Margaret Cecil b 1523, daughter of Richard Cecil married Roger Cave,
Gent of Stanford d 1586 and they had at least or exactly nine
children.
One of their daughters Margaret Cave d 1594 married Sir William
Skipwith, Knt (in 1603) of Prestwold d 1610, buried at Prestwold.
AFTER her death, William married again to Jane Roberts d 1630
http://www.burton-on-the-wolds.org.uk/a ... estch3.htm
states that this Skipwith family was not only of Prestwold but also of
Cotes, although I correct them in stating that Henry was the son of
Jane. Jane was his stepmother, all of William Skipwith's six known
children were by his wife Margaret Cave
I also cite :
A Genealogical and Historical Account of the Throckmorton family in
England and the United States, C Wickliffe Throckmorton. Old Dominion
Press, Richmond VA. 1930
In support of an extension to Leo's great database which includes
numerous descents from Richard Cecil, I cite
http://books.google.com/books?vid=OCLC0 ... A27-PA1,M1
Burke's Extinct and Dormant Baronetcies, page 403 "Pate of Sysonby"
amending "William Skipwith of Cotes" to "William Skipwith of
Prestwould and Cotes" - Will Johnson
which work states that Sir John Pate, Bart of Sysonby or Sisonby
married firstly to Elizabeth Skipwith dau of William Skipwith of Cotes
and by her, who died 17 Aug 1628 aged 37 he had...
and then goes on to name some children among whom we see
Abigail Pate who d 25 Oct 1691 after marrying Thomas Smith, 1st Bart
of Hatherton, Cheshire (died 22 May 1675)
IF I can now prove that they married *before* 1661 than the rest of my
day would probably be spent, lowering the Cecil numbers of a few
hundred people who I have already attached to this same Thomas Smith
previously.
This also gives us a few more generations of Cecil descendents as
Thomas Smith and Abigail Pate had at least one grandchild.
Will Johnson
More Cecil descents in Skipwith family
Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper
-
wjhonson
Re: More Cecil descents in Skipwith family
Margaret Cecil b 1523, the sister to William Cecil, Lord Burghley
married twice.
Her first husband was Roger Cave, Gent of Stanford by whom she had at
least or exactly nine children. Roger died in 1586 and Margaret
married secondly to "Ambrose Smith of Bosworth" as he is called.
Of course this name gets us nowhere.
Luckily today several pieces fell together.
Margaret's second husband was not "Ambrose" but rather named "Erasmus"
Erasmus by his first wife, a Bydd, they had at least two children
1) Henry the "silver-tongued" Smith, lecturer at St Clement Dane's who
was buried 4 Jul 1591 at Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
2) Sir Roger Smith alias Harris of Husbands Bosworth and Edmonthorpe,
Leicestershire who died 1655 "age 84" after marrying Anna Goodman (d
1652 age 66) dau of Thomas Goodman of London
2.1) Erasmus Smith (1611-91) who has a DNB entry, baptised at
Husbands Bosworth and buried at Hamerton, Huntingdonshire married Mary
Hare dau of Hugh Hare, 1st Baron Coleraine who descends from the Hares
of Stow Bardolph
2.1.1) Hugh Smith of Weald Hall, Essex, fourth son, (1672-1745) who
married Dorothy Barrett-Lennard, of royal descent in at least three
different ways
2.1.1.1) Lucy Smith d 1759 at Preston, Lincs m James Stanley-Smith
2.1.1.1.1) Edward Stanley, 12th Earl of Derby b 1752
Returning to Erasmus Smith, Smyth or Smythe of Husbands Bosworth, he
was the son of that John Smith alias Harris of Withcote or Withcock,
Leics by his wife Dorothy Cave. This same Dorothy Cave being the aunt
of Margaret Cecil's first husband Roger Cave.
If anyone has more details on Erasmus Smith and his Smith ancestors,
siblings, etc I would be interested to know it.
Meanwhile I present some documents on Erasmus.
Will Johnson
Northamptonshire Record Office: Thornton (Brockhall) Collection [Th 1a
- Th 2059]
THORNTON (BROCKHALL)
Catalogue Ref. Th
Creator(s): Thornton family of Brockhall, Northamptonshire
FILE [no title] - ref. Th 269 - date: 28/10/[1591]
[from Scope and Content] To (2) Erasmus Smythe of Boresworth (Leics.)
