Powys Fadog & Arderne Ancestry of Isabell (Radclyffe) Harrin

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Powys Fadog & Arderne Ancestry of Isabell (Radclyffe) Harrin

Legg inn av Gjest » 02 jun 2006 06:14:02

I have had to rely on secondary sources in following this lineage and am
hoping others might be able to fill in more detail or corrections with more
direct documentation.

1. Gruffudd ap Madog, Prince of Powys Fadog, lord of Maelawr Gymraeg,
Maelawr Saesneg, Chirk, Mochnant is Rhaiadr, Ial, Ystrad Alun, Yr Hob, Cynllaith,
Nanheudwy, and Glyndyfrdwy.
died 7 Dec. 1269 and buried at Valle Crucis Abbey
married Emma, daughter of Henry de Alditheley (d. 1246).

2. Margaret (ferch Gruffudd)
In 1269 she and her husband were granted by deed the manor of Congleton by
her father-in-law. She was married to John de Arderne (d. 1307) of Aldford
and Alvanley (in Edisbury Hundred), Cheshire. The marriage of their son John
with Alice Venables, daughter of Hugh Venables, was arranged in 1307.

3. Matilda (Maud) de Arderne
In 1303 a moiety of Mobberley (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire was granted in
arrangement for the marriage of this daughter with John Legh, son of John
Legh of Booths.

4. John Legh of Booths (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire.
Married to Elizabeth, daughter and heiress of Richard de Sandbach of
Sandbach (in Northwich Hundred), Cheshire. In 2 Edw. II John de Arderne of Aldford
sold to Hugh Venables the marriage and wardship of Richard de Sandbach.

5. Elizabeth Legh
She brought the manor of Sandbach and other property as an heiress in
marriage to Richard Radclyffe (d. 1380) of Ordsall, Lancashire.

6. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1422.

7. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1442

8. Alexander Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall.
Died 1475.

9. Isabell Radclyffe, wife of James Harrington (d. 26 Jun. 1491), Knt.
She died 20 Jun. 1518 holding Brixworth manor (in Orlingbury Hundred),
Northamptonshire.


I appreciate any assistance in further detailing this line. I am chiefly
interested in it as it connects to my Eltonhead ancestry.

Todd Whitesides

Tim Powys-Lybbe

Re: Powys Fadog & Arderne Ancestry of Isabell (Radclyffe) Ha

Legg inn av Tim Powys-Lybbe » 02 jun 2006 08:46:28

In message of 2 Jun, ToddWhitesides@aol.com wrote:

I have had to rely on secondary sources in following this lineage and
am hoping others might be able to fill in more detail or
corrections with more direct documentation.

Ormerod's Cheshire is also a secondary source but much of it is well
documented and appears to be from surviving documents of the times
concerned. Pages 77 to 87 of Volume II cover the Ardernes.

1. Gruffudd ap Madog, Prince of Powys Fadog, lord of Maelawr Gymraeg,
Maelawr Saesneg, Chirk, Mochnant is Rhaiadr, Ial, Ystrad Alun, Yr
Hob, Cynllaith, Nanheudwy, and Glyndyfrdwy. died 7 Dec. 1269 and
buried at Valle Crucis Abbey married Emma, daughter of Henry de
Alditheley (d. 1246).

2. Margaret (ferch Gruffudd)
In 1269 she and her husband were granted by deed the manor of
Congleton by her father-in-law. She was married to John de Arderne
(d. 1307) of Aldford and Alvanley (in Edisbury Hundred), Cheshire.
The marriage of their son John with Alice Venables, daughter of
Hugh Venables, was arranged in 1307.

3. Matilda (Maud) de Arderne
In 1303 a moiety of Mobberley (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire was
granted in arrangement for the marriage of this daughter with John
Legh, son of John Legh of Booths.

No problem so far. Not checked the details but the people are those
seen by Ormerod. Moving on to the Leghs, they are in Volume I, pp.
494-500 (with an entertaining account of how Ormerod was refused sight
of the Legh deeds so could not do the pedigree; however the editor of
the second edition managed to find a more complaisant owner of same).

