The Basing family was briefly discussed at the end of November. I
discovered a bit more information in "The History and Antiquities of
the County of Rutland" by James Wright, p 92, under the property
Normonton.
"In the reign of E. 2. William de Basings was Lord of Normonton. It
is not improbably that this William de Basings might be related to Adam
de Bassing [sic] who was Lord Mayor of London, in 36 H. 3. (1251) whose
habitation was where Blackwell-hallo now stands in London, and from
whom the Street and Ward thereunto adjoyning took the denomination of
Bassings-hall Street, and Bassinges-hall Ward. The Armes of which
Family, viz. Gerundee of 12 pieces O. and az. were tilol the last age,
to be seen in the stone work, and painted in abundance of places about
the said hall. But in what degree of Consanguinity they were allyed, I
know not. Mr Philpot in his Villare Cantianum makes them to be of the
same blood and family: And I have seen some notes of discent [sic]
that makes this William de Basings to be Grandson to the
above-mentioned Adam de Bassing, viz. Son of Robert de Basing Sheriff
of Lon don in 7 E. 1. and he Son of the said Adam. But whether it be
so or not, I cannot affirm: in regard the Arms of this William de
Basings and his issue are so very different from the former, namely,
az. a Crosse moline voided, Or, which Coat is to be seen at this day in
the Church Windows here at Normanton, and also at Empingham in this
Countyi. However, I am apt to believe that this William de Basings is
the same person with William Basing, who was one of the Sheriffs of
London in 2 D. 2. and a great Benefactor to the Priory of Black Nuns
called St. Hellens within Bishopsgate in London: Which Priory was
first founded by William Basing, Dean of Pauls, about the year 1212. in
the Reign of King John
"Certain it is, that the said William de Basings, enjoyed this Estate
by reason that he marryed Margaret Daughter and heir of Thomas de
Normanville, Lord of this Town, by which Margaret he had issue Thomas
de Basings, whose Grandson Sir John de Basings Knight departed this
life in the 24 H. 6. without issue: After whose death this Estate came
by discent into the name and family of the Mackworths, Thomas Mackworth
of Mackworth in Com. Derby, having marryed Alice, the sister and heir
of the said Sir John de Basings........"
There is a brief notice under the manor of Empingham pp 44-5:
".....Thomas de Normanville, whose Daughter and heir, Margaret became
the wife of William de Basings, who died Lord of this Mannour in 9 E.
2. The same William appears to be one of those eminent persons in this
Couunty who in the 29 E. 1. received the Kings writ of Summons to
Attend him at Barwick upon Tween,, well fitted with Horse and Armes,
from thence to march against the Scots." This article further notes
that Margaret Normanville Basing married secondly Edmund de Passelye.
Basings
Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper
-
Gjest
Re: Basings
mardicar@yahoo.com schrieb:
That's very interesting, Mardi; thanks.
I hope to post a few more Basing miscellanea in a day or two, but can
add now that according to 'Knights of Edward I' Vol I, Sir William de
Basing (who married the Rutland heiress) was son of Sir Robert de
Basing, sometime Alderman of London. Sir Robert had other issue,
including a son Reginald (probably his eldest son), and a daughter who
married into the Lovaine family.
Sir Robert was clearly connected with the famous London family of de
Basing - indeed, he succeeded to Thomas de Basing's seat as Alderman
circa 1282.
This Thomas was nephew of Adam de Basing, the mayor of 1251, and uncle
to Alderman Henry de Gloucester, the goldsmith. According to the
excellent ODNB article on him, by Kay Staniland, Adam is believed to be
the son of Peter de Basing; in any case, Adam and Thomas's father were
grandsons of Saloman de Basing, who was Mayor in 1217. Thus, the
Charlton family had an excellent City pedigree.
Will post more shortly
Regards, Michael
The Basing family was briefly discussed at the end of November. I
discovered a bit more information in "The History and Antiquities of
the County of Rutland" by James Wright, p 92, under the property
Normonton.
That's very interesting, Mardi; thanks.