- gent
----------------------------------
Leicestershire, Leicester and Rutland Record Office: Turville
Constable-Maxwell Manuscripts
Catalogue of the TURVILE CONSTABLE - MAXWELL MANUSCRIPTS
Catalogue Ref. 056-DG39
Creator(s): Fortescue family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
Turville family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
TITLE DEEDS
LEICESTERSHIRE
HUSBANDS BOSWORTH
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/5A - date: 16 April 1594
[from Scope and Content] (ii) Erasmus Smythe, gent., Bosworth.
-------------------------------
Leicestershire, Leicester and Rutland Record Office: Turville
Constable-Maxwell Manuscripts
Catalogue of the TURVILE CONSTABLE - MAXWELL MANUSCRIPTS
Catalogue Ref. 056-DG39
Creator(s): Fortescue family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
Turville family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
MANORIAL RECORDS
MANOR OF HUSBANDS BOSWORTH
Court Rolls
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/655 - date: 5th April 1598
[from Scope and Content] Court Baron of Erasmus Smith, esq and Roger
Smith, gent, held at Boresworth
---------------------------
Leicestershire, Leicester and Rutland Record Office: Turville
Constable-Maxwell Manuscripts
Catalogue of the TURVILE CONSTABLE - MAXWELL MANUSCRIPTS
Catalogue Ref. 056-DG39
Creator(s): Fortescue family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
Turville family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
TITLE DEEDS
LEICESTERSHIRE
Husbands Bosworth manor and manor house.
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/219 - date: 1st November 1593
[from Scope and Content] (ii) Erasmus Smyth, gent., Bosworth.
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/220 - date: Easter 1594
[from Scope and Content] (i) Erasmus Smyth esq. querents
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/221 - date: 4th October 1597
[from Scope and Content] (i) Erasmus Smyth, esq., Husbands Bosworth.
Husbands Bosworth Bakehouse
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/290 - date: 16th August 1589
[from Scope and Content] Witnesses: Erasmus Smyth, Thomas Arnsby,
Roger Smith, Thomas Rogers.
married twice.
Her first husband was Roger Cave, Gent of Stanford by whom she had at
least or exactly nine children. Roger died in 1586 and Margaret
married secondly to "Ambrose Smith of Bosworth" as he is called.
Of course this name gets us nowhere.
Luckily today several pieces fell together.
Margaret's second husband was not "Ambrose" but rather named "Erasmus"
Erasmus by his first wife, a Bydd, they had at least two children
1) Henry the "silver-tongued" Smith, lecturer at St Clement Dane's who
was buried 4 Jul 1591 at Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
2) Sir Roger Smith alias Harris of Husbands Bosworth and Edmonthorpe,
Leicestershire who died 1655 "age 84" after marrying Anna Goodman (d
1652 age 66) dau of Thomas Goodman of London
2.1) Erasmus Smith (1611-91) who has a DNB entry, baptised at
Husbands Bosworth and buried at Hamerton, Huntingdonshire married Mary
Hare dau of Hugh Hare, 1st Baron Coleraine who descends from the Hares
of Stow Bardolph
2.1.1) Hugh Smith of Weald Hall, Essex, fourth son, (1672-1745) who
married Dorothy Barrett-Lennard, of royal descent in at least three
different ways
2.1.1.1) Lucy Smith d 1759 at Preston, Lincs m James Stanley-Smith
2.1.1.1.1) Edward Stanley, 12th Earl of Derby b 1752
Returning to Erasmus Smith, Smyth or Smythe of Husbands Bosworth, he
was the son of that John Smith alias Harris of Withcote or Withcock,
Leics by his wife Dorothy Cave. This same Dorothy Cave being the aunt
of Margaret Cecil's first husband Roger Cave.
If anyone has more details on Erasmus Smith and his Smith ancestors,
siblings, etc I would be interested to know it.
Meanwhile I present some documents on Erasmus.
Will Johnson
Northamptonshire Record Office: Thornton (Brockhall) Collection [Th 1a
- Th 2059]
THORNTON (BROCKHALL)
Catalogue Ref. Th
Creator(s): Thornton family of Brockhall, Northamptonshire
FILE [no title] - ref. Th 269 - date: 28/10/[1591]
[from Scope and Content] To (2) Erasmus Smythe of Boresworth (Leics.)
