Burke's Peerage 1938 page 2010
Sir John Wingfield, of Letheringham, married Elizabeth daughter of Sir John FitzLewis and Elizabeth Nevill. They had four daughters and twelve sons. The sons are listed and number 11 is Sir Richard Wingfield of Kimbolton Castle. All that Burke's gives here is that in 1522 he became a Knight of the Garter and became an ancestor of Wingfield of Kimbolton, represented by the Duke of Manchester....................but they are Montagus.
In CP I found that his first wife was Catherine Widville, sister of Queen Elizabeth wife of Edward IV. Catherine had been married twice before and most likely was much older. I cannot find any children for them. Catherine died 18 May 1497 and he died 22 July 1525 in Toledo, Spain. As Catherine was mentioned as his first wife, who did he marry next and who were his children?
Kimbolton Castle became in the possession of the Montagu's Earls of Manchester quite soon afterwards but I cannot find a genealogical link. Henry Montagu, 1st Earl of Manchester was created Baron Kimbolton of Kimbolton in 1620, implying ownership.
His ancestry list
1.Henry Montagu, 1st Earl of Manchester 1563-1642
2.Sir Edward Montagu, of Boughton Castle 1532-1602
3.Elizabeth Harington
4.Sir Edward Montagu -1557
5.Ellen Roper
6.Sir James Harington -1592
7.Lucy Sydney
8.Thomas Montagu, of Hemington -1516
9.Agnes Dudley
10.John Roper, of Welhall -1524
11.Jane Fineux
12.Sir John Harington, of Exton -1553
13.Elizabeth Moton
14.Sir William Sydney of Penshurst, -1553
15.Anne Pakenham, -1544
28.Nicholas Sydney, of Penshurst
29.Anne Brandon
58.Sir William Brandon, of Wangford -1491
59.Elizabeth Wingfield -1497
118.Sir Robert Wingfield, of Letheringham 1403-1431
119.Elizabeth Goushill -ca.1402-
Sir Richard Wingfield, of Kimbolton who we started with is a first cousin of 29.Anne Brandon, making him a first cousinfour times removed of Henry Montagu. If Sir Richard had no children, his brothers and sisters did. How could Kimbolton castle end up by the Montagus?
Best wishes
Leo van de Pas
Wingfield lineage
Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper
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Gjest
Re: Wingfield lineage
In a message dated 8/3/05 10:35:23 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
leovdpas@netspeed.com.au writes:
<< In CP I found that his first wife was Catherine Widville, sister of Queen
Elizabeth wife of Edward IV. Catherine had been married twice before and most
likely was much older. I cannot find any children for them. Catherine died 18
May 1497 and he died 22 July 1525 in Toledo, Spain. As Catherine was mentioned
as his first wife, who did he marry next and who were his children? >>
Catherine Widville was born 1449 and since her second husband Jasper Tudor,
Earl of Pembroke died 21 Dec 1495, she would have had to marry Richard
Wingfield 1496/7 she she herself died 18 may 1497 as you stated.
So at their marriage she would have been 47. That explains why you found no
children for this last couple. It would be interesting to know if her
children by Henry Stafford, 2nd Duke of Buckingham [who was executed 2 Nov 1483]
lived with Catherine and Richard, and later just Richard, after Catherine died.
Perhaps their marriages were allowed to Richard, since Edward stafford did
not marry until 1500 and his sister Anne Stafford in Dec 1509 to the
apparently much younger George of Hastings, 1st Earl of Huntingdon.
All-in-all a very propitious match for Richard Wingfield.
Will Johnson
leovdpas@netspeed.com.au writes:
<< In CP I found that his first wife was Catherine Widville, sister of Queen
Elizabeth wife of Edward IV. Catherine had been married twice before and most
likely was much older. I cannot find any children for them. Catherine died 18
May 1497 and he died 22 July 1525 in Toledo, Spain. As Catherine was mentioned
as his first wife, who did he marry next and who were his children? >>
Catherine Widville was born 1449 and since her second husband Jasper Tudor,
Earl of Pembroke died 21 Dec 1495, she would have had to marry Richard
Wingfield 1496/7 she she herself died 18 may 1497 as you stated.
So at their marriage she would have been 47. That explains why you found no
children for this last couple. It would be interesting to know if her
children by Henry Stafford, 2nd Duke of Buckingham [who was executed 2 Nov 1483]
lived with Catherine and Richard, and later just Richard, after Catherine died.
Perhaps their marriages were allowed to Richard, since Edward stafford did
not marry until 1500 and his sister Anne Stafford in Dec 1509 to the
apparently much younger George of Hastings, 1st Earl of Huntingdon.
All-in-all a very propitious match for Richard Wingfield.
Will Johnson
-
Gjest
Re: Wingfield lineage
I'm a little confused about this post. I show via Richardson and Faris
that Elizabeth (FitzLewis) Wingfield was the dau. of Anne Montagu. I'd
appreciate clarification.