I hope to post a few more Basing miscellanea in a day or two, but can
add now that according to 'Knights of Edward I' Vol I, Sir William de
Basing (who married the Rutland heiress) was son of Sir Robert de
Basing, sometime Alderman of London. Sir Robert had other issue,
including a son Reginald (probably his eldest son), and a daughter who
married into the Lovaine family.
Sir Robert was clearly connected with the famous London family of de
Basing - indeed, he succeeded to Thomas de Basing's seat as Alderman
circa 1282.
This Thomas was nephew of Adam de Basing, the mayor of 1251, and uncle
to Alderman Henry de Gloucester, the goldsmith. According to the
excellent ODNB article on him, by Kay Staniland, Adam is believed to be
the son of Peter de Basing; in any case, Adam and Thomas's father were
grandsons of Saloman de Basing, who was Mayor in 1217. Thus, the
Charlton family had an excellent City pedigree.
Will post more shortly
Regards, Michael
-
Gjest
Re: Basings
From Calendar of Letter-books of the City of London: C: 1291-1309, pp.
189-210 (British History Online)
Folio cxxi.
Scriptum Margerie de Basingg' et Regin' fil' ejus.
Grant by Adam de Gatesdene, cornmonger, and Agnes his wife to Dame
Margery de Basingges, late wife of Sir Robert de Basingges, Knt., and
Reginald her son of an annual quitrent of 4 marks, viz., at each term 1
mark, issuing from a tenement held by John de Wavendone and Margaret
his wife in Basingestrete, (fn.
Bredstrete, situate near the tenements of Master William the Physician
(Medicus) and Margery his wife, Henry le Coupere and Johanna his wife,
and the tenement of Manekyn le Heumer; to have the said rent for a term
of twelve years from Easter [7 April], 31 Edward I. [A.D. 1303]. Dated
London, 11 Feb. the year aforesaid. Witnesses, John le Blunt, Mayor,
Simon de Paris and Hugh Pourte, Sheriffs, Ralph de Honilane, Alderman
of the Ward, (fn. 9) Walter le Waleys, Richard le Barber, &c.
Whereupon came the said Agnes et concessit et foris affidavit terminum
predictum de se et heredibus suis, etc.
Acknowledged Tuesday before the Feast of St. Valentine [14 Feb.], 31
Edward I. [A.D. 1302-3].
Another question. Where did the information come from that Wilelma,
who m. William de Gloucester, was Robert's daughter? I have not come
across that association in my hunt.
-
Gjest
Re: Basings
See CP (Lovaine) vol 8 p 181 note a, which talks about Joan, wife of
Thomas de Lovaine. Although her identity as dau of Robert de Basing is
mentioned as a possibility, it is not confirmed. Robert's wife Margery
had the marriage of Thomas de Lovaine and that seems to be the basis of
the supposition. On the other hand, a Joan, dau. of Margery de
Basying, is named in 1312, but she was a nun at St. Helens. Robert's
willl is in "Husting Wills," vol. i, p 135. The mention of a da. Joan
is from "Husting Deeds Enrolled," Roll 46. I don't have access to
either of these.
Mardi
Thomas de Lovaine. Although her identity as dau of Robert de Basing is
mentioned as a possibility, it is not confirmed. Robert's wife Margery
had the marriage of Thomas de Lovaine and that seems to be the basis of
the supposition. On the other hand, a Joan, dau. of Margery de
Basying, is named in 1312, but she was a nun at St. Helens. Robert's
willl is in "Husting Wills," vol. i, p 135. The mention of a da. Joan
is from "Husting Deeds Enrolled," Roll 46. I don't have access to
either of these.