- gent
----------------------------------
Leicestershire, Leicester and Rutland Record Office: Turville
Constable-Maxwell Manuscripts
Catalogue of the TURVILE CONSTABLE - MAXWELL MANUSCRIPTS
Catalogue Ref. 056-DG39
Creator(s): Fortescue family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
Turville family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
TITLE DEEDS
LEICESTERSHIRE
HUSBANDS BOSWORTH
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/5A - date: 16 April 1594
[from Scope and Content] (ii) Erasmus Smythe, gent., Bosworth.
-------------------------------
Leicestershire, Leicester and Rutland Record Office: Turville
Constable-Maxwell Manuscripts
Catalogue of the TURVILE CONSTABLE - MAXWELL MANUSCRIPTS
Catalogue Ref. 056-DG39
Creator(s): Fortescue family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
Turville family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
MANORIAL RECORDS
MANOR OF HUSBANDS BOSWORTH
Court Rolls
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/655 - date: 5th April 1598
[from Scope and Content] Court Baron of Erasmus Smith, esq and Roger
Smith, gent, held at Boresworth
---------------------------
Leicestershire, Leicester and Rutland Record Office: Turville
Constable-Maxwell Manuscripts
Catalogue of the TURVILE CONSTABLE - MAXWELL MANUSCRIPTS
Catalogue Ref. 056-DG39
Creator(s): Fortescue family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
Turville family of Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
TITLE DEEDS
LEICESTERSHIRE
Husbands Bosworth manor and manor house.
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/219 - date: 1st November 1593
[from Scope and Content] (ii) Erasmus Smyth, gent., Bosworth.
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/220 - date: Easter 1594
[from Scope and Content] (i) Erasmus Smyth esq. querents
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/221 - date: 4th October 1597
[from Scope and Content] (i) Erasmus Smyth, esq., Husbands Bosworth.
Husbands Bosworth Bakehouse
FILE [no title] - ref. DG39/290 - date: 16th August 1589
[from Scope and Content] Witnesses: Erasmus Smyth, Thomas Arnsby,
Roger Smith, Thomas Rogers.
-
Leo van de Pas
Re: More Cecil descents in Skipwith family
Dear Will,
You have me thoroughly confused................which is not difficult to do

If Abigail Pate and Sir Thomas Smith Bart are married before 1661, why
should that reduce the Cecil numbers, and how have you attached a few
hundred people to this same Thomas Smith?
In the Complete Baronetage Volume III page 112 it is given they were married
_in or before 1659_
I have no children at all for this couple. The Complete Baronetage only
gives he died without sons and was succeeded as Baronet by a nephew.
Don't know how far this will help you.
Leo
----- Original Message -----
From: "wjhonson" <wjhonson@aol.com>
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
To: <gen-medieval@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Friday, March 23, 2007 4:29 AM
Subject: More Cecil descents in Skipwith family
You have me thoroughly confused................which is not difficult to do
If Abigail Pate and Sir Thomas Smith Bart are married before 1661, why
should that reduce the Cecil numbers, and how have you attached a few
hundred people to this same Thomas Smith?
In the Complete Baronetage Volume III page 112 it is given they were married
_in or before 1659_
I have no children at all for this couple. The Complete Baronetage only
gives he died without sons and was succeeded as Baronet by a nephew.
Don't know how far this will help you.
Leo
----- Original Message -----
From: "wjhonson" <wjhonson@aol.com>
Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
To: <gen-medieval@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Friday, March 23, 2007 4:29 AM
Subject: More Cecil descents in Skipwith family
Margaret Cecil b 1523, daughter of Richard Cecil married Roger Cave,
Gent of Stanford d 1586 and they had at least or exactly nine
children.
One of their daughters Margaret Cave d 1594 married Sir William
Skipwith, Knt (in 1603) of Prestwold d 1610, buried at Prestwold.
