Hagthorpe family

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Gjest

Hagthorpe family

Legg inn av Gjest » 19 nov 2005 13:10:59

According to 'Lincolnshire Pedigrees', Vol 2, p 623, Richard Maddison
of Unthank Hall married Joan Hagthorpe, who is said to have died a
widow circa 1463. The pedigree states that she was daughter of Robert
Hagthorpe.

Although I enjoy the name (imagine marrying a Hagthorpe!) I haven't had
much luck in trying to identifying this family. I note that VCH York
(East Riding, Vol 3) sub Brackenholme, mentioned the township of
Hagthorpe and its eponymous Lords, who held of the Bishop of Durham.

VCH names Robert de Hagthorpe ff c1190, and records that his heirs held
Hagthorpe until about 1500, when Thomas Hagthorpe died and was
succeeded by his daughter.

Does anyone know anything about the Hagthorpes?

MAR

Gjest

Re: Hagthorpe family

Legg inn av Gjest » 19 nov 2005 13:17:34

Apparently there is a pedigree of the Hagthorpes of Hagthorpe in
Burton's 'History of Hemingbrough'

John Higgins

Re: Hagthorpe family

Legg inn av John Higgins » 19 nov 2005 19:09:02

FWIW, Marshall lists a couple of other pedigree sources for Hagthorpe
besides Burton's Hemingbrough, including Surtees' Durham and a couple of
visitation pedigrees. I don't know whether these are the right family
however...

Joan Hagthorpe and Richard Maddison are ancestral, through the Clavering
family, to Elizabeth Grey, wife of the 1st Earl Grey. This latter couple is
ancestral to Lady Diana Spencer and Sarah Fergsuon - and probably lots of
other notable folks.

----- Original Message -----
From: <mjcar@btinternet.com>
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 4:10 AM
Subject: Hagthorpe family


According to 'Lincolnshire Pedigrees', Vol 2, p 623, Richard Maddison
of Unthank Hall married Joan Hagthorpe, who is said to have died a
widow circa 1463. The pedigree states that she was daughter of Robert
Hagthorpe.

Although I enjoy the name (imagine marrying a Hagthorpe!) I haven't had
much luck in trying to identifying this family. I note that VCH York
(East Riding, Vol 3) sub Brackenholme, mentioned the township of
Hagthorpe and its eponymous Lords, who held of the Bishop of Durham.

VCH names Robert de Hagthorpe ff c1190, and records that his heirs held
Hagthorpe until about 1500, when Thomas Hagthorpe died and was
succeeded by his daughter.

Does anyone know anything about the Hagthorpes?

MAR

Gjest

Re: Hagthorpe family

Legg inn av Gjest » 19 nov 2005 19:51:48

"John Higgins" schrieb:

FWIW, Marshall lists a couple of other pedigree sources for Hagthorpe
besides Burton's Hemingbrough, including Surtees' Durham and a couple of
visitation pedigrees. I don't know whether these are the right family
however...

Many thanks John, I shall extract the references when I am at the
Guildhall on Monday.

I suspect the Visitation pedigrees may be generally unpublished, so I
may need to make arrangements with the College of Arms or track down
the MSS at the British Library, if they are there.

I am beginning to wonder whether there is any documented mediaeval
couple who are not ancestral to the late Princess of Wales and the
Duchess of York!

MAR

John Higgins

Re: Hagthorpe family

Legg inn av John Higgins » 19 nov 2005 22:49:01

At least one of the visitation pedigrees for Hagthorpe has been published,
in Foster's edition of the Visitation of Durham (available on CD), but it's
for the family of Hagthorpe of Nettlesworthe, and I can't see a connection
to the Joan Hagthorpe we're looking for.

And I share your feeling that it often seems that any medieval (British)
couple who has living descendants is ancestral to either or both of the late
Princess of Wales or the Duchess of York... :-)

----- Original Message -----
From: <mjcar@btinternet.com>
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 10:51 AM
Subject: Re: Hagthorpe family


"John Higgins" schrieb:

FWIW, Marshall lists a couple of other pedigree sources for Hagthorpe
besides Burton's Hemingbrough, including Surtees' Durham and a couple of
visitation pedigrees. I don't know whether these are the right family
however...

Many thanks John, I shall extract the references when I am at the
Guildhall on Monday.

I suspect the Visitation pedigrees may be generally unpublished, so I
may need to make arrangements with the College of Arms or track down
the MSS at the British Library, if they are there.

I am beginning to wonder whether there is any documented mediaeval
couple who are not ancestral to the late Princess of Wales and the
Duchess of York!

MAR

Leo

Family of Mankind was Re: Hagthorpe family

Legg inn av Leo » 19 nov 2005 23:25:02

And I share your feeling that it often seems that any medieval (British)
couple who has living descendants is ancestral to either or both of the
late
Princess of Wales or the Duchess of York... :-)

This above remark is made by John Higgins and, of course, is totally

accurate. What I would like to add is that anyone who has a line into the
British aristocracy or Landed Gentry would probably have the same thing
occurring. It is just that many people (including myself and John Higgins)
are trying to record as many ancestors of these two ladies (and others) as
possible.

The fascinating part is that it shows how all people are closer related to
each other than they think.

In 1929 a book was published with an unimaginative title "Your Family Tree"
by David Starr Jordan and Sarah Louise Kimball, this book was republished in
1979.

The title may not be great, the foreword of this book is a delight to read
(in my opinion). I would like to repeat a quote from this foreword:
To quote from a recent statement by Dr. E. M. Best of McGill University,
Montreal: "Every one of us is descended from William the Conqueror, and
Anglo-Saxons are, all of us, at least thirtieth cousins to each other."

As this was written in 1929, lets make it that all Anglo-Saxons are at least
33rd cousins to each other. Easily said, now some "proof".

I have a great genealogical program, but it has some flaws. One annoying one
is when I ask how is A related to B, it gives the first link established in
my collection. I cannot ask for a second or third link.

Here we go
JOHN RAVILIOUS
to Lady Diana Spencer 13th cousins once removed - common ancestor Isabel
Girlington
to Sarah Ferguson 13th cousins - common ancestor Henry Cavendish (the Common
Bull :-)
to Ian Fettes 16th cousins once removed - common ancestor Sir Philip
Wentworth
to Doug McDonald 16th cousins twice removed - common ancestor Robert, 1st
Baron Erskine
to Andrew MacEwen 16th cousins once removed - common ancestor Sir Adam
Hepburn
to Brice Clagett 17th cousins - common ancestor Sir Roger Wentworth
to Tim Powys-Lybbe 15th cousins twice removed - common ancestor Alexander,
Master of Montgomerie
to Peter de Loriol 17th cousins once removed - common ancestor Alexander,
1st Baron Montgomerie
to Kelsey Williams 17th cousins once removed - common ancestor Alexander,
1st Baron Montgomerie
to Broim Nichol Jr. 5th cousins once removed - common ancestor Richard
Farrar
to John Steele Gordon 17th cousins once removed - common ancestor Sir Roger
Wentworth
to Louise Staley 13th cousins twice removed - common ancestor Sir George
Pierrepont

All these cousins of John Ravilious also all descend from King Edward III.

Hope this is of some interest.
With best wishes
Leo van de Pas

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