Mardi
-
Gjest
Re: Basings
mardicar@yahoo.com schrieb:
According to 'The Knights of Edward I', Vol I, Sir William de Basing,
who married the Empingham heiress, was son of Sir Robert de Basing of
London. Their respective entries state:
"Sir Robert de Basing; azure, a cross recercelee voided or; of London
1290; had gift of lands and houses in London formerly belonging to a
Jew who has hanged for felony, 6.11.1279; lands at Mountnessing, Essex,
restored to him 1287; citizen and alderman of London 1292-6; had grant
of the marriage of Margaret daughter & coheir of Thomas fil. Ralph de
Normanville for his son William, instead of his son Reginald then a
prisoner in Gascony, 3.2.1297; dead 26.3.1305, leaving widow Margery
who had custody of the lands of Matt. de Luvayn deceased and marriage
of his son Thomas to one of her daughters (PR); Reginald ff 10.11.1306
(CR); the son Sir William, held land at Empingham with his wife
Margaret of her inheritance, 1299 - knighted 1306 - MP 1309, 1314 -
dead by 8.6.1316, son and heir Thomas aged 15, widow Margaret aged 30
(IPM)"
The Basing family was briefly discussed at the end of November. I
discovered a bit more information in "The History and Antiquities of
the County of Rutland" by James Wright, p 92, under the property
Normonton.
According to 'The Knights of Edward I', Vol I, Sir William de Basing,
who married the Empingham heiress, was son of Sir Robert de Basing of
London. Their respective entries state:
"Sir Robert de Basing; azure, a cross recercelee voided or; of London
1290; had gift of lands and houses in London formerly belonging to a
Jew who has hanged for felony, 6.11.1279; lands at Mountnessing, Essex,
restored to him 1287; citizen and alderman of London 1292-6; had grant
of the marriage of Margaret daughter & coheir of Thomas fil. Ralph de
Normanville for his son William, instead of his son Reginald then a
prisoner in Gascony, 3.2.1297; dead 26.3.1305, leaving widow Margery
who had custody of the lands of Matt. de Luvayn deceased and marriage
of his son Thomas to one of her daughters (PR); Reginald ff 10.11.1306
(CR); the son Sir William, held land at Empingham with his wife
Margaret of her inheritance, 1299 - knighted 1306 - MP 1309, 1314 -
dead by 8.6.1316, son and heir Thomas aged 15, widow Margaret aged 30
(IPM)"
-
Gjest
Re: Basings
mardicar@yahoo.com schrieb:
scriptum Henr' de Gloucestr'.
Lease by Sir Thomas de Basinges to Henry de Gloucester his nephew
(nepotem) of the whole of his rent within the City from Michaelmas,
anno 27 Edward I. [A.D. 1299], until the end of the said Henry's life;
paying to the grantor or his assigns the yearly sum of £40 of silver
by quarterly instalments The lessee pays down the sum of £80 for the
first two years. Dated London, Monday the Feast of Exaltation of H.
Cross [14 Sept.], the year aforesaid. Witnesses, Henry le Galeis,
Mayor; Thomas Sely and Richer de Refham, Sheriffs; Elyas de Suffolk,
Nicholas le Broun, Robert de Pipehurst, William le Bret, Walter de
Aumbresbury, Robert Clerk, and others [not named].
From: 'Folios 70 - 79b', Calendar of letter-books of the city of
London: B: 1275-1312 (1900), pp. 164-89. http://www.british-history.ac.uk
According to Beaven's "The Aldermen of London", Thomas de Basing became
Alderman for Candlewick ward circa 1269; and served until circa 1282,
when he was succeeded by Robert de Basing [I do not know how these two
were related]. Thomas was a woolman, and is evidently the one of that
name referred to in various sources as nephew of Adam de Basing.
One source states that Thomas was son of Robert de Basing, but that is
clearly incorrect. Further, the editors of the 1292 subsidy roll call
him son of Adam de Basing, but we know that this is also incorrect -
see the material I posted earlier this month showing that Adam's son
died shortly after his father.
Thomas's will was enrolled in the Hustings Court, 18 July 1300
[HR29(54)] - I have not yet had the opportunity to look this up.
