Maud de Vernon, wife of Richard de la Haye

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Maud de Vernon, wife of Richard de la Haye

Legg inn av Gjest » 18 mai 2006 06:49:02

Wednesday, 17 May, 2006


Hello All,

Several threads on SGM in the past have dealt with the family of
Richard de la Haye (or Haia), of Duddington, co. Northants. and
Brattleby, co. Lincs. I noted earlier today the following partial
extracts available from the Rotuli de Dominabus (1185), which
indicate clearly the following (full extracts pending):

1. The wife of Richard was Maud, or Matilda, de Vernon, daughter
of William de Vernon.

2. The husband of Juliana (or 'Gilla'), 2nd dau. of Richard de
la Haye and Maud de Vernon, was one Richard de Humez. This
may have been identical to the Richard de Humez (Homet, or
Hummet) who d. a monk at Aunay in 1181 (his heir William was
by his wife Agnes de Say).

Certain questions have been, and remain, open, including which
'William de Vernon' was the father of Maud. One William 'de Vernon',
a younger son of Richard de Reviers (d. 1107) and Adelise Peverel
has been suggested before: despite the Devon and other SW England
associations with their known progeny, the Peverel family held
extensive lands in Nottinghamshire, which would match well with
a younger Revier (aka Vernon) son, presumably seated in Notts.,
having a daughter marrying a knight from Lincolnshire/Northants.

Cheers,

John *


from Rotuli de Dominabus
http://books.google.com/books?q=Malet&i ... ZRy0fjZD&d
q=William+Malet+Alice+Picot&ie=ISO-8859-1&pgis=1


p. 12

' Matillis de La Haia, que fuit filia Willelmi de Vernun, et uxor Ricardi
de La Haia, est de donatione Domini Regis, et est .lvij. annorum; et habet
..iij. filias, quarum .j. habet ... '


'... Nicholaa de Haya ' was similarly in the king's gift and holding Swaton
as worth £20 a year (Testa, p. 348). She had married Gerard de Camville (see
text) and was famous as the stalwart supporter of John and his infant son, for
whom she held Lincoln castle (cf. Rot. Scacc. Norm. I, cvi).
For the second daughter, Gille, wife of Richard du Hommet (Manche) see
Rot. Hen II (1164). It was, apparently, the Domesday holding of Helpo
'balistarius'.... '


NOTES:

' 3. This Swaton manor was part of the Domesday fief of Colswegen
('Colsuain'), which was obtained, under Henry I, by Richard de la Haie, as the Lindsey
Survey proves. Maud was widow of that Richard de la Haie who held a
Lincolnshire fief with a service of twenty knights in 1166 (Red Book, p. 390). '


=====================================


DESCENT from William de Vernon


1 William de Vernon
----------------------------------------

Children: Matilda


1.1 Matilda de Vernon
----------------------------------------

' Matillis de La Haia, que fuit filia Willelmi de Vernun, et uxor
Ricardi de La Haia, est de donatione Domini Regis, et est .lvij.
annorum; et habet .iij. filias,... ' [Rot. Dominabus, p. 12[1]]

re: her husband:

of Duddington, co. Northants. [2] and Brattleby, co. Lincs.[3]

fl. ca. 1195 :
According to an Inquisition post mortem in 1293,
'in the time of Richard I [1189-1199], Duddington
belonged to Richard de la Haye..'[4]

constable of Lincoln castle[3]

Spouse: Richard de la Haye[5]
Death: aft 1189[4]
Father: Robert de la Haye (-<1156)
Mother: Muriel of Lincoln

Children: Nicole (-1230)
Juliana
Isabel


1.1.1 Nicole de la Haye[5]
----------------------------------------
Death: 1230[6]

elder daughter and coheiress

acting as hereditary constable ('castellan') of Lincoln, she defended
the city against the baronial opponents of King John under Earl William
of Lincoln, 1216 [Warren, p. 253][7]

originally thought to have had manor of Duddington, co. Northants. as
her maritagium on marriage to Oliver Deincourt: this marriage
disproven, as confusion with her niece Nichole [see CP articles,
Vol IV-Deincourt, p. 118 note c as identified by Cris Nash and
resolved by Rosie Bevan][2],[4]

cf. Rot. Dominabus, p. 12[1]

re: her husband:

