Fw: Vlad The Impaler

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Theron L.Smith

Fw: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Theron L.Smith » 12 nov 2005 21:06:38

<mjcar@btinternet.com> wrote Saturday, November 12, 2005 2:56 AM:
<< Le Bateman" schrieb: "Who were Vlad " The Impaler's descendants? Le
Euweb.cz provides some details:
http://genealogy.euweb.cz/balkan/barab.html >>

To summarize, the Internet reference has

Ioan Basarab [BASARAB in Moncreiffe], Voivode of Wallachia (ca 1310-1352),
+1352; m.Ana N;
o A2. Nicolae Alexandru, Voivode of Wallachia (1352-64),
o B2. Radu I "Negru Voda", Voivode of Wallachia (1375-83)
o C2. [2m.] Mircea I "the Elder", Despot of Dobruja, Voivode of
Wallachia
o D2. [by Maria Tolmay] Vlad II Dracul "the Dragon", Voivode of
Wallachia
o E2. [1m.] Vlad III Tepes "the Impaler", Voivode of Wallachia
o E4. [by Catuna N, later Mother Euphrasim, an Abbess] Vlad
IV "Calugarul" "the Monk", Voivode of Wallachia
o F1. [1m.] Radu IV "the Great", Voivode of Wallachia
o G3. Mircea III "Ciobanul" ("the Shepherd"), Voivode
of Wallachia
oH3. Stana [STANCA Basarah in Moncreiffe]
+after 1601; m. Ioan Norocea [JOHN Morocza
in Moncreiffe] , Logofat de Pitesti, Great Chancellor of Wallachia


FWIW, Sin Iain Moncreiffe's 1982, ROYAL HIGHNESS, p. 100, Chart 32,
presents Stanca Basarah and John Norocza as 12-great grandparents of
Prince Charles, Prince of Wales, which would place the Impaler as an
ancestral uncle.
Can Sir Iian's extensions to this decadency be substantiated?
[Sir Iain also wrote that BASARAB was probably son of TOKTEMIR, great
grandson of JUCHI, son of GENGHIS KHAN.]

Regards to all,
Theron Smith

Gjest

Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Gjest » 12 nov 2005 22:01:13

Dear Michael, Leo, Le, Theron and others,
Vlad III Tepes
Dracula had at least three children: Vlad Tepelus who claimed the throne of
Wallachia in oppostion to Basarab the Old from 1476 to at least 1481. A couple of
websites claim He has modern descendants, a daughter who married Bogdan III,
Prince of Moldavia who had by him at least his sucessor Stefanita / Stefan IV
who has known descendants until at least the mid sixteen hundreds including
Alexander Lapusceanu Prince of Moldavia and Alexander cel Rau Prince of
Wallachia, also a natural son Mihnea I Cel Rau, Prince of Wallachia whose male line
descendants down to Prince Mihail Radu occasionally held the Wallachian throne
down to 1659. The Princes Tepes Dracula were male line descendants down to at
least Arkady who succeeded his father Peter II in 1845. See
http://msngroups.com/RestratosdelaHisto ... acula.msnw
Sincerely,
James W Cummings
Dixmont, Maine USA

Leo

Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Leo » 12 nov 2005 22:48:02

Dear James,

You inspired me to have another look. But it starts with a negative.

Dracula's son Mihnea the Angry married twice, had two sons by his first wife
and that daughter who married Bogdan III by the second wife. Bogdan III's
son Stefan IV, according to ES was fathered by mistress Stanka/Stana not by
the granddaughter of Dracula. But this Stefan married a Bassaraba, member of
Dracula's family. I am looking further and if I find anything that indicates
lines to the present I will let you know.
Leo


----- Original Message -----
From: <Jwc1870@aol.com>
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 6:45 AM
Subject: Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler


Dear Michael, Leo, Le, Theron and others,
Vlad III Tepes
Dracula had at least three children: Vlad Tepelus who claimed the throne
of
Wallachia in oppostion to Basarab the Old from 1476 to at least 1481. A
couple of
websites claim He has modern descendants, a daughter who married Bogdan
III,
Prince of Moldavia who had by him at least his sucessor Stefanita / Stefan
IV
who has known descendants until at least the mid sixteen hundreds
including
Alexander Lapusceanu Prince of Moldavia and Alexander cel Rau Prince of
Wallachia, also a natural son Mihnea I Cel Rau, Prince of Wallachia whose
male line
descendants down to Prince Mihail Radu occasionally held the Wallachian
throne
down to 1659. The Princes Tepes Dracula were male line descendants down to
at
least Arkady who succeeded his father Peter II in 1845. See
http://msngroups.com/RestratosdelaHisto ... acula.msnw
Sincerely,
James W Cummings
Dixmont, Maine USA


Akrogiali

Re: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Akrogiali » 13 nov 2005 00:18:06

Not necessarily Correct.

