Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

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John Brandon

Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

Legg inn av John Brandon » 08 nov 2005 20:52:28

A couple years ago, I mentioned a couple, John and Mary (Gifford)
Squire, who were in Boston for a short period in the 1680s, and had a
son Gifford Squire baptized there ...

http://tinyurl.com/a4l24
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: John Brandon
Date: 12 Jul 2003 10:48:09 -0700
Subject: Some Temple and Giffard wills


--Will of Margaret Giffard, widow, of Hammersmith, Middlesex (proved
1692)

I knew that the will of Margaret Giffard, widow, of Hammersmith
(proved 1692) could not belong to the Massachusetts immigrant, since
Hartley's _Ironworks on the Saugus_ states that that lady was alive in
1701 when she petitioned the Massachusetts General Court as to why she
should not be awarded moneys judged (sometime in the 1680's) to be due
to her late husband from Mr. Middlecott. But the coincidence of names
("Hammersmith" was the name of the original ironworks at Lynn, Mass.)
intrigued me, and it DID turn out that there was an interesting
connection to New England:

In the name of God Amen. I Margaret Giffard of Hamersmith in the
County of Midds. widdow being sick and weake in body but of sound and
disposing mind and memory (blessed be God) revoaking all former wills
and Testaments by me at any time heretofore made doe make and declare
this my present last Will and Testament in manor following (that is to
say) ffirst and principally I comend my Soule into the hands of
Almighty God my Creator (... etc.) My body I committ to the Earth to
be decently buried at the discretion of my Executrix hereinafter
named. And I will that not above twenty pounds be expended upon or
about my funerall. And as for such temporall goods and estate as it
hath pleased God to bless me with in this world (my debts and said
funerall expenses being [? thereout] first paid and discharged) I give
and dispose thereof as followeth (that is to say) I give and bequeath
to my four children in Law John Giffard Grace Giffard Elizabeth
Giffard and Ellianor Gifford ffifty pounds a peece in money (that is
to say) ffifty pounds to each and every one of them. Item I give and
bequeath unto my daughters in Law Sarah and Anne Giffard (who are
already [? preferred]) five pounds a peece in money and to my daughter
in Law Mary Squire five shillings she having before received her
portion. Item I give and bequeath unto my grandsonn Gifford Squire
and to my granddaughter Margaret Squire children of the said Mary
Shire [sic] five pounds apeece in money (that is to say) five pounds
to each of them. Item I give and bequeath unto my very loveing freind
Mary Corbeut wife of Edmund Corbet of Hamersmith aforesaid Brewster in
token of the love and affection I beare her for the long and faithfull
service she had formerly done me and my husband five pounds in money.
Item I give and bequeath to Mr. John Houghton Apothecary (my Overseer
herinafter named) ffourty shillings to buy him a ring to weare in
remembrance of me. ... Item I give and bequeath unto my said daughter
Elianor Giffard my Executrix herein after named the full summe of tenn
pounds (above and besides the fifty pounds above given her) for her
trouble and paines in executing this my will ... And I make and
ordaine my said daughter in Law Elianor Gifford sole and only
Executrix of this my last Will and Testament and I make and desire my
good freind the said Mr. John Houghton Apothecary to be Overseer
thereof to see the same performed and to be aiding and assisting to my
Executrix in the executing the same. In witness whereof ... (etc.)
.... set my hand and seale dated the one and twentieth day of September
Anno Dmi One Thousand Six Hundred Ninety One ... in the presence of
Benj. Woodroffe Tho. Buxton Richd Eardley George Blackaller.

The family of Giffards who were Margaret's step-children seem to be
the following people christened at St. Peter-le-Poer (from IGI
extracted records):

-Grace Gifford, dau. of Nicholas and Grace, christened 23 Sept. 1655

-Elizabeth Gifford, dau. of Nicholas and Grace, christened 15 Oct.
1656

-Sarah Gifford, dau. of Nicholas and Grace, christened 28 March 1658

-Mary Gifford, dau. of Nicholas and Grace, christened 27 March 1659

-Charles Gifford, son of Nicholas and Grace, christened 24 June 1660

-Ann Gifford, dau. of Nicholas and Grace, christened 2 Feb. 1661

-Elnor Gifforde, dau. of Nicholas and Grace, christened 7 May 1663

Margaret's will mentioned her step-daughter Mary who was the wife of
___ Squire and who had children named Gifford Squire and Margaret
Squire. I recognized the name "Gifford Squire" from Boston, Mass.,
records. The IGI has the following extracted records concerning
persons named Squire in Boston, Massachusetts (which church would this
be?):

-Philip Squire, son of ___ Squire, christened 24 March 1672

-Rebecca Squire, dau. of Thomas and Martha, christened 8 Aug. 1677

-Martha Squire, dau. of Thomas and Martha, christened 22 May 1679

-Martha Squire, dau. of Thomas and Martha, christened 9 Aug. 1681

-John Squire [no parents named], christened 3 May 1685

-Margaret Squire [no parents named], christened 16 Aug. 1685

-Gifford Squire, son of John and Mary, christened 22 Jan. 1686

-Giffard Squire [no parents named], christened 30 Jan. 1687

Interestingly, the church of St. Peter-le-Poer shows that Nicholas
Squire, son of John and Mary, was christened 29 Nov. 1688, so
evidently the family returned from New England between Jan. 1687 and
November 1688.