lord of Camville

Charter of Gerard de Camvilla dated 1176-83, addressed to Richard
bishop of Chester, confirming to God and St. Mary of Cumba and the
monks of the Cistercian order there serving God, the gift which his
father Richard de Camvilla made to the said abbey, namely the whole
land of Smita to found an abbey of the Cistercian order, with demesne
and other appurtenances in wood and plain, in ways and paths, in land
and water, in meadows and pastures, and in free alms quit from all
earthly service and secular exactions.
Witnesses: Walter de Camvilla, William de Camvill', Richard de
Camvill' his brothers, John de Curci, Simon de Blossevilla. '
[ Seal on tag: circular, brown, c. 2¾ ins. diameter. A ?lion
passant.
Note : For date and seal: see Sir Christopher Hatton's Book of Seals,
p. 8.] - A2A, Shakespeare Birthplace Trust Records Office: Gregory
of Stivichall [DR10/1 - DR10/467] , Combe alias Smite: DR10/194[8]

sheriff of Lincolnshire, 1189[9], and again 1199-1205[10]

according to Inq.p.m. (for later tenant), he 'intruded upon the
manor' of Benham, co. Berks. following the death of his brother
Richard [the manor then escheating to the crown, with Hugh Wake
being enfeoffed by King Richard I][11]

a supporter of John, count of Mortain in the absence of Richard:
' Longchamp [William, bp of Ely and regent] in 1191 removed him
from the shrievalty [of Lincolnshire], and attempted to reduce
Lincoln Castle; but it was stoutly defended by Nicholaa,
Camville himself being with John until the fall of Nottingham and
Tickhill compelled Longchamp to raise the siege. Camville was
excommunicated the same year. On Richard's return in 1194
he was deprived of the wardenship of Lincoln Castle and the
shrievalty of the county, and was arraigned by Longchamp
at Nottingham on a charge of harbouring robbers and
treating the king's writ with contempt. His estates were
forfeited, but he recovered them on payment of a fine of
2,000 marks. His wife also paid a fine of 200 marks...
On the accession of John, Camville was reappointed
warden of Lincoln Castle and sheriff of the county, and
purchased from the king for 1,000 marks the lands of
Thomas de Verdun and the wardship of his widow, with
liberty to marry her to his son Richard. ' [DNB p. 856[12]]

recorded as Sheriff of Lincolnshire, 1200-01:
' 302. Lincolnshire:- Gerard de Canville (Hubert fitz Richard
for him) renders his accunt. ' [Bain I:48[13], cites Pipe Roll
2 John, Rot. 6]

also shown by Anthony Wagner, pedigree of 'English Ancestors of
Edward IV'[5]
first husband of Nichola de la Haye (cf. CP IV:118, sub Deincourt)[2]

had a charter for a market at Stoney Middleton, co. Oxon:
' (Grant: other) gr 1201, by K John to Gerard de Camville
(VCH Oxfordshire, vi, p. 245). '[14]

cf. Painter, p. 84[10]

Spouse: Gerard de Camville[5]
Birth: ca 1150
Death: 1214[6]
Father: Richard de Camville (-ca1176)
Mother: Millicent of Rethel (ca1110-)
Marr: bef 1185[6]

Children: Richard (-<1230)


1.1.1.1 Richard de Camville[5]
----------------------------------------
Death: bef 1230, d.v.m.[3]

of Avington, co. Berks., Godington, Stoney Middleton, and Stratton,
co. Oxon.
lord of Camville

his father purchased the marriage of Eustache Basset, widow of
Thomas de Verdun in 1199 (Paul Reed, FASG citing the Pipe
Rolls)[15],[12]

record from the plea rolls, 1207/8:
' Curia Regis Roll. Mich. 9. John, m. 4.

Oxon. - The Prior of Kenilworth sued Nicholas de Verdun (called
to warranty by Richard de Canvill and Eustachia, his wife) for
the next presentation to the church of Hethe.

Lecelina de Clinton.
I
Bertram de Verdun.
_______I___________________________________________________
I I
Thomas de Verdun, = Eustachia. = Richard de Nicholas de Verdun,
first husband, Canvill, the defendant.
ob. s.p. second husband.
' [Gen XX:165[16]]


Spouse: Eustache Basset[2]
Father: Gilbert Basset (-<1205)
Mother: Egeline de Courtenay
Marr: ca 1199[15],[12]

Children: Idoine (-<1252)