Seneslav Bassaraba, Prince of Walachia (1247-?) had Two Sons.

Basarab Bassaraba, (Prince of Walachia 1330-1340)
Tugomir Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia -1330) Died 1330

Basarab Bassaraba had one son
Nicolas II, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1340-1364) Died 1364

Nicolas II had two sons and a daughter.

Radu I Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia (after 1380)
Vlad I, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1364-1380)
Ana Bassaraba= 1360 Stefan, Urosh V, Nemanja, King of Serbia


Radu I, Bassaraba Two sons.

Mircea I, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1386-1418) died 1418
Dana I, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia ??)


Mircea I, Bassaraba had two sons.

Michael I, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1418-1420) Died 1420
Vlad II, "Dracul" Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1435-1446) Died 1446


Vlad II had four sons.

Vlad III, Tepes, "The Impaler", Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1456-1462)
Died Dec 1476 Near Bucharest)
Radu III, "The Handsome" Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1462-1474). Died 1474
Vlad IV, "The Monk", Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1482-1495).
Mircea Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia ??)


Vlad III, Tepes had one son.

Mihnea I, "The Bad", Bassaraba (Illegitimate) (Prince of Walachia 1508-1510


Mircea III, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1545-1560) = Despina ? (Greek
Origine).

They had a son.
Alexander II, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1568-1577).


Alexander II had a son.

Mihnea II, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1577-1591) Died 1591

He had a son:
Radu IX, Serban Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1602-1611)

Radu IX had one son and one daughter.

Constantin Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia)
Elena Bassaraba = Constantin Kantakouzinos (Grand Duke, Boyar of Walachia)
Born About 1598, died 20/12/1663


I do not know wives and if sons/daughters were from first or second marriage
or illegitimate.
There are also numerous unconnected Bassaraba family members.

Stanca Bassaraba died 1530 and married Stefan VI, Mushati (Prince of
Moldavia 1517-1527)

Vladilsav II, Bassaraba is mentioned as "Danesti Prince"

Roxandra Bassaraba (died 21/9/1513) married 1510 Bogdan III, "The One Eyed"
Mushati Prince of Moldavia (Born 9/3/1479; died 20/4/1517)

Neagoe Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1512-1521), died 15/9/1521 married
Despina Militza (Princess)

Maria Bassaraba (died 1511) married 1478 Stefan III, "The Great" Mushati
(Prince of Moldavia (died 2/7/1504)


One of the still alive family members is

Anastasia, Serban, Bassaraba who married 1819 George Manos (b.1793 and died
19/12/1836 in Iasi Moldavia)

etc



























"Theron L.Smith"" <tl2smith@flash.net> wrote in message
news:004701c5e7bc$2abbdd30$0f7b8d42@5gt4t01...
mjcar@btinternet.com> wrote Saturday, November 12, 2005 2:56 AM:
Le Bateman" schrieb: "Who were Vlad " The Impaler's descendants? Le
Euweb.cz provides some details:
http://genealogy.euweb.cz/balkan/barab.html

To summarize, the Internet reference has

Ioan Basarab [BASARAB in Moncreiffe], Voivode of Wallachia (ca
1310-1352),
+1352; m.Ana N;
o A2. Nicolae Alexandru, Voivode of Wallachia (1352-64),
o B2. Radu I "Negru Voda", Voivode of Wallachia (1375-83)
o C2. [2m.] Mircea I "the Elder", Despot of Dobruja, Voivode of
Wallachia
o D2. [by Maria Tolmay] Vlad II Dracul "the Dragon", Voivode of
Wallachia
o E2. [1m.] Vlad III Tepes "the Impaler", Voivode of Wallachia
o E4. [by Catuna N, later Mother Euphrasim, an Abbess] Vlad
IV "Calugarul" "the Monk", Voivode of Wallachia
o F1. [1m.] Radu IV "the Great", Voivode of Wallachia
o G3. Mircea III "Ciobanul" ("the Shepherd"), Voivode
of Wallachia
oH3. Stana [STANCA Basarah in Moncreiffe]
+after 1601; m. Ioan Norocea [JOHN Morocza
in Moncreiffe] , Logofat de Pitesti, Great Chancellor of Wallachia


FWIW, Sin Iain Moncreiffe's 1982, ROYAL HIGHNESS, p. 100, Chart 32,
presents Stanca Basarah and John Norocza as 12-great grandparents of
Prince Charles, Prince of Wales, which would place the Impaler as an
ancestral uncle.
Can Sir Iian's extensions to this decadency be substantiated?
[Sir Iain also wrote that BASARAB was probably son of TOKTEMIR, great
grandson of JUCHI, son of GENGHIS KHAN.]

