OT? - late 17th & early 18th century

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OT? - late 17th & early 18th century

Legg inn av Gjest » 06 jul 2007 03:53:39

Most genealogies have given Sir William Graham, 1st Baronet of
Gartmore (Stirlingshire), d. 1684, only two children: a son, Sir John
Graham, who was declared insane & died unmarried in 1708, and a
daughter, Mary, who married James Hodge of Gladsmuir, and through
whose daughter, Mary Hodge, the Gartmore title descended via her
marriage to William Graham of Gallingad. I descend from the third,
usually unmentioned, daughter, Christian, who married John Drummond. I
only had a relative's published article from the Simcoe (Ontario)
Reformer from the 1930s to go on (in which he said that he had seen
the marriage of Christian and John in the registry at Edinburgh), and
in my on-line copy of The Landed Families of Perthshire by Gordon
MacGregor, Perthshire Heritage Society (repeated in the larger work
recently made available "The Red Book of Perthshire", same author &
publisher).

Now that more of the National Archives of Scotland have been placed on-
line, I have found documents showing the marriage and, therefore, the
existence of Christian as a daughter of William Graham of Gartmore and
Elizabeth Graham of Kinpont/Menteith.

The documents are to be found in "Papers of the Cunninghame Graham
Family of Ardoch, Dunbartonshire", Ref. No. GD22/1/275:

"Contract of Marriage between John Drummond, son of Andrew
Drummond, and Cristan Grahame (Graham), daughter of William Grahame
(Graham); the said Cristan to be infeft in the lands of Middle Myes
(Mye) in liferent. Also the Extract of the Contract registered at
Edinburgh, 20 January 1673." (the parenthetical words are as they
appear on the summary & index)

I apologize that this is past 1600 and that I am not a professional
genealogist and so may not have worded things quite right. For those
interested in royal descents of 19th century immigrants to Canada,
this is an example of such: Elizabeth Graham of Kinpont/Menteith was a
descendant of Margaret Tudor, sister of Henry VIII, and, therefore, of
the early Tudors, the Stewarts & the Plantagenets. The above
Christian Graham was the ancestor of Henrietta Rudyard Clark McInnes
(& her siblings), an immigrant to Ontario in 1840 after some time
spent on Carriacou in the Grenadines. If this is relevant to anyone, I
would appreciate any comments.
The complete URL is:
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/nra/ ... ?FER=F8518

Thank you, Bronwen Edwards

the_verminator@comcast.ne

Re: OT? - late 17th & early 18th century

Legg inn av the_verminator@comcast.ne » 06 jul 2007 07:00:17

On Jul 5, 9:53 pm, lostcoo...@yahoo.com wrote:
Most genealogies have given Sir William Graham, 1st Baronet of
Gartmore (Stirlingshire), d. 1684, only two children: a son, Sir John
Graham, who was declared insane & died unmarried in 1708, and a
daughter, Mary, who married James Hodge of Gladsmuir, and through
whose daughter, Mary Hodge, the Gartmore title descended via her
marriage to William Graham of Gallingad. I descend from the third,
usually unmentioned, daughter, Christian, who married John Drummond. I
only had a relative's published article from the Simcoe (Ontario)
Reformer from the 1930s to go on (in which he said that he had seen
the marriage of Christian and John in the registry at Edinburgh), and
in my on-line copy of The Landed Families of Perthshire by Gordon
MacGregor, Perthshire Heritage Society (repeated in the larger work
recently made available "The Red Book of Perthshire", same author &
publisher).

Now that more of the National Archives of Scotland have been placed on-
line, I have found documents showing the marriage and, therefore, the
existence of Christian as a daughter of William Graham of Gartmore and
Elizabeth Graham of Kinpont/Menteith.

The documents are to be found in "Papers of the Cunninghame Graham
Family of Ardoch, Dunbartonshire", Ref. No. GD22/1/275:

"Contract of Marriage between John Drummond, son of Andrew
Drummond, and Cristan Grahame (Graham), daughter of William Grahame
(Graham); the said Cristan to be infeft in the lands of Middle Myes
(Mye) in liferent. Also the Extract of the Contract registered at
Edinburgh, 20 January 1673." (the parenthetical words are as they
appear on the summary & index)

I apologize that this is past 1600 and that I am not a professional
genealogist and so may not have worded things quite right. For those
interested in royal descents of 19th century immigrants to Canada,
this is an example of such: Elizabeth Graham of Kinpont/Menteith was a
descendant of Margaret Tudor, sister of Henry VIII, and, therefore, of
the early Tudors, the Stewarts & the Plantagenets. The above
Christian Graham was the ancestor of Henrietta Rudyard Clark McInnes
(& her siblings), an immigrant to Ontario in 1840 after some time
spent on Carriacou in the Grenadines. If this is relevant to anyone, I
would appreciate any comments.
The complete URL is:http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/nra/searches/fedocs.asp?FER=F8518

Thank you, Bronwen Edwards

If you have not already notified Paul Theroff you should do so in
order that he may update his online file of descendants of Henry VII.
He'll appreciate it.