4. John Legh of Booths (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire. Married to
Elizabeth, daughter and heiress of Richard de Sandbach of Sandbach
(in Northwich Hundred), Cheshire. In 2 Edw. II John de Arderne of
Aldford sold to Hugh Venables the marriage and wardship of Richard
de Sandbach.

5. Elizabeth Legh
She brought the manor of Sandbach and other property as an heiress in
marriage to Richard Radclyffe (d. 1380) of Ordsall, Lancashire.

OK to this marriage. Unfortunately Ormerod does not do Lancashire, nor
do I have any volumes on same.

6. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1422.

7. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1442

8. Alexander Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall.
Died 1475.

9. Isabell Radclyffe, wife of James Harrington (d. 26 Jun. 1491), Knt.
She died 20 Jun. 1518 holding Brixworth manor (in Orlingbury Hundred),
Northamptonshire.



--
Tim Powys-Lybbe                                          tim@powys.org
             For a miscellany of bygones: http://powys.org

Sutliff

Re: Powys Fadog & Arderne Ancestry of Isabell (Radclyffe) Ha

Legg inn av Sutliff » 02 jun 2006 19:17:42

As far as I can document, everything here is correct with one possible
exception. And it is a minor one at that. I think the wife of Richard
Radclyffe d. 1380 was named Maud, not Elizabeth. Otherwise, all appears to
be correct.

HS

<ToddWhitesides@aol.com> wrote in message
news:470.26ce9d6.31b11467@aol.com...
I have had to rely on secondary sources in following this lineage and am
hoping others might be able to fill in more detail or corrections with
more
direct documentation.

1. Gruffudd ap Madog, Prince of Powys Fadog, lord of Maelawr Gymraeg,
Maelawr Saesneg, Chirk, Mochnant is Rhaiadr, Ial, Ystrad Alun, Yr Hob,
Cynllaith,
Nanheudwy, and Glyndyfrdwy.
died 7 Dec. 1269 and buried at Valle Crucis Abbey
married Emma, daughter of Henry de Alditheley (d. 1246).

2. Margaret (ferch Gruffudd)
In 1269 she and her husband were granted by deed the manor of Congleton by
her father-in-law. She was married to John de Arderne (d. 1307) of
Aldford
and Alvanley (in Edisbury Hundred), Cheshire. The marriage of their son
John
with Alice Venables, daughter of Hugh Venables, was arranged in 1307.

3. Matilda (Maud) de Arderne
In 1303 a moiety of Mobberley (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire was granted
in
arrangement for the marriage of this daughter with John Legh, son of John
Legh of Booths.

4. John Legh of Booths (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire.
Married to Elizabeth, daughter and heiress of Richard de Sandbach of
Sandbach (in Northwich Hundred), Cheshire. In 2 Edw. II John de Arderne
of Aldford
sold to Hugh Venables the marriage and wardship of Richard de Sandbach.

5. Elizabeth Legh
She brought the manor of Sandbach and other property as an heiress in
marriage to Richard Radclyffe (d. 1380) of Ordsall, Lancashire.

6. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1422.

7. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1442

8. Alexander Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall.
Died 1475.

9. Isabell Radclyffe, wife of James Harrington (d. 26 Jun. 1491), Knt.
She died 20 Jun. 1518 holding Brixworth manor (in Orlingbury Hundred),
Northamptonshire.


I appreciate any assistance in further detailing this line. I am chiefly
interested in it as it connects to my Eltonhead ancestry.

Todd Whitesides


Gordon and Jane Kirkemo

RE: Powys Fadog & Arderne Ancestry of Isabell (Radclyffe) Ha

Legg inn av Gordon and Jane Kirkemo » 02 jun 2006 21:56:02

Todd,

I might have some leads regarding the Lancaster portion of your line. I
hope this will be helpful. Please see below.

