I would like to confirm whether Joan was the daughter of Henry Fitz
Hugh, 3d Lord Fitz Hugh, of Ravensworth in Richmondshire, Yorkshire, and
wife Elizabeth Grey. Magna Carta Ancestry, page 340, states she was one
of six daughters and married Robert Willoughby, 6th Lord Willoughby of
Eresby.
However, in apparent conflict, Magna Carta Ancestors, page 887, states
that Robert Willoughby, 6th Lord Willoughby of Eresby, married (1st)
before 21 Feb 1420/1 Elizabeth Montagu.
Leo Van de Pas' website states that Robert Willoughby, 6th Lord
Willoughby de Eresby, married (1) Lady Elizabeth Montagu before 21 Feb
1421 and that they had a daughter Joane, Baroness Willoughby de Eresby.
The Bradley web site states that Joan Fitz Hugh, born 1438, Ravensworth,
North Riding, Yorkshire, to Robert Willoughby and Elizabeth Montagu,
married Sir John Scrope, Lord Scrope on 22 Nov 1447.
I would be very appreciative of any information which will help to
clarify the parents and husband of this Joan(e).
Marilyn
Regarding Fitz Hugh and Willoughby marriage
Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper
-
Tim Powys-Lybbe
Re: Regarding Fitz Hugh and Willoughby marriage
In message of 17 Jul, sysite@swbell.net (Symonds) wrote:
Complete Peerage (hereinafter CP) says, Vol XII/2, pp.665-6, that Robt
Willoughby m. (1) bef 21 Feb 1420/1 Elizabeth de Montague and (2) bef 9
Jan 1448/9 Maud Stanhope.
There is no correction to this in CP Vol XIV.
However there are two items on Chris Phillips' CP Corrigenda site in the
proposed section:
http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/cp/p_fitzhugh.shtml
http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/cp/ ... esby.shtml
but my guess is that the FitzHugh chart pedigree on Vol V, pp. 432/3 is
not right, though it may be the source for the entry in Magna Carta
Ancestry.
CP is usually far more reliable than other compendiums, by virtue of its
research methods and most of them use CP as a reference. Its cost
reflected the massive scholarship that went into it. And that is why
people think it worth maintaining, first by Vol XIV, the Corrigenda
Volume, and second by Chris Phillips' site for more recent discoveries.
--
Tim Powys-Lybbe tim@powys.org
For a miscellany of bygones: http://powys.org/
I would like to confirm whether Joan was the daughter of Henry Fitz
Hugh, 3d Lord Fitz Hugh, of Ravensworth in Richmondshire, Yorkshire, and
wife Elizabeth Grey. Magna Carta Ancestry, page 340, states she was one
of six daughters and married Robert Willoughby, 6th Lord Willoughby of
Eresby.
However, in apparent conflict, Magna Carta Ancestors, page 887, states
that Robert Willoughby, 6th Lord Willoughby of Eresby, married (1st)
before 21 Feb 1420/1 Elizabeth Montagu.
Leo Van de Pas' website states that Robert Willoughby, 6th Lord
Willoughby de Eresby, married (1) Lady Elizabeth Montagu before 21 Feb
1421 and that they had a daughter Joane, Baroness Willoughby de Eresby.
The Bradley web site states that Joan Fitz Hugh, born 1438, Ravensworth,
North Riding, Yorkshire, to Robert Willoughby and Elizabeth Montagu,
married Sir John Scrope, Lord Scrope on 22 Nov 1447.
I would be very appreciative of any information which will help to
clarify the parents and husband of this Joan(e).
Complete Peerage (hereinafter CP) says, Vol XII/2, pp.665-6, that Robt
Willoughby m. (1) bef 21 Feb 1420/1 Elizabeth de Montague and (2) bef 9
Jan 1448/9 Maud Stanhope.
There is no correction to this in CP Vol XIV.
However there are two items on Chris Phillips' CP Corrigenda site in the
proposed section:
http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/cp/p_fitzhugh.shtml
http://www.medievalgenealogy.org.uk/cp/ ... esby.shtml
but my guess is that the FitzHugh chart pedigree on Vol V, pp. 432/3 is
not right, though it may be the source for the entry in Magna Carta
Ancestry.
CP is usually far more reliable than other compendiums, by virtue of its
research methods and most of them use CP as a reference. Its cost
reflected the massive scholarship that went into it. And that is why
people think it worth maintaining, first by Vol XIV, the Corrigenda
Volume, and second by Chris Phillips' site for more recent discoveries.