Additionally, it appears that he had a brother Salomon de Basing, the
two being benefactors to St Helen's Bishopsgate:
These grants were in all probability made in aid of the rebuilding of
the church, the expense of which had largely been defrayed by two
brothers, Salomon and Thomas Basing, the latter bequeathing also to its
maintenance by will enrolled in 1300 (fn. 18) some rents in the parish
of St. Bartholomew the Little and elsewhere. Several of the Basings
became nuns of St. Helen's, one indeed was elected prioress in 1269;
this may account in part for the benefactions of the family, which
altogether must have been extensive: William, the sheriff of 1308, is
said by Stow to have been reputed a founder, and Henry de Gloucestre,
grandson of Thomas, by will dated 1332 established there a chantry of
two chaplains which he endowed with an income of 11 marks of silver.
From: 'Benedictine nuns: St Helen's, Bishopsgate', A History of the
County of London: Volume 1: London within the Bars, Westminster and
Southwark (1909), pp. 457-61. http://www.british-history.ac.uk
(NB Henry de Gloucester is unlikely to have been the grandson rather
than nephew of Thomas de Basing (d 1300), given that his father William
ff 1252; presumably this represents the usual confusion between the
term for the two relationships)
Presumably this Salomon should not be confused with the one of that
name referred to in the following (which gives details of Thomas de
Basing's executors):
Quieta cla macio Thome de Basingg' de Salamone de Basingg'.
A similar release by Salamon de la More, called "de Basingge," son of
Ralph de la More, to Thomas de Basingge Witnesses, Elyas Russel, Mayor,
John Darmenters and Henry de Fingrie, Sheriffs, William de Leyre,
Geoffrey de Nortone, Walter de Finchingfeld, William de Beton', John de
Wyndessore, Bartholomew Nicholas, Henry de Gloucestre, Elyas de
Suffolk, Ralph [the] Clerk, and others [not named].
The above was produced before John le Blound, Mayor, John de
Burreforth. Sheriff, John de Wangrave, Walter de Finchingfeld, Nicholas
de Farndone, John de Vintry, John Darmenters, Henry de Gloucestre, John
de Dunstaple, Salamon le Cotiller, and Nicholas Pycot (the
Chamberlain), Aldermen, by Master Thomas de Bodingtone, Sir Robert de
Wezeringsete, chaplain, and Bartholomew Nicholas de Dunstaple,
executors of Thomas de Basingge, and guaranteed by them, on Friday
before the Feast of St. Dunstan [19 May], 32 Edward I. [A.D. 1304].
From: 'Folios cxx - cxxix', Calendar of letter-books of the city of
London: C: 1291-1309 (1901), pp. 189-210. http://www.british-history.ac.uk
Another question. Where did the information come from that Wilelma,
who m. William de Gloucester, was Robert's daughter? I have not come
across that association in my hunt.
scriptum Henr' de Gloucestr'.
Lease by Sir Thomas de Basinges to Henry de Gloucester his nephew
(nepotem) of the whole of his rent within the City from Michaelmas,
anno 27 Edward I. [A.D. 1299], until the end of the said Henry's life;
paying to the grantor or his assigns the yearly sum of £40 of silver
by quarterly instalments The lessee pays down the sum of £80 for the
first two years. Dated London, Monday the Feast of Exaltation of H.
Cross [14 Sept.], the year aforesaid. Witnesses, Henry le Galeis,
Mayor; Thomas Sely and Richer de Refham, Sheriffs; Elyas de Suffolk,
Nicholas le Broun, Robert de Pipehurst, William le Bret, Walter de
Aumbresbury, Robert Clerk, and others [not named].
From: 'Folios 70 - 79b', Calendar of letter-books of the city of
London: B: 1275-1312 (1900), pp. 164-89. http://www.british-history.ac.uk
According to Beaven's "The Aldermen of London", Thomas de Basing became
Alderman for Candlewick ward circa 1269; and served until circa 1282,
when he was succeeded by Robert de Basing [I do not know how these two
were related]. Thomas was a woolman, and is evidently the one of that
name referred to in various sources as nephew of Adam de Basing.