Regards to all,
Theron Smith

Gjest

Re: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Gjest » 13 nov 2005 00:49:08

Akrogiali schrieb:

One of the still alive family members is

Anastasia, Serban, Bassaraba who married 1819 George Manos (b.1793 and died
19/12/1836 in Iasi Moldavia)

My goodness! She must be getting on in years now - well over two
hundred years old!

MAR

Akrogiali

Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Akrogiali » 13 nov 2005 00:58:10

Bogdan III, "The One Eyed" Mushati married twice and also had two
mistresses.

First Wife: Anastasia married 1510; she died 12/10/1512 NO Children are
known.
Second Wife: Roxandra Bassaraba, married 21/9/1513. NO Children are known

First Mistress: Anastasia Doamna. Died 2/5/1558. ONE Son: Alexandru IV
Lapusneanu (Prince of Moldavia 1552-1561 and 1564-1568) died 5/5/1568)
The Surname may have been the surname of the Mistress).

Second Mistress: Stanca ? (Died 28/1/1518). TWO sons.
Petru Mushati (Died 20/9/1527)
Stefan VI, Mushati (Prince of Moldavia 1517-1527) Died 14/1/1527). Married
Stanca Bassaraba and had ONE son, Ioan, Bogdan Mushati (Died after 1596)
ONE Mistress: Serpega. Son Ioan III (Illegitimate) (Prince of Moldavia
1572-1574) Died 14/6/1574. (Married twice: Princess Maria of Rostov and
Marica Huru)






p
""Leo"" <leo@home.netspeed.com.au> wrote in message
news:007601c5e7cc$c9777140$0300a8c0@Toshiba...
Dear James,

You inspired me to have another look. But it starts with a negative.

Dracula's son Mihnea the Angry married twice, had two sons by his first
wife and that daughter who married Bogdan III by the second wife. Bogdan
III's son Stefan IV, according to ES was fathered by mistress Stanka/Stana
not by the granddaughter of Dracula. But this Stefan married a Bassaraba,
member of Dracula's family. I am looking further and if I find anything
that indicates lines to the present I will let you know.
Leo


----- Original Message -----
From: <Jwc1870@aol.com
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 6:45 AM
Subject: Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler


Dear Michael, Leo, Le, Theron and others,
Vlad III
Tepes
Dracula had at least three children: Vlad Tepelus who claimed the throne
of
Wallachia in oppostion to Basarab the Old from 1476 to at least 1481. A
couple of
websites claim He has modern descendants, a daughter who married Bogdan
III,
Prince of Moldavia who had by him at least his sucessor Stefanita /
Stefan IV
who has known descendants until at least the mid sixteen hundreds
including
Alexander Lapusceanu Prince of Moldavia and Alexander cel Rau Prince of
Wallachia, also a natural son Mihnea I Cel Rau, Prince of Wallachia whose
male line
descendants down to Prince Mihail Radu occasionally held the Wallachian
throne
down to 1659. The Princes Tepes Dracula were male line descendants down
to at
least Arkady who succeeded his father Peter II in 1845. See
http://msngroups.com/RestratosdelaHisto ... acula.msnw
Sincerely,
James W Cummings
Dixmont, Maine USA



Leo

Re: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Leo » 13 nov 2005 01:59:02

Many thanks for this.

Most matches what Europaische Stammtafeln gives, except the children of Radu
IX, it gives two sons, Alexandru and Mihail and two unnamed daughters. One
married Moise Movila Voivoide of Moldavia and the other married Miron
Barnowski-Moghila. This is where Dracula's descendants stop (for the time
being :-)

Best wishes
Leo van de Pas

----- Original Message -----
From: "Akrogiali" <akrogiali@westnet.com.au>
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 10:18 AM
Subject: Re: Vlad The Impaler


Not necessarily Correct.

Seneslav Bassaraba, Prince of Walachia (1247-?) had Two Sons.

Basarab Bassaraba, (Prince of Walachia 1330-1340)
Tugomir Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia -1330) Died 1330

Basarab Bassaraba had one son
Nicolas II, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1340-1364) Died 1364

Nicolas II had two sons and a daughter.