Sincerely,
Gordon Kirkemo

-----Original Message-----
From: ToddWhitesides@aol.com [mailto:ToddWhitesides@aol.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 9:11 PM
To: GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com
Subject: Powys Fadog & Arderne Ancestry of Isabell (Radclyffe) Harrington
(d. 1518)

I have had to rely on secondary sources in following this lineage and am
hoping others might be able to fill in more detail or corrections with more

direct documentation.

1. Gruffudd ap Madog, Prince of Powys Fadog, lord of Maelawr Gymraeg,
Maelawr Saesneg, Chirk, Mochnant is Rhaiadr, Ial, Ystrad Alun, Yr Hob,
Cynllaith,
Nanheudwy, and Glyndyfrdwy.
died 7 Dec. 1269 and buried at Valle Crucis Abbey
married Emma, daughter of Henry de Alditheley (d. 1246).

2. Margaret (ferch Gruffudd)
In 1269 she and her husband were granted by deed the manor of Congleton by
her father-in-law. She was married to John de Arderne (d. 1307) of Aldford

and Alvanley (in Edisbury Hundred), Cheshire. The marriage of their son
John
with Alice Venables, daughter of Hugh Venables, was arranged in 1307.

3. Matilda (Maud) de Arderne
In 1303 a moiety of Mobberley (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire was granted in

arrangement for the marriage of this daughter with John Legh, son of John
Legh of Booths.

4. John Legh of Booths (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire.
Married to Elizabeth, daughter and heiress of Richard de Sandbach of
Sandbach (in Northwich Hundred), Cheshire. In 2 Edw. II John de Arderne of
Aldford
sold to Hugh Venables the marriage and wardship of Richard de Sandbach.

5. Elizabeth Legh
She brought the manor of Sandbach and other property as an heiress in
marriage to Richard Radclyffe (d. 1380) of Ordsall, Lancashire.

I have her as Maude/Matilda. My sources include Ormerod and "The Magna
Charta Sureties" (MCS) by Weis (Line 129, #8, page 169).

6. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1422.

I have his wife as Margaret de Trafford, daughter of Sir Henry de Trafford.
Source: MCS Line 129, #9, page 169.

7. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1442

I have his wife as Clemency Standish, daughter of Hugh Standish (of Duxbury)
and Alice Standish (of Standish). Sources: Burkes Commoners and MCS Line
129, #10, page 169.


8. Alexander Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall.
Died 1475.

I have his wife as Agnes Harrington, daughter of William Harrington and
Margaret Neville. Sources: MCS Line 129, #11, page 169, and AR7 Lines 35
and 36 on page 40.

9. Isabell Radclyffe, wife of James Harrington (d. 26 Jun. 1491), Knt.
She died 20 Jun. 1518 holding Brixworth manor (in Orlingbury Hundred),
Northamptonshire.


I appreciate any assistance in further detailing this line. I am chiefly
interested in it as it connects to my Eltonhead ancestry.

Todd Whitesides


______________________________

John Higgins

Re: Powys Fadog & Arderne Ancestry of Isabell (Radclyffe) Ha

Legg inn av John Higgins » 03 jun 2006 06:20:03

If you're looking for information on the Radclyffe part of this line, a
place to start is Charles Hampson, "The Book of the Radclyffes" (Edinburgh,
1940). Although a secondary source itself, it generally cites contemporary
materials. If I can answer any questions on this part of the line, let me
know....

----- Original Message -----
From: <ToddWhitesides@aol.com>
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 9:11 PM
Subject: Powys Fadog & Arderne Ancestry of Isabell (Radclyffe) Harrington
(d. 1518)


I have had to rely on secondary sources in following this lineage and am
hoping others might be able to fill in more detail or corrections with
more
direct documentation.

1. Gruffudd ap Madog, Prince of Powys Fadog, lord of Maelawr Gymraeg,
Maelawr Saesneg, Chirk, Mochnant is Rhaiadr, Ial, Ystrad Alun, Yr Hob,
Cynllaith,
Nanheudwy, and Glyndyfrdwy.
died 7 Dec. 1269 and buried at Valle Crucis Abbey
married Emma, daughter of Henry de Alditheley (d. 1246).