WJhonson

Re: OT? - late 17th & early 18th century

Legg inn av WJhonson » 06 jul 2007 23:04:29

<<In a message dated 07/05/07 19:55:48 Pacific Standard Time, lostcooper@yahoo.com writes:
For those
interested in royal descents of 19th century immigrants to Canada,
this is an example of such: Elizabeth Graham of Kinpont/Menteith was a
descendant of Margaret Tudor, sister of Henry VIII,>>

Bronwen I am interested in exactly how Elizabeth descends from Margaret Tudor, could you give the complete path?
Thanks
Will Johnson

Leo van de Pas

Re: OT? - late 17th & early 18th century

Legg inn av Leo van de Pas » 07 jul 2007 00:03:31

Dear Bronwen
This is a fascinating message. Your ancestor Elizabeth Graham definitely had
interesting ancestors, for instance:
William Graham, 7th Earl of Menteith
George Keith, 4th Earl Marischal
John Erskine, 2nd Earl of Mar
Robert Stewart, Earl of Orkney
Esme Stuart, 1.Duke of Lennox
James V, King of Scots
John Stewart, 1.Earl of Atholl
Margaret Tudor
Hugh Montgomerie, 1.Earl of Eglintoun
George Douglas, 4.Earl of Angus
Henry VII, King of England
Colin Campbell, 1.Earl of Argyll
Henry Sinclair, 2.Earl of Orkney
Christian I, King of Denmark
Edward IV, King of England
John oif Gaunt, Duke of Lancaster
Edward III, King of England
And many more. In my system I have for this Elizabeth Graham at least 876
lines to William the Conqueror.
With best wishes
Leo van de Pas
Canberra, Australia


----- Original Message -----
From: <lostcooper@yahoo.com>
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
To: <gen-medieval@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 12:53 PM
Subject: OT? - late 17th & early 18th century


Most genealogies have given Sir William Graham, 1st Baronet of
Gartmore (Stirlingshire), d. 1684, only two children: a son, Sir John
Graham, who was declared insane & died unmarried in 1708, and a
daughter, Mary, who married James Hodge of Gladsmuir, and through
whose daughter, Mary Hodge, the Gartmore title descended via her
marriage to William Graham of Gallingad. I descend from the third,
usually unmentioned, daughter, Christian, who married John Drummond. I
only had a relative's published article from the Simcoe (Ontario)
Reformer from the 1930s to go on (in which he said that he had seen
the marriage of Christian and John in the registry at Edinburgh), and
in my on-line copy of The Landed Families of Perthshire by Gordon
MacGregor, Perthshire Heritage Society (repeated in the larger work
recently made available "The Red Book of Perthshire", same author &
publisher).

Now that more of the National Archives of Scotland have been placed on-
line, I have found documents showing the marriage and, therefore, the
existence of Christian as a daughter of William Graham of Gartmore and
Elizabeth Graham of Kinpont/Menteith.

The documents are to be found in "Papers of the Cunninghame Graham
Family of Ardoch, Dunbartonshire", Ref. No. GD22/1/275:

"Contract of Marriage between John Drummond, son of Andrew
Drummond, and Cristan Grahame (Graham), daughter of William Grahame
(Graham); the said Cristan to be infeft in the lands of Middle Myes
(Mye) in liferent. Also the Extract of the Contract registered at
Edinburgh, 20 January 1673." (the parenthetical words are as they
appear on the summary & index)

I apologize that this is past 1600 and that I am not a professional
genealogist and so may not have worded things quite right. For those
interested in royal descents of 19th century immigrants to Canada,
this is an example of such: Elizabeth Graham of Kinpont/Menteith was a
descendant of Margaret Tudor, sister of Henry VIII, and, therefore, of
the early Tudors, the Stewarts & the Plantagenets. The above
Christian Graham was the ancestor of Henrietta Rudyard Clark McInnes
(& her siblings), an immigrant to Ontario in 1840 after some time
spent on Carriacou in the Grenadines. If this is relevant to anyone, I
would appreciate any comments.
The complete URL is:
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/nra/ ... ?FER=F8518

Thank you, Bronwen Edwards


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Gjest

Re: OT? - late 17th & early 18th century

Legg inn av Gjest » 07 jul 2007 01:40:43

On Jul 6, 3:04 pm, WJhonson <wjhon...@aol.com> wrote:
In a message dated 07/05/07 19:55:48 Pacific Standard Time, lostcoo...@yahoo.com writes:
For those
interested in royal descents of 19th century immigrants to Canada,
this is an example of such: Elizabeth Graham of Kinpont/Menteith was a
descendant of Margaret Tudor, sister of Henry VIII,

Bronwen I am interested in exactly how Elizabeth descends from Margaret Tudor, could you give the complete path?
Thanks
Will Johnson

The descent was from James V and one of his concubines (Elphinstone)
through Stewart of Albany, Gray, Menteith, & Kinpont. I don't have the
details to hand at this moment but you can easily find all of
Elizabeth's ancestry on Genealogics. That much is well documented
already. Best, Bronwen

John P. Ravilious

Re: OT? - late 17th & early 18th century

Legg inn av John P. Ravilious » 07 jul 2007 02:24:15

Dear Bronwen,

Congratulations on an excellent find. We're fortunate to have
the resources now being made more readily available by the National
Archives (both UK and Scotland), and appreciate your sharing this
valuable evidence.

Cheers,

John



On Jul 6, 8:40?pm, lostcoo...@yahoo.com wrote:
On Jul 6, 3:04 pm, WJhonson <wjhon...@aol.com> wrote:

In a message dated 07/05/07 19:55:48 Pacific Standard Time, lostcoo...@yahoo.com writes:
For those
interested in royal descents of 19th century immigrants to Canada,
this is an example of such: Elizabeth Graham of Kinpont/Menteith was a
descendant of Margaret Tudor, sister of Henry VIII,

Bronwen I am interested in exactly how Elizabeth descends from Margaret Tudor, could you give the complete path?
Thanks
Will Johnson

The descent was from James V and one of his concubines (Elphinstone)
through Stewart of Albany, Gray, Menteith, & Kinpont. I don't have the
details to hand at this moment but you can easily find all of
Elizabeth's ancestry on Genealogics. That much is well documented
already. Best, Bronwen

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