1.1.1.1.1 Idoine de Camville
----------------------------------------
Death: bef 21 Sep 1252[17]

heiress of her father[2], and her grandmother Nichola de la Haye[3]

evidently also heiress of her mother - the manor of Wretchwick,
Oxon. was part of the maritagium of her daughter Ela (m. James de
Audley), and her husband William Longespee had a charter for a
market at Bicester granted 20 Oct 1239[14]

her inheritance included the manor of Brattleby, Lincs.
(CP Vol XI-Salisbury, p. 385n)[2] and a third part of the manor
of Shalford, co. Surrey [see suit brought by Ingram de Preaux,
Sept 1226 - Eyton, vol. V, p. 291][18]


Spouse: Sir William Longespee
Death: 7 Feb 1249, battle of Mansura, Egypt (on crusade)[17]
Birth: bef 12 May 1205[19]
Father: William Longespee (ca1175-1225)
Mother: Ela of Salisbury (ca1187-1261)
Marr: aft Apr 1216[2]

Children: Sir William (-1257)
Ela (-<1299)
Ida (->1261)
Richard (-<1261)


1.1.2 Juliana de la Haye
----------------------------------------

'Julia'
2nd daughter

cf. Rot. Dominabus, p. 12[1]

her husband, evidently Richard de Humez[4]

Spouse: Richard de Humez

Children: Nichole


1.1.2.1 Nichole [de Humez]
----------------------------------------

identified as niece of Nichole de la Haye [CP as noted by
Cris Nash]
received the manor of Duddington as her maritagium from her
aunt, Nichole de la Haye[4]

re: her husband:

of Blankney, co. Lincoln

prob. born ca. 1195 (had livery of lands, 1217)[2]
2nd husband of Nichole de la Haye[2]


grant of lands, undated [est. ? 14th cent] :
" Quitclaim: Robt. Pariteius (Paitei ?) at the will & assent of
Oliver de Aincourt my lord & albr.... & Agnes my spouse & my heirs,
sold for 10 marks & in the court of Oliver my lord quitclaimed from
me & my heirs to Wm. de Aincourt brother of Oliver 6 bovates of land
in the vill of Blanken', to wit, the 4 bovates which Suan Huggelamb
held & the 2 bovates which Wm. Palmer held & one toft that the said
Suan held & that lies next the toft of John de Beregat on the west.
Places named: BLANKEN' " - A2A, Lancashire Record Office:
Towneley of Towneley , DDTO K 24/11[8]

Spouse: Oliver Deincourt
Death: bef 19 Sep 1246[2],[20]
Birth: ca 1196[3]
Father: Oliver Deincourt (~1162-<1222)
Mother: Amabel

Children: Sir John (-<1257)


1.1.3 Isabel de la Haye[4]
----------------------------------------

Spouse: William de Rullos[4]



1. J. H. Round, ed., "Rotuli de Dominabus et Pueris et Puellis de
XII Comitatibus," The Publications of the Pipe Roll Society, N.S.,
35, London, 1913.
2. G. E. Cokayne, "The Complete Peerage," 1910 - [microprint,
1982 (Alan Sutton) ], The Complete Peerage of England Scotland
Ireland Great Britain and the United Kingdom.
3. I. J. Sanders, "English Baronies: A Study of Their Origin and
Descent, 1086-1327," Oxford: Clarendon Press, 1960.
4. Rosie Bevan, "Deincourt Uncertainties," January 29, 2002,
GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com, discrepancies re: Nichole, and
Nichole de la Haye, cited by Cristopher Nash.
5. "Pedigree and Progress," Sir Anthony Wagner, London: Phillimore
& Co., Ltd., 1975.
6. Alan B. Wilson, "Marmions in the Ancestry of Thomas Bradbury,"
Apr 14, 1997, GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com, reposted as "Re:
Marmion Question", Aug 28, 1999, Alan B. Wilson
{abwilson@uclink4.berkeley.edu}.
7. W. L. Warren, "King John," New Haven: Yale University Press,
1997 (orig. published 1981 in UK, Eyre Methuen Ltd), Yale
English Monarchs series.
8. "Access to Archives," http://www.a2a.pro.gov.uk/
9. Cristopher Nash, "Which Richard de Camville married Millicent?,"
May 31, 2000, GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com, resp. to email, Dexter
Kenfield (dekester@mindspring.com).
10. Sidney Painter, "The Reign of King John," Baltimore: The Johns
Hopkins Press, 1949.
11. Cristopher Nash, "de Camville (Results and Thanks)," June 2,
2000, GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com, commentary on research of
Dexter Kenfield, pub. May 31, 2000, cites Inquisitions Post
Mortem Henry III, 1904, 294,, item 658 - C. Hen. III. File 44. (11).
12. "Gerard de Camville [article]," Dictionary of National Biography,
Oxford Univ. Press, p. 856: Gerard de Camville.
13. Joseph Bain, ed., "Calendar of Documents relating to Scotland,"
Edinburgh: Her Majesty's General Register House, 1881 (Vol. I),
full title: Calendar of Documents relating to Scotland, Preserved
in Her Majesty's Public Record Office, London.
14. "Gazetteer of Markets and Fairs to 1516,"
http://www.histparl.ac.uk/cmh/gaz/
15. Paul C. Reed, FASG, "Clemence Dauntsey," Nov 16, 2001,
GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com, information also posted by Todd
A. Farmerie.
16. Hon. George Wrottesley, "Pedigrees from the Plea Rolls,"
The Genealogist (N.S.), Vol. XX, 1904, pp. 28 et seq.
17. Frederick L. Weis, Th. D., "The Magna Carta Sureties,
1215," Baltimore: Gen Pub Co., 5th ed., 1997 (W. L. Sheppard
Jr & David Faris).
18. "Antiquities of Shropshire," The Rev. R. W. Eyton, London:
John Russell Smith, 1855, Vol. 5 - p. 242 (Ludlow), pp. 132
(Banaster) and 133-142 (Barony of Hastings), Vol. 6 - pp.
350-359 (Meole Brace and de Bracy).
19. Paul C. Reed, FASG, "Re: Two Ida Longespee's: Same Generation,"
Sept 14, 2002, GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com, re: Idoine de
Camville, cites Farrer (Honors and Knights' Fees 2:222),
Farrer citing R. Lit.Claus 2:110b, 123 [Close Rolls].
20. Charles Roberts, ed., "Excerpta ex Rotulis Finium," The
Commissioners of the Public Records of the Kingdom, Vol I
(1216-1246), 1835, full title: Excerpta e Rotulis Finium in
Turri Londinensi asservatis, Henrico Tertio Rege, A.D. 1216-1272.