2. Margaret (ferch Gruffudd)
In 1269 she and her husband were granted by deed the manor of Congleton by
her father-in-law. She was married to John de Arderne (d. 1307) of
Aldford
and Alvanley (in Edisbury Hundred), Cheshire. The marriage of their son
John
with Alice Venables, daughter of Hugh Venables, was arranged in 1307.

3. Matilda (Maud) de Arderne
In 1303 a moiety of Mobberley (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire was granted
in
arrangement for the marriage of this daughter with John Legh, son of John
Legh of Booths.

4. John Legh of Booths (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire.
Married to Elizabeth, daughter and heiress of Richard de Sandbach of
Sandbach (in Northwich Hundred), Cheshire. In 2 Edw. II John de Arderne
of Aldford
sold to Hugh Venables the marriage and wardship of Richard de Sandbach.

5. Elizabeth Legh
She brought the manor of Sandbach and other property as an heiress in
marriage to Richard Radclyffe (d. 1380) of Ordsall, Lancashire.

6. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1422.

7. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1442

8. Alexander Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall.
Died 1475.

9. Isabell Radclyffe, wife of James Harrington (d. 26 Jun. 1491), Knt.
She died 20 Jun. 1518 holding Brixworth manor (in Orlingbury Hundred),
Northamptonshire.


I appreciate any assistance in further detailing this line. I am chiefly
interested in it as it connects to my Eltonhead ancestry.

Todd Whitesides



CE Wood

Re: Powys Fadog & Arderne Ancestry of Isabell (Radclyffe) Ha

Legg inn av CE Wood » 03 jun 2006 22:05:18

According to MC Sureties, 129-4,5,6,7, the Matilda (Maud) de Arderne
who married John Legh of Booths, Cheshire, was the daughter of the Sir
John de Arderne, son of Sir Walkelin de Arderne and Agnes de Orreby.

Is Sureties wrong?

CE Wood


ToddWhitesides@aol.com wrote:
I have had to rely on secondary sources in following this lineage and am
hoping others might be able to fill in more detail or corrections with more
direct documentation.

1. Gruffudd ap Madog, Prince of Powys Fadog, lord of Maelawr Gymraeg,
Maelawr Saesneg, Chirk, Mochnant is Rhaiadr, Ial, Ystrad Alun, Yr Hob, Cynllaith,
Nanheudwy, and Glyndyfrdwy.
died 7 Dec. 1269 and buried at Valle Crucis Abbey
married Emma, daughter of Henry de Alditheley (d. 1246).

2. Margaret (ferch Gruffudd)
In 1269 she and her husband were granted by deed the manor of Congleton by
her father-in-law. She was married to John de Arderne (d. 1307) of Aldford
and Alvanley (in Edisbury Hundred), Cheshire. The marriage of their son John
with Alice Venables, daughter of Hugh Venables, was arranged in 1307.

3. Matilda (Maud) de Arderne
In 1303 a moiety of Mobberley (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire was granted in
arrangement for the marriage of this daughter with John Legh, son of John
Legh of Booths.

4. John Legh of Booths (in Bucklow Hundred), Cheshire.
Married to Elizabeth, daughter and heiress of Richard de Sandbach of
Sandbach (in Northwich Hundred), Cheshire. In 2 Edw. II John de Arderne of Aldford
sold to Hugh Venables the marriage and wardship of Richard de Sandbach.

5. Elizabeth Legh
She brought the manor of Sandbach and other property as an heiress in
marriage to Richard Radclyffe (d. 1380) of Ordsall, Lancashire.

6. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1422.

7. John Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall
Died 1442

8. Alexander Radclyffe, Knt., of Ordsall.
Died 1475.

9. Isabell Radclyffe, wife of James Harrington (d. 26 Jun. 1491), Knt.
She died 20 Jun. 1518 holding Brixworth manor (in Orlingbury Hundred),
Northamptonshire.


I appreciate any assistance in further detailing this line. I am chiefly
interested in it as it connects to my Eltonhead ancestry.

Todd Whitesides

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