One source states that Thomas was son of Robert de Basing, but that is
clearly incorrect. Further, the editors of the 1292 subsidy roll call
him son of Adam de Basing, but we know that this is also incorrect -
see the material I posted earlier this month showing that Adam's son
died shortly after his father.
Thomas's will was enrolled in the Hustings Court, 18 July 1300
[HR29(54)] - I have not yet had the opportunity to look this up.
Additionally, it appears that he had a brother Salomon de Basing, the
two being benefactors to St Helen's Bishopsgate:
These grants were in all probability made in aid of the rebuilding of
the church, the expense of which had largely been defrayed by two
brothers, Salomon and Thomas Basing, the latter bequeathing also to its
maintenance by will enrolled in 1300 (fn. 18) some rents in the parish
of St. Bartholomew the Little and elsewhere. Several of the Basings
became nuns of St. Helen's, one indeed was elected prioress in 1269;
this may account in part for the benefactions of the family, which
altogether must have been extensive: William, the sheriff of 1308, is
said by Stow to have been reputed a founder, and Henry de Gloucestre,
grandson of Thomas, by will dated 1332 established there a chantry of
two chaplains which he endowed with an income of 11 marks of silver.
From: 'Benedictine nuns: St Helen's, Bishopsgate', A History of the
County of London: Volume 1: London within the Bars, Westminster and
Southwark (1909), pp. 457-61. http://www.british-history.ac.uk
(NB Henry de Gloucester is unlikely to have been the grandson rather
than nephew of Thomas de Basing (d 1300), given that his father William
ff 1252; presumably this represents the usual confusion between the
term for the two relationships)
Presumably this Salomon should not be confused with the one of that
name referred to in the following (which gives details of Thomas de
Basing's executors):
Quieta cla macio Thome de Basingg' de Salamone de Basingg'.
A similar release by Salamon de la More, called "de Basingge," son of
Ralph de la More, to Thomas de Basingge Witnesses, Elyas Russel, Mayor,
John Darmenters and Henry de Fingrie, Sheriffs, William de Leyre,
Geoffrey de Nortone, Walter de Finchingfeld, William de Beton', John de
Wyndessore, Bartholomew Nicholas, Henry de Gloucestre, Elyas de
Suffolk, Ralph [the] Clerk, and others [not named].
The above was produced before John le Blound, Mayor, John de
Burreforth. Sheriff, John de Wangrave, Walter de Finchingfeld, Nicholas
de Farndone, John de Vintry, John Darmenters, Henry de Gloucestre, John
de Dunstaple, Salamon le Cotiller, and Nicholas Pycot (the
Chamberlain), Aldermen, by Master Thomas de Bodingtone, Sir Robert de
Wezeringsete, chaplain, and Bartholomew Nicholas de Dunstaple,
executors of Thomas de Basingge, and guaranteed by them, on Friday
before the Feast of St. Dunstan [19 May], 32 Edward I. [A.D. 1304].
From: 'Folios cxx - cxxix', Calendar of letter-books of the city of
London: C: 1291-1309 (1901), pp. 189-210. http://www.british-history.ac.uk
-
Gjest
Re: Basings
m...@btinternet.com schrieb:
I must immediately retract my recent doubt: Thomas and Salomon de
Basing were both sons of Ralph de la More. Their mother was presumably
a sister of Adam de Basing, if the statements that Thomas de Basing was
Adam's nephew are correct:
Memorandum to the effect that on Sunday after the Feast of St.
Katherine [25 Nov.], 13 Edward I. [A.D. 1284], in the presence of G. de
Rokesle, Mayor; Robert de Basinges, (fn. 36) Joce le Akatur, (fn. 37)
William de Farndon, (fn. 38) Wolmar de Essex, (fn. 39) and Richard
Aswy, (fn. 40) Aldermen; and Martin Box and John de Canterbury,
citizens, Robert le Treyer', one of the executors of Ralph de Mora,
(fn. 41) paid to Thomas de Basinges and other coexecutors [not named]
the sum of £72 bequeathed to Thomas and Alice, children of the said
Ralph; for which money as well as for all jewels, silver and gold, for
a horse, and all other possible demands the said coexecutors acquit the
said Robert.