Best,
Jeff Chipman
that Elizabeth (FitzLewis) Wingfield was the dau. of Anne Montagu. I'd
appreciate clarification.
Best,
Jeff Chipman
-
Gjest
Re: Wingfield lineage
In a message dated 8/4/05 7:09:35 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
jeffchip9@hotmail.com writes:
<< I'm a little confused about this post. I show via Richardson and Faris
that Elizabeth (FitzLewis) Wingfield was the dau. of Anne Montagu. I'd
appreciate clarification.
Best,
Jeff Chipman >>
The relevant primary evidence is this snippet
"The Chorography of Suffolk", by Diarmaid Maccullough, published in 1976. On
page 94, there is a Latin circumscription taken from the tombs of Sir John
Wingfield and his wife, Elizabeth Fitz Lewis, in the church of Letheringham,
Suffolk.
Evidently only a part of the circumscription was legible at the time it was
transcribed. It reads as follows:
" ... D'ne Elisabeth Arundell Ducisse Norff. et Joh'is Gausell militis qui
quidem Joh'es obijt 11 die mensis Maij a'o D'ni 1481 ac D'na Elisabeth Wingfield
uxor predicti Joh'is filia Anne Montague Ducisse Exon' et ..."
I assume when the original text was prepared, it stated that John Wingfield,
knight, was the son and heir of Robert Wingfield, knight, by his wife, Joan,
daughter of "Lady Elizabeth Arundell Duchess of Norfolk and John Gaushell
knight, which John [Wingfield] died 11 day in the month of May A.D. 1481 and also
Lady Elizabeth Wingfield wife
of the said John [Wingfield] daughter of Anne Montague Duchess of Exeter and
...."
Will Johnson
jeffchip9@hotmail.com writes:
<< I'm a little confused about this post. I show via Richardson and Faris
that Elizabeth (FitzLewis) Wingfield was the dau. of Anne Montagu. I'd
appreciate clarification.
Best,
Jeff Chipman >>
The relevant primary evidence is this snippet
"The Chorography of Suffolk", by Diarmaid Maccullough, published in 1976. On
page 94, there is a Latin circumscription taken from the tombs of Sir John
Wingfield and his wife, Elizabeth Fitz Lewis, in the church of Letheringham,
Suffolk.
Evidently only a part of the circumscription was legible at the time it was
transcribed. It reads as follows:
" ... D'ne Elisabeth Arundell Ducisse Norff. et Joh'is Gausell militis qui
quidem Joh'es obijt 11 die mensis Maij a'o D'ni 1481 ac D'na Elisabeth Wingfield
uxor predicti Joh'is filia Anne Montague Ducisse Exon' et ..."
I assume when the original text was prepared, it stated that John Wingfield,
knight, was the son and heir of Robert Wingfield, knight, by his wife, Joan,
daughter of "Lady Elizabeth Arundell Duchess of Norfolk and John Gaushell
knight, which John [Wingfield] died 11 day in the month of May A.D. 1481 and also
Lady Elizabeth Wingfield wife
of the said John [Wingfield] daughter of Anne Montague Duchess of Exeter and
...."
Will Johnson
-
Gjest
Re: Wingfield lineage
Dear Jeff,
The Accounts of the Hankford family are the same in PA 1, PA
2 and RPA (Plantagenet Ancestry 1st and 2nd editions by David Faris and
Douglas Richardson and Richardson`s Plantagenet Ancestry) which all say that Anne
Montagu, daughter of Sir John , Knt.and Mary (Fraunceys) Montagu married 1st as
his 2nd Wife , Sir Richard Hankford, knt. who died February 1430/1. In about
1433 She married Sir Lewis John, Knt.. Elizabeth Fitz Lewis was born in about
1436. She married Sir John Wingfield, Knt. son and heir of Sir Robert
Wingfield, Knt by Elizabeth Goushill. (See RPA pp 373-375 , also PA2 pp 168-170)
Sincerely,
James W Cummings
Dixmont, Maine USA
The Accounts of the Hankford family are the same in PA 1, PA
2 and RPA (Plantagenet Ancestry 1st and 2nd editions by David Faris and
Douglas Richardson and Richardson`s Plantagenet Ancestry) which all say that Anne
Montagu, daughter of Sir John , Knt.and Mary (Fraunceys) Montagu married 1st as
his 2nd Wife , Sir Richard Hankford, knt. who died February 1430/1. In about
1433 She married Sir Lewis John, Knt.. Elizabeth Fitz Lewis was born in about
1436. She married Sir John Wingfield, Knt. son and heir of Sir Robert
Wingfield, Knt by Elizabeth Goushill. (See RPA pp 373-375 , also PA2 pp 168-170)
Sincerely,
James W Cummings
Dixmont, Maine USA