King's Kinsfolk: King Henry I of England's kinsman, John

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Douglas Richardson

King's Kinsfolk: King Henry I of England's kinsman, John

Legg inn av Douglas Richardson » 11 apr 2006 01:56:45

Dear Newsgroup ~

In 1117-1119 a certain John witnessed a charter of William d'Aubeney as
kinsman ["cognatus"] of the king (that is, King Henry I of England)
[Reference: Charles Johnson, et al., Regesta Regum Anglo-Normannorum,
1066-1154, 2 (1956): 148]. John and King Henry I were related in the
2nd and 2nd degrees of kindred, or if you prefer first cousins, by
virtue of their common descent from Herleve (or Arlette) of Falaise, as
charted below.

1. Herleve (or Arlette) of Falaise, mistress of Robert, Duke of
Normandy.
2. William the Conqueror, King of England, died 1087.
3. Henry I, King of England, died 1135.

1. Herleve (or Arlette) of Falaise, married Herluin de Conteville.
2. Eudes (or Odo), Bishop of Bayeux, Earl of Kent, died 1097.
3. John, illegitimate son, living 1128, royal chaplain [Reference:
David Crouch, The Normans: The History of a Dynasty (2002): 31
(chart)].

For further information on John, the illegitimate son of Bishop Eudes
(or Odo), see Dictionary of National Biography, 14 (1908): 869-871
(biog. of Odo, Bishop of Bayeux and Earl of Kent). The suggestion is
made there that John might be the father of Robert "nepos Episcopi" who
married the daughter and heiress of William du Hommet, and by her left
a son, Richard du Hommet, who became hereditary Constable of Normandy.
I believe this Richard du Hommet is the father of Guillaume du Hommet,
Constable of Normandy, living 1220, who married Lucy, granddaughter and
heiress of Adam I de Brus.

Best always, Douglas Richardson, Salt Lake City, Utah

Website: http://www.royalancestry. net

J.C.B.Sharp

Re: King's Kinsfolk: King Henry I of England's kinsman, John

Legg inn av J.C.B.Sharp » 11 apr 2006 21:21:01

In article <1144717004.928093.81140@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com>,
royalancestry@msn.com (Douglas Richardson) wrote:

Dear Newsgroup ~

In 1117-1119 a certain John witnessed a charter of William d'Aubeney as
kinsman ["cognatus"] of the king (that is, King Henry I of England)
[Reference: Charles Johnson, et al., Regesta Regum Anglo-Normannorum,
1066-1154, 2 (1956): 148]. John and King Henry I were related in the
2nd and 2nd degrees of kindred, or if you prefer first cousins, by
virtue of their common descent from Herleve (or Arlette) of Falaise, as
charted below.

1. Herleve (or Arlette) of Falaise, mistress of Robert, Duke of
Normandy.
2. William the Conqueror, King of England, died 1087.
3. Henry I, King of England, died 1135.

1. Herleve (or Arlette) of Falaise, married Herluin de Conteville.
2. Eudes (or Odo), Bishop of Bayeux, Earl of Kent, died 1097.
3. John, illegitimate son, living 1128, royal chaplain [Reference:
David Crouch, The Normans: The History of a Dynasty (2002): 31
(chart)].

For further information on John, the illegitimate son of Bishop Eudes
(or Odo), see Dictionary of National Biography, 14 (1908): 869-871
(biog. of Odo, Bishop of Bayeux and Earl of Kent). The suggestion is
made there that John might be the father of Robert "nepos Episcopi" who
married the daughter and heiress of William du Hommet, and by her left
a son, Richard du Hommet, who became hereditary Constable of Normandy.
I believe this Richard du Hommet is the father of Guillaume du Hommet,
Constable of Normandy, living 1220, who married Lucy, granddaughter and
heiress of Adam I de Brus.

I have dragged another posting of mine out of the archives of 2000:

....a posting giving the Hommet ancestry as proposed by Stapleton. Everyone
accepts Richard constable of Normandy as son of Robert "nepos episcopi"
who held land in Lincolnshire by 1118. Stapleton thought that the related
bishop was Odo of Bayeaux. Kathleen Major finds this suggestion
unsatisfactory as also another idea that it refers to a bishop of Lincoln
(Lincoln Record Society xli 181-6).

Osbert "nepos episcopi", Peter de Humet and others witnessed two charters
of Ranulf bishop of Durham made very shortly before his death (Surtees
Society clxxix 108, 113). Osbert was sheriff of Durham and met a violent
end between 1148 and 1152 leaving sons William and Thomas.

Robert "nepos episcopi" witnessed the second of the above charters and
also two others as brother of Osbert (ibid 88, 101).

It is apparent that the related bishop is Ranulf Flambard of Durham
1099-1128. The word "nepos" can be used to describe various relationships
including nephew and grandson, but here I think it means that Osbert and
Robert were his illegitimate sons. The bishop certainly had a much younger
son, Ranulf a clerk, who was later provided for by Osbert.

Turning now to the Humet family of Durham:

1. Robert de Humet, subscribes to the 1095 grant of king Edgar to Durham
(Raine, North Durham, appendix, 2). For the authenticity of this see
Duncan as cited below. He appears in the Durham Liber Vitae (f42v) as a
contemporary of Alan de Percy, lord 1096-1130x35. Robert probably married
a Percy and other than Peter he seems to have had one or more other sons
(for the descendants see EYC xi 180-1, 227-30).

2. Peter de Humet, lord of Brancepeth County Durham. From Leland we learn
that he had a daughter who married Ansketil de Bulmer to whom the eventual
heirs were the Nevilles of Raby (EYC ii 128).

Professor Duncan suggests that Robert "nepos episcopi" married a relative
of Peter (Scottish Hist Rev xxxvii 117-8). The only way I can get this to
work is if Robert married another of his daughters, if Peter had inherited
property in Normandy, and if the partition on his death gave the English
lands to Bulmer and those in Normandy ultimately to the constables.

This theory is attractive but not easy to prove.

J.C.B.Sharp
London

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