie Mahler has recently been trying to argue that my postings from
the "Bridges' Division" Chancery Proceedings are useless. I've
already pointed out how the Bragg-Gotherson suit I found proves the
royal descent of Dorothea Scott Gotherson, and that the Mayne-Harrison
lawsuits are also a great help to descendants of the Willing family of
Philadelphia.

Another late 1650s suit I've located (I'll have to post the exact
reference later, as I lost the slip of paper marking the page)
mentions "John Fenwick and Dame Mary Rogers alias Fenwick his wife"
and concerns some property of theirs in Bray, Berkshire (I believe).

This is obviously a reference to the New Jersey Quaker immigrant John
Fenwick, Esq., who hailed from nearby Binfield, Berkshire. Note that
an article in _Journal of the Friends' Historical Society_ mentions
that his second wife was "Dame Mary Rogers":

http://books.google.com/books?id=hRk3AA ... %22&pgis=1

Yet even the _Oxford Dictionary of National Biography_ from 2004 calls
his second wife "Mary Burdett" (as do many other secondary sources):

http://books.google.com/books?id=xikYAA ... s=1#search

A good clue to her real identity is found in GBR's _RD600_ where he
gives her as "Mary, sister of Henry Marten the younger" (i.e., the
Henry Marten the Regicide). The extracted IGI shows the following
record:

Saint Benet Pauls Wharf, London
--Richard Rogers to Mrs Mary Marten, 20 Nov. 1628

Also, _The History and Antiquities of the Hundred of Bray_, p. 70,
mentions Sir Henry Marten and "Lady Rogers" in connection with a piece
of property circa 1650 ...

http://books.google.com/books?id=n8QBAA ... ady+rogers

Richard Rogers, Mary Marten's first husband, must have become a knight
at some point.

I believe this is another instance of the helpfulness of Chancery
Proceedings entries in the List and Indexes series.

Gjest

Re: Usefulness of Chancery Proceedings in the _Lists & Index

Legg inn av Gjest » 15 aug 2007 17:46:04

On 15 Aug., 17:26, John Brandon <starbuc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Leslie Mahler has recently been trying to argue that my postings from
the "Bridges' Division" Chancery Proceedings are useless.

(snip)

Another late 1650s

Off topic on a mediaeval genealogy discussion group

suit I've located (I'll have to post the exact
reference later, as I lost the slip of paper marking the page)
mentions "John Fenwick and Dame Mary Rogers alias Fenwick his wife"
and concerns some property of theirs in Bray, Berkshire (I believe).

(snip of long, off topic material)

A good clue to her real identity is found in GBR's _RD600_ where he
gives her as "Mary, sister of Henry Marten the younger" (i.e., the
Henry Marten the Regicide). The extracted IGI shows the following
record:

Saint Benet Pauls Wharf, London
--Richard Rogers to Mrs Mary Marten, 20 Nov. 1628

Off topic on a mediaeval genealogy discussion group.

Also, _The History and Antiquities of the Hundred of Bray_, p. 70,
mentions Sir Henry Marten and "Lady Rogers" in connection with a piece
of property circa 1650 ...

Off topic on a mediaeval genealogy discussion group.

http://books.google.com/books?id=n8QBAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA70&dq=%22henry+mar...

Richard Rogers, Mary Marten's first husband, must have become a knight
at some point.

I believe this is another instance of the helpfulness of Chancery
Proceedings entries in the List and Indexes series.

I am sorry that Leslie has hurt your sensitive feelings. However, he
is right: your posts on this subject are mostly useless (and off topic
in a mediaeval genealogy discussion group). If you took the trouble
to explain their significance, instead of acting as a [sub-]human
typewriter, perhaps they would acquire some small level of
usefulness.

They'd still be off-topic, of course. You do understand that this is
a discussion group for mediaeval genealogy, don't you?

John Brandon

Re: Usefulness of Chancery Proceedings in the _Lists & Index

Legg inn av John Brandon » 15 aug 2007 17:56:11

I am sorry that Leslie has hurt your sensitive feelings. However, he

Leslie hasn't hurt my feelings at all. I don't give a damn what that
weirdo thinks.

They'd still be off-topic, of course. You do understand that this is
a discussion group for mediaeval genealogy, don't you?

No, I'm unable to comprehend it. (Get a life, Michael, you miserable
boring twit. There's a tourist spot calling out for your camera as we
speak. Where will you flit to next?)

John Brandon

Re: Usefulness of Chancery Proceedings in the _Lists & Index

Legg inn av John Brandon » 15 aug 2007 21:11:41

Saint Bride Fleet Street, London
--John Fenwick to Mary Rogers, 5 May 1655

John Brandon

Re: Usefulness of Chancery Proceedings in the _Lists & Index

Legg inn av John Brandon » 15 aug 2007 21:38:52

Shoot, it looks like I may have to re-read 100 pages of the volume to
find the entry. But in the meantime lookit the following, from A2A --

East Sussex Record Office: Archive of the Portman family of Buxted
Place

GLOUCESTERSHIRE

THORNBURY

FILE - Lease - ref. SAS/PN/1227 - date: 26 Mar 1656
hit[from Scope and Content] Also a close called Coneger and
the Mead adjoining, and other closes called Gosthill, Barne Close,
Home Close and the Little Close, Cockshutt Hill and 2 paddocks
adjoining, Middle mead, the Grove and Grove Meadow; all containing 167
acres, late in the tenure of Thomas Skreene. And a close called the
Little Kings ground containing 9 acres in the occupation of Samuel
Collens. Signature, Mary Rogers, and seal
hit[from Scope and Content] Witnesses:- J.Fenwick, Tho.Isham,
William Clinch

FILE - Release in fee - ref. SAS/PN/1228 - date: 15 Sep 1656
hit[from Scope and Content] By Dame MARY ROGERS of Bray,
co.Berks, widow, to Sir RICHARD ASHFIELD and Dame MARY ASHFIELD his
wife - for £1300 - of All that messuage or tenement called the
Brickhouse and several closes called the Brickhouse bargaine
containing 147 acres in the occupation of Thos.Skreene
hit[from Scope and Content] And all other the messuage, lands
and tenements of the said Dame Mary Rogers with the precinct of
Eastwood Park in Thornebury. Signature, Mary Rogers, seal gone
hit[from Scope and Content] Witnesses:- Charles Edmonds, J.
Fenwick, Tho. Bilcliffe

John Brandon

Re: Usefulness of Chancery Proceedings in the _Lists & Index

Legg inn av John Brandon » 15 aug 2007 22:09:39

Gibbs Mss
Catalogue Ref. DD\GB

Creator(s):
Gibbs family of Barrow Court, Somerset
Gore family of Barrow Court, Somerset

FILE - GORE LEGAL PAPERS (ii) - ref. DD\GB/154 - date: 17th cent
- 18th cent
item: Answer of Hen. Marten, esq., defendant to bill of Wm.
Gore, plaintiff - ref. DD\GB/154/4/1-5 - date: 8 Nov.1655
hit[from Scope and Content] Respecting the site of Bray
parsonage held by his brother Geo., another defendant, son of Sir Hen.
Marten, kt., who assigned it to his sister Dame Mary Rogers.

John Brandon

Re: Usefulness of Chancery Proceedings in the _Lists & Index

Legg inn av John Brandon » 16 aug 2007 22:53:07

vol. 45, p. 343 [_Chancery Proceedings, Bridges' Division, 1613-1714_]

--Worseley, Richard and another
--Fenwick, John, and Dame Mary Roger [sic] _alias_ Fenwick, his wife
--1663; Eaton Hastings [Berks.] manor (answers)

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