From: 'Folios 31 - 40', Calendar of letter-books of the city of London:
A: 1275-1298 (1899), pp. 65-88. http://www.british-history.ac.uk
Thomas's will was enrolled in the Hustings Court, 18 July 1300
[HR29(54)] - I have not yet had the opportunity to look this up.
Additionally, it appears that he had a brother Salomon de Basing, the
two being benefactors to St Helen's Bishopsgate.
Presumably this Salomon should not be confused with the one of that
name referred to in the following (which gives details of Thomas de
Basing's executors):
Quieta cla macio Thome de Basingg' de Salamone de Basingg'.
A similar release by Salamon de la More, called "de Basingge," son of
Ralph de la More, to Thomas de Basingge.
I must immediately retract my recent doubt: Thomas and Salomon de
Basing were both sons of Ralph de la More. Their mother was presumably
a sister of Adam de Basing, if the statements that Thomas de Basing was
Adam's nephew are correct:
Memorandum to the effect that on Sunday after the Feast of St.
Katherine [25 Nov.], 13 Edward I. [A.D. 1284], in the presence of G. de
Rokesle, Mayor; Robert de Basinges, (fn. 36) Joce le Akatur, (fn. 37)
William de Farndon, (fn. 38) Wolmar de Essex, (fn. 39) and Richard
Aswy, (fn. 40) Aldermen; and Martin Box and John de Canterbury,
citizens, Robert le Treyer', one of the executors of Ralph de Mora,
(fn. 41) paid to Thomas de Basinges and other coexecutors [not named]
the sum of £72 bequeathed to Thomas and Alice, children of the said
Ralph; for which money as well as for all jewels, silver and gold, for
a horse, and all other possible demands the said coexecutors acquit the
said Robert.
From: 'Folios 31 - 40', Calendar of letter-books of the city of London:
A: 1275-1298 (1899), pp. 65-88. http://www.british-history.ac.uk
-
Gjest
Re: Basings
m...@btinternet.com schrieb:
The will of Ralph de la More was enrolled in the Hustings Court,
November 1280.
He was Sheriff of London (and thus an Alderman), 8 Edward I (c1279).
On reflection, it is more likely that Ralph de la More married a sister
of Alderman Thomas de Basing; given that Thomas was an alderman as
early as 1269, and Sheriff in the time of Henry III, it appears highly
unlikely to me that his father would have been Sheriff under Edward I.
Additionally, the above extract suggests that Thomas de Basing and
Thomas son of Ralph de la More are distinct individuals.
MAR
Memorandum to the effect that on Sunday after the Feast of St.
Katherine [25 Nov.], 13 Edward I. [A.D. 1284], in the presence of G. de
Rokesle, Mayor; Robert de Basinges, (fn. 36) Joce le Akatur, (fn. 37)
William de Farndon, (fn. 38) Wolmar de Essex, (fn. 39) and Richard
Aswy, (fn. 40) Aldermen; and Martin Box and John de Canterbury,
citizens, Robert le Treyer', one of the executors of Ralph de Mora,
(fn. 41) paid to Thomas de Basinges and other coexecutors [not named]
the sum of £72 bequeathed to Thomas and Alice, children of the said
Ralph; for which money as well as for all jewels, silver and gold, for
a horse, and all other possible demands the said coexecutors acquit the
said Robert.
The will of Ralph de la More was enrolled in the Hustings Court,
November 1280.
He was Sheriff of London (and thus an Alderman), 8 Edward I (c1279).
On reflection, it is more likely that Ralph de la More married a sister
of Alderman Thomas de Basing; given that Thomas was an alderman as
early as 1269, and Sheriff in the time of Henry III, it appears highly
unlikely to me that his father would have been Sheriff under Edward I.
Additionally, the above extract suggests that Thomas de Basing and
Thomas son of Ralph de la More are distinct individuals.
MAR