AFTER her death, William married again to Jane Roberts d 1630
http://www.burton-on-the-wolds.org.uk/a ... estch3.htm
states that this Skipwith family was not only of Prestwold but also of
Cotes, although I correct them in stating that Henry was the son of
Jane. Jane was his stepmother, all of William Skipwith's six known
children were by his wife Margaret Cave
I also cite :
A Genealogical and Historical Account of the Throckmorton family in
England and the United States, C Wickliffe Throckmorton. Old Dominion
Press, Richmond VA. 1930
In support of an extension to Leo's great database which includes
numerous descents from Richard Cecil, I cite
http://books.google.com/books?vid=OCLC0 ... A27-PA1,M1
Burke's Extinct and Dormant Baronetcies, page 403 "Pate of Sysonby"
amending "William Skipwith of Cotes" to "William Skipwith of
Prestwould and Cotes" - Will Johnson
which work states that Sir John Pate, Bart of Sysonby or Sisonby
married firstly to Elizabeth Skipwith dau of William Skipwith of Cotes
and by her, who died 17 Aug 1628 aged 37 he had...
and then goes on to name some children among whom we see
Abigail Pate who d 25 Oct 1691 after marrying Thomas Smith, 1st Bart
of Hatherton, Cheshire (died 22 May 1675)
IF I can now prove that they married *before* 1661 than the rest of my
day would probably be spent, lowering the Cecil numbers of a few
hundred people who I have already attached to this same Thomas Smith
previously.
This also gives us a few more generations of Cecil descendents as
Thomas Smith and Abigail Pate had at least one grandchild.
Will Johnson
-------------------------------
To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
GEN-MEDIEVAL-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the
quotes in the subject and the body of the message
-
Tim Powys-Lybbe
Re: More Cecil descents in Skipwith family
In message of 23 Mar, "wjhonson" <wjhonson@aol.com> wrote:
Very interesting.
Have you seen the Leics 1619 visitation book which has on p. 66 an
account of this family? Margaret Cecil is listed as the second wife of
Erasmus whose children are ubdeed all given to his first wife, a
daughter of a Baiard (sometimes written Bayard). Though there are a few
too many blanks for this family to be confident of the details.
--
Tim Powys-Lybbe tim@powys.org
For a miscellany of bygones: http://powys.org/
Margaret Cecil b 1523, the sister to William Cecil, Lord Burghley
married twice.
Her first husband was Roger Cave, Gent of Stanford by whom she had at
least or exactly nine children. Roger died in 1586 and Margaret
married secondly to "Ambrose Smith of Bosworth" as he is called.
Of course this name gets us nowhere.
Luckily today several pieces fell together.
Margaret's second husband was not "Ambrose" but rather named "Erasmus"
Erasmus by his first wife, a Bydd, they had at least two children
1) Henry the "silver-tongued" Smith, lecturer at St Clement Dane's who
was buried 4 Jul 1591 at Husbands Bosworth, Leicestershire
2) Sir Roger Smith alias Harris of Husbands Bosworth and Edmonthorpe,
Leicestershire who died 1655 "age 84" after marrying Anna Goodman (d
1652 age 66) dau of Thomas Goodman of London
2.1) Erasmus Smith (1611-91) who has a DNB entry, baptised at
Husbands Bosworth and buried at Hamerton, Huntingdonshire married Mary
Hare dau of Hugh Hare, 1st Baron Coleraine who descends from the Hares
of Stow Bardolph
2.1.1) Hugh Smith of Weald Hall, Essex, fourth son, (1672-1745) who
married Dorothy Barrett-Lennard, of royal descent in at least three
different ways
2.1.1.1) Lucy Smith d 1759 at Preston, Lincs m James Stanley-Smith
2.1.1.1.1) Edward Stanley, 12th Earl of Derby b 1752
Returning to Erasmus Smith, Smyth or Smythe of Husbands Bosworth, he
was the son of that John Smith alias Harris of Withcote or Withcock,
Leics by his wife Dorothy Cave. This same Dorothy Cave being the aunt
of Margaret Cecil's first husband Roger Cave.
If anyone has more details on Erasmus Smith and his Smith ancestors,
siblings, etc I would be interested to know it.
Very interesting.
Have you seen the Leics 1619 visitation book which has on p. 66 an
account of this family? Margaret Cecil is listed as the second wife of
Erasmus whose children are ubdeed all given to his first wife, a
daughter of a Baiard (sometimes written Bayard). Though there are a few
too many blanks for this family to be confident of the details.
--
Tim Powys-Lybbe tim@powys.org
For a miscellany of bygones: http://powys.org/