Radu I Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia (after 1380)
Vlad I, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1364-1380)
Ana Bassaraba= 1360 Stefan, Urosh V, Nemanja, King of Serbia


Radu I, Bassaraba Two sons.

Mircea I, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1386-1418) died 1418
Dana I, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia ??)


Mircea I, Bassaraba had two sons.

Michael I, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1418-1420) Died 1420
Vlad II, "Dracul" Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1435-1446) Died 1446


Vlad II had four sons.

Vlad III, Tepes, "The Impaler", Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1456-1462)
Died Dec 1476 Near Bucharest)
Radu III, "The Handsome" Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1462-1474). Died
1474
Vlad IV, "The Monk", Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1482-1495).
Mircea Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia ??)


Vlad III, Tepes had one son.

Mihnea I, "The Bad", Bassaraba (Illegitimate) (Prince of Walachia
1508-1510


Mircea III, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1545-1560) = Despina ? (Greek
Origine).

They had a son.
Alexander II, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1568-1577).


Alexander II had a son.

Mihnea II, Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1577-1591) Died 1591

He had a son:
Radu IX, Serban Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1602-1611)

Radu IX had one son and one daughter.

Constantin Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia)
Elena Bassaraba = Constantin Kantakouzinos (Grand Duke, Boyar of Walachia)
Born About 1598, died 20/12/1663


I do not know wives and if sons/daughters were from first or second
marriage or illegitimate.
There are also numerous unconnected Bassaraba family members.

Stanca Bassaraba died 1530 and married Stefan VI, Mushati (Prince of
Moldavia 1517-1527)

Vladilsav II, Bassaraba is mentioned as "Danesti Prince"

Roxandra Bassaraba (died 21/9/1513) married 1510 Bogdan III, "The One
Eyed" Mushati Prince of Moldavia (Born 9/3/1479; died 20/4/1517)

Neagoe Bassaraba (Prince of Walachia 1512-1521), died 15/9/1521 married
Despina Militza (Princess)

Maria Bassaraba (died 1511) married 1478 Stefan III, "The Great" Mushati
(Prince of Moldavia (died 2/7/1504)


One of the still alive family members is

Anastasia, Serban, Bassaraba who married 1819 George Manos (b.1793 and
died 19/12/1836 in Iasi Moldavia)

etc



























"Theron L.Smith"" <tl2smith@flash.net> wrote in message
news:004701c5e7bc$2abbdd30$0f7b8d42@5gt4t01...
mjcar@btinternet.com> wrote Saturday, November 12, 2005 2:56 AM:
Le Bateman" schrieb: "Who were Vlad " The Impaler's descendants? Le
Euweb.cz provides some details:
http://genealogy.euweb.cz/balkan/barab.html

To summarize, the Internet reference has

Ioan Basarab [BASARAB in Moncreiffe], Voivode of Wallachia (ca
1310-1352),
+1352; m.Ana N;
o A2. Nicolae Alexandru, Voivode of Wallachia (1352-64),
o B2. Radu I "Negru Voda", Voivode of Wallachia (1375-83)
o C2. [2m.] Mircea I "the Elder", Despot of Dobruja, Voivode of
Wallachia
o D2. [by Maria Tolmay] Vlad II Dracul "the Dragon", Voivode of
Wallachia
o E2. [1m.] Vlad III Tepes "the Impaler", Voivode of
Wallachia
o E4. [by Catuna N, later Mother Euphrasim, an Abbess] Vlad
IV "Calugarul" "the Monk", Voivode of Wallachia
o F1. [1m.] Radu IV "the Great", Voivode of Wallachia
o G3. Mircea III "Ciobanul" ("the Shepherd"), Voivode
of Wallachia
oH3. Stana [STANCA Basarah in Moncreiffe]
+after 1601; m. Ioan Norocea [JOHN
Morocza
in Moncreiffe] , Logofat de Pitesti, Great Chancellor of Wallachia


FWIW, Sin Iain Moncreiffe's 1982, ROYAL HIGHNESS, p. 100, Chart 32,
presents Stanca Basarah and John Norocza as 12-great grandparents of
Prince Charles, Prince of Wales, which would place the Impaler as an
ancestral uncle.
Can Sir Iian's extensions to this decadency be substantiated?
[Sir Iain also wrote that BASARAB was probably son of TOKTEMIR, great
grandson of JUCHI, son of GENGHIS KHAN.]