--
Tim Powys-Lybbe tim@powys.org
For a miscellany of bygones: http://powys.org/
-
CE Wood
Re: Regarding Fitz Hugh and Willoughby marriage
The Joan FitzHugh (d 1470 [CP XI:545]) who married John, 5th Lord
Scrope [CP 434f & XI:545] was the daughter of William 4th Lord FitzHugh
and Margery de Willoughby. [CP V:434f] She was the granddaughter of
Henry, 3rd Lord FitzHugh and Elizabeth de Grey.
The Joan FitzHugh who was one of 3 wives of Robert, 6th Lord de
Willoughby of Eresby [CP 434f] was her aunt, the daughter of Henry, 3rd
Lord FitzHugh and Elizabeth de Grey. [CP V:434f]
CE Wood
Symonds wrote:
Scrope [CP 434f & XI:545] was the daughter of William 4th Lord FitzHugh
and Margery de Willoughby. [CP V:434f] She was the granddaughter of
Henry, 3rd Lord FitzHugh and Elizabeth de Grey.
The Joan FitzHugh who was one of 3 wives of Robert, 6th Lord de
Willoughby of Eresby [CP 434f] was her aunt, the daughter of Henry, 3rd
Lord FitzHugh and Elizabeth de Grey. [CP V:434f]
CE Wood
Symonds wrote:
I would like to confirm whether Joan was the daughter of Henry Fitz
Hugh, 3d Lord Fitz Hugh, of Ravensworth in Richmondshire, Yorkshire, and
wife Elizabeth Grey. Magna Carta Ancestry, page 340, states she was one
of six daughters and married Robert Willoughby, 6th Lord Willoughby of
Eresby.
However, in apparent conflict, Magna Carta Ancestors, page 887, states
that Robert Willoughby, 6th Lord Willoughby of Eresby, married (1st)
before 21 Feb 1420/1 Elizabeth Montagu.
Leo Van de Pas' website states that Robert Willoughby, 6th Lord
Willoughby de Eresby, married (1) Lady Elizabeth Montagu before 21 Feb
1421 and that they had a daughter Joane, Baroness Willoughby de Eresby.
The Bradley web site states that Joan Fitz Hugh, born 1438, Ravensworth,
North Riding, Yorkshire, to Robert Willoughby and Elizabeth Montagu,
married Sir John Scrope, Lord Scrope on 22 Nov 1447.
I would be very appreciative of any information which will help to
clarify the parents and husband of this Joan(e).
Marilyn
-
Gjest
Re: Regarding Fitz Hugh and Willoughby marriage
This makes more sense since Robert, the 6th Lord Willoughby's line dies
out and eventually the descendant of his brother Thomas, Christopher
becomes the 10th Lord.
Martin
CE Wood wrote:
out and eventually the descendant of his brother Thomas, Christopher
becomes the 10th Lord.
Martin
CE Wood wrote:
The Joan FitzHugh (d 1470 [CP XI:545]) who married John, 5th Lord
Scrope [CP 434f & XI:545] was the daughter of William 4th Lord FitzHugh
and Margery de Willoughby. [CP V:434f] She was the granddaughter of
Henry, 3rd Lord FitzHugh and Elizabeth de Grey.
The Joan FitzHugh who was one of 3 wives of Robert, 6th Lord de
Willoughby of Eresby [CP 434f] was her aunt, the daughter of Henry, 3rd
Lord FitzHugh and Elizabeth de Grey. [CP V:434f]
CE Wood
-
Symonds
Re: Regarding Fitz Hugh and Willoughby marriage
My thanks to Will Johnson, to C. E. Wood, and especially to Tim
Powys-Lybbe for their responses to the questions surrounding Joan Fitz
Hugh and Robert Willoughby (c. 1385-1452), 6th Lord Willoughby de Eresby.
It seems that documentary evidence for establishing the marriage is not
yet found. But, if Joan Fitz Hugh (daughter of Henry Fitz Hugh and
Elizabeth Gray) was Robt Willoughby's first wife, it would seem probable
that her birth year was within say ten years of his, i.e. 1385-1395.
And, it is at least possible that she was his first wife and that she
died before his marriage before 21 February 1421 to Elizabeth Montagu
when he was perhaps as much as 36 years old.
Marilyn
Powys-Lybbe for their responses to the questions surrounding Joan Fitz
Hugh and Robert Willoughby (c. 1385-1452), 6th Lord Willoughby de Eresby.
It seems that documentary evidence for establishing the marriage is not
yet found. But, if Joan Fitz Hugh (daughter of Henry Fitz Hugh and
Elizabeth Gray) was Robt Willoughby's first wife, it would seem probable
that her birth year was within say ten years of his, i.e. 1385-1395.
And, it is at least possible that she was his first wife and that she
died before his marriage before 21 February 1421 to Elizabeth Montagu
when he was perhaps as much as 36 years old.
Marilyn