I wonder if these Giffards were some connection of Mr. John Gifford of
Lynn and Boston? Does anyone have any information on Nicholas Giffard
and his two wives, Grace and Margaret?

John Brandon

Re: Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

Legg inn av John Brandon » 08 nov 2005 20:59:18

opps ... two sons ....

John Brandon

Re: Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

Legg inn av John Brandon » 08 nov 2005 21:54:27

It occurs to me to wonder if the return of John and Mary (Gifford)
Squire from New England had anything to do with the fact that Mr. John
Gifford made his will on 10 September 1686?

John Brandon

Re: Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

Legg inn av John Brandon » 08 nov 2005 22:03:36

opps ... two sons ....

Guess it would have to be just one son of that name, with both
dates--22 Jan. 1686 [86/7 ?] and 30 Jan. 1687--applying to him
(daughter Margaret was baptized 16 Aug. 1685, surely too soon for
another child baptized in Jan. 1685/6).

Gjest

Re: Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

Legg inn av Gjest » 08 nov 2005 23:21:02

Dear John,
Not unless She were baptized within a few days of her actual
bierthdate. Many People remember, were baptized as adults or as part of a
group of children. Ihave an ancestress who was baptized only a few days after her
birth who had a sister born elsewhere who was more than 3 years old at her
baptism in thre same church (Dorchester, MA ) Two Baptisms of a Child 8 days
apart seems odd, however. Did Mary (Giffard) Squire bear twins a few days apart
and the elder son die , then baptize the younger with the same name?
Sincerely,
James W Cummings
Dixmont, Maine USA

Gjest

Re: Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

Legg inn av Gjest » 08 nov 2005 23:21:15

John Brandon schrieb:

opps ... two sons ....

Guess it would have to be just one son of that name, with both
dates--22 Jan. 1686 [86/7 ?] and 30 Jan. 1687--applying to him
(daughter Margaret was baptized 16 Aug. 1685, surely too soon for
another child baptized in Jan. 1685/6).

Why would one child be baptised twice - highly irregular? Could one be
a private baptism, and the other a public reception? And why is one
quoted as January 1686, and the second as January 1687 if they relate
to two ends of an eight-day period?

John Brandon

Re: Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

Legg inn av John Brandon » 09 nov 2005 00:17:53

Records were being recopied under the paradigm of a Jan-Dec. year and
mistakes were made.

Gjest

Re: Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

Legg inn av Gjest » 09 nov 2005 17:29:01

mjcar@btinternet.com writes:

Why would one child be baptised twice - highly irregular? Could one be
a private baptism, and the other a public reception? And why is one
quoted as January 1686, and the second as January 1687 if they relate
to two ends of an eight-day period?

The first baptism could have been just after birth when the child was not
expected to survive, then the second more formal baptism was when the child
had actually survived and is the baptism which would normally have been the
only one

cheers

Simon

>

John Brandon

Re: Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

Legg inn av John Brandon » 09 nov 2005 17:45:23

The first baptism could have been just after birth when the child was not
expected to survive, then the second more formal baptism was when the child
had actually survived and is the baptism which would normally have been the
only one

Well, maybe, but I wonder how that would square with Puritan/
Presbyterian practices?

Also possible is that there were loose pages of rough notes that
possibly got mixed in when the records were recopied (might explain the
Jan. 22/Jan. 30 date) ...

Gjest

Re: Boston baptisms of the two Gifford Squires

Legg inn av Gjest » 09 nov 2005 19:02:33

John Brandon wrote:
The first baptism could have been just after birth when the child was not
expected to survive, then the second more formal baptism was when the child
had actually survived and is the baptism which would normally have been the
only one

Well, maybe, but I wonder how that would square with Puritan/
Presbyterian practices?

Also possible is that there were loose pages of rough notes that
possibly got mixed in when the records were recopied (might explain the
Jan. 22/Jan. 30 date) ...

I'm not an expert on the Puritan stance, but the usual theological
position is that one can be baptised once only. The 1662 Prayer Book
expresses the Anglican position quite well.

MAR

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