* John P. Ravilious

Tim Powys-Lybbe

Re: Maud de Vernon, wife of Richard de la Haye

Legg inn av Tim Powys-Lybbe » 18 mai 2006 21:10:38

In message of 18 May, Therav3@aol.com wrote:

<snip>

1.1.1 Nicole de la Haye[5]
----------------------------------------
Death: 1230[6]

<snip>

Spouse: Gerard de Camville[5]
Birth: ca 1150
Death: 1214[6]
Father: Richard de Camville (-ca1176)
Mother: Millicent of Rethel (ca1110-)
Marr: bef 1185[6]

The new-ish Oxford Dictionary of National Biography has Alice as the
first wife of Richard de Camville and the mother of Gerard. They say
that Millicent was the second wife and the mother of Richard de Camville
who died in 1191.

Should a correction be sent in to ODNB?

--
Tim Powys-Lybbe                                          tim@powys.org
             For a miscellany of bygones: http://powys.org

J.C.B.Sharp

Re: Maud de Vernon, wife of Richard de la Haye

Legg inn av J.C.B.Sharp » 19 mai 2006 01:15:02

In article <451.d363fa.319d567f@aol.com>, Therav3@aol.com () wrote:

Several threads on SGM in the past have dealt with the family of
Richard de la Haye (or Haia), of Duddington, co. Northants. and
Brattleby, co. Lincs. I noted earlier today the following partial
extracts available from the Rotuli de Dominabus (1185), which
indicate clearly the following (full extracts pending):

1. The wife of Richard was Maud, or Matilda, de Vernon, daughter
of William de Vernon.

2. The husband of Juliana (or 'Gilla'), 2nd dau. of Richard de
la Haye and Maud de Vernon, was one Richard de Humez. This
may have been identical to the Richard de Humez (Homet, or
Hummet) who d. a monk at Aunay in 1181 (his heir William was
by his wife Agnes de Say).

Certain questions have been, and remain, open, including which
'William de Vernon' was the father of Maud. One William 'de Vernon',
a younger son of Richard de Reviers (d. 1107) and Adelise Peverel
has been suggested before: despite the Devon and other SW England
associations with their known progeny, the Peverel family held
extensive lands in Nottinghamshire, which would match well with
a younger Revier (aka Vernon) son, presumably seated in Notts.,
having a daughter marrying a knight from Lincolnshire/Northant

According to Leportier (Familles Medievals Normandes, 235)Maud was the
daughter of William de Reviers count of Vernon and of Lucy daughter of
William de Tancarville and Maud d'Arques.

J.C.B.Sharp
London

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