Regards to all,
Theron Smith




Leo

Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Leo » 13 nov 2005 02:12:07

At the moment I am looking into the descendants to the present of this
Bogdan III, and they are quite remarkable.
Leo van de Pas

----- Original Message -----
From: "Akrogiali" <akrogiali@westnet.com.au>
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 10:58 AM
Subject: Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler


Bogdan III, "The One Eyed" Mushati married twice and also had two
mistresses.

First Wife: Anastasia married 1510; she died 12/10/1512 NO Children
are known.
Second Wife: Roxandra Bassaraba, married 21/9/1513. NO Children are known

First Mistress: Anastasia Doamna. Died 2/5/1558. ONE Son: Alexandru IV
Lapusneanu (Prince of Moldavia 1552-1561 and 1564-1568) died 5/5/1568)
The Surname may have been the surname of the Mistress).

Second Mistress: Stanca ? (Died 28/1/1518). TWO sons.
Petru Mushati (Died 20/9/1527)
Stefan VI, Mushati (Prince of Moldavia 1517-1527) Died 14/1/1527). Married
Stanca Bassaraba and had ONE son, Ioan, Bogdan Mushati (Died after 1596)
ONE Mistress: Serpega. Son Ioan III (Illegitimate) (Prince of Moldavia
1572-1574) Died 14/6/1574. (Married twice: Princess Maria of Rostov and
Marica Huru)






p
""Leo"" <leo@home.netspeed.com.au> wrote in message
news:007601c5e7cc$c9777140$0300a8c0@Toshiba...
Dear James,

You inspired me to have another look. But it starts with a negative.

Dracula's son Mihnea the Angry married twice, had two sons by his first
wife and that daughter who married Bogdan III by the second wife. Bogdan
III's son Stefan IV, according to ES was fathered by mistress
Stanka/Stana not by the granddaughter of Dracula. But this Stefan married
a Bassaraba, member of Dracula's family. I am looking further and if I
find anything that indicates lines to the present I will let you know.
Leo


----- Original Message -----
From: <Jwc1870@aol.com
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 6:45 AM
Subject: Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler


Dear Michael, Leo, Le, Theron and others,
Vlad III
Tepes
Dracula had at least three children: Vlad Tepelus who claimed the throne
of
Wallachia in oppostion to Basarab the Old from 1476 to at least 1481. A
couple of
websites claim He has modern descendants, a daughter who married Bogdan
III,
Prince of Moldavia who had by him at least his sucessor Stefanita /
Stefan IV
who has known descendants until at least the mid sixteen hundreds
including
Alexander Lapusceanu Prince of Moldavia and Alexander cel Rau Prince
of
Wallachia, also a natural son Mihnea I Cel Rau, Prince of Wallachia
whose male line
descendants down to Prince Mihail Radu occasionally held the Wallachian
throne
down to 1659. The Princes Tepes Dracula were male line descendants down
to at
least Arkady who succeeded his father Peter II in 1845. See
http://msngroups.com/RestratosdelaHisto ... acula.msnw
Sincerely,
James W Cummings
Dixmont, Maine USA






Ford Mommaerts-Browne

Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Ford Mommaerts-Browne » 15 nov 2005 07:46:02

----- Original Message -----
From: <Jwc1870@aol.com>
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 1:45 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler


Dear Michael, Leo, Le, Theron and others,
See
http://msngroups.com/RestratosdelaHisto ... acula.msnw
Sincerely,
James W Cummings
Dixmont, Maine USA

Does not work.

Gjest

Re: Fw: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Gjest » 16 nov 2005 01:06:01

Dear Theron, Michael and others,
There are other lists
including http://www.sizes.com/CHRNWallachia.htm
Rulers of Wallachia which says that Radu Mihnea was a son of Mihnea II and
Ancestors of Prince Rodion Cantacuzene which gives Radu Serban as a son of
Mihnea II, which someone else on list said the same about (Leo ?). who did Radu
Mihnea belong to ? were He and Radu Serban brothers ?
Sincerely,
James W Cummings
Dixmont, Maine USA

Chris Dickinson

Re: Vlad The Impaler

Legg inn av Chris Dickinson » 17 nov 2005 20:17:02

MAR wrote:


Akrogiali schrieb:

One of the still alive family members is

Anastasia, Serban, Bassaraba who married 1819 George Manos (b.1793 and
died
19/12/1836 in Iasi Moldavia)

My goodness! She must be getting on in years now - well over two
hundred years old!


She must have had a stakeholder pension.

[UK political joke - may not make much sense elsewhere]


Chris

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