storing other people's posts
Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper
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Paul K Davis
storing other people's posts
In a recent post, Chris Dickinson wrote "You aren't even supposed to store
other people's posts!"
To the best of my knowledge this is not so. I believe the copyright law
allows individual to make one full copy of any copyrighted material solely
for their own study. You may not have someone else do it for you, either
for pay or gratis.
-- PKD [Paul K Davis, pkd-gm@earthlink.net]
other people's posts!"
To the best of my knowledge this is not so. I believe the copyright law
allows individual to make one full copy of any copyrighted material solely
for their own study. You may not have someone else do it for you, either
for pay or gratis.
-- PKD [Paul K Davis, pkd-gm@earthlink.net]
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Chris Dickinson
Re: storing other people's posts
Paul K Davis wrote:
I was being slightly cheeky in saying that.
This has nothing to do with copyright. It is to do with the terms of use set
in the AUP - to which, by using a Rootsweb mailing list, we are supposed to
have given our consent (hmm!).
The clause isn't really intended to stop you or I from storing posts in out
own archives - it is to prevent Rootsweb data being used commercially by
other organisations.
Chris
In a recent post, Chris Dickinson wrote "You aren't even supposed to store
other people's posts!"
To the best of my knowledge this is not so. I believe the copyright law
allows individual to make one full copy of any copyrighted material solely
for their own study. You may not have someone else do it for you, either
for pay or gratis.
I was being slightly cheeky in saying that.
This has nothing to do with copyright. It is to do with the terms of use set
in the AUP - to which, by using a Rootsweb mailing list, we are supposed to
have given our consent (hmm!).
The clause isn't really intended to stop you or I from storing posts in out
own archives - it is to prevent Rootsweb data being used commercially by
other organisations.
Chris
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Stanford Mommaerts-Browne
Re: storing other people's posts
Paul is 100% correct, according to Title IX of the US Code, (and similar
laws, elsewhere).
F
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul K Davis" <pkd-gm@earthlink.net>
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2005 8:03 PM
Subject: storing other people's posts
laws, elsewhere).
F
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul K Davis" <pkd-gm@earthlink.net>
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2005 8:03 PM
Subject: storing other people's posts
In a recent post, Chris Dickinson wrote "You aren't even supposed to store
other people's posts!"
To the best of my knowledge this is not so. I believe the copyright law
allows individual to make one full copy of any copyrighted material solely
for their own study. You may not have someone else do it for you, either
for pay or gratis.
-- PKD [Paul K Davis, pkd-gm@earthlink.net]
-
Gjest
Re: storing other people's posts
When you say "commercially", I think you've introduced a very important point. Copyright law in general is supporting the *income* of the author. I doubt very much that people posting here expect to generate or protect any income stream and so therefore copyright really wouldn't come up.
When you sue for copyright infringement you have to show specific damage, that is in financial terms. Otherwise the judge may make one of those famous judgements, "yes You're right, but since you have no damages, I award you one dollar plus attorney's fees."
So that makes emails a quite different animal than a book for example. If I were to post one-third of CP online, I'd be infringing on their income stream. They'd have specific financial damage and sue me for recovery and cease-and-desist. If I were to repost an email from someone on this list, that would not be the case.
Will Johnson
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Dickinson <chris@dickinson.uk.net>
To: GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com
Sent: Sat, 9 Apr 2005 03:41:27 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: Re: storing other people's posts
Paul K Davis wrote:
I was being slightly cheeky in saying that.
This has nothing to do with copyright. It is to do with the terms of use set
in the AUP - to which, by using a Rootsweb mailing list, we are supposed to
have given our consent (hmm!).
The clause isn't really intended to stop you or I from storing posts in out
own archives - it is to prevent Rootsweb data being used commercially by
other organisations.
Chris
When you sue for copyright infringement you have to show specific damage, that is in financial terms. Otherwise the judge may make one of those famous judgements, "yes You're right, but since you have no damages, I award you one dollar plus attorney's fees."
So that makes emails a quite different animal than a book for example. If I were to post one-third of CP online, I'd be infringing on their income stream. They'd have specific financial damage and sue me for recovery and cease-and-desist. If I were to repost an email from someone on this list, that would not be the case.
Will Johnson
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Dickinson <chris@dickinson.uk.net>
To: GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com
Sent: Sat, 9 Apr 2005 03:41:27 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: Re: storing other people's posts
Paul K Davis wrote:
In a recent post, Chris Dickinson wrote "You aren't even supposed to store
other people's posts!"
To the best of my knowledge this is not so. I believe the copyright law
allows individual to make one full copy of any copyrighted material solely
for their own study. You may not have someone else do it for you, either
for pay or gratis.
I was being slightly cheeky in saying that.
This has nothing to do with copyright. It is to do with the terms of use set
in the AUP - to which, by using a Rootsweb mailing list, we are supposed to
have given our consent (hmm!).
The clause isn't really intended to stop you or I from storing posts in out
own archives - it is to prevent Rootsweb data being used commercially by
other organisations.
Chris
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Gjest
Re: storing other people's posts
In addition this restriction would imply that you cannot have an email account. An email account is a temporary storage of email posts. So If I can't store them, than I can't even store them for one second, let alone the day or so it takes me to read them.
Then following upon that, I could not store them in my "Old Mail" Folder either. This is an automatic function of my email reader, so therefore they are violating copyright hundreds of millions of time every day. I would suggest that you might want to re-think your position on this Chris
Will Johnson
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul K Davis <pkd-gm@earthlink.net>
To: GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com
Sent: Fri, 8 Apr 2005 20:03:49 -0700
Subject: storing other people's posts
In a recent post, Chris Dickinson wrote "You aren't even supposed to store
other people's posts!"
To the best of my knowledge this is not so. I believe the copyright law
allows individual to make one full copy of any copyrighted material solely
for their own study. You may not have someone else do it for you, either
for pay or gratis.
-- PKD [Paul K Davis, pkd-gm@earthlink.net]
Then following upon that, I could not store them in my "Old Mail" Folder either. This is an automatic function of my email reader, so therefore they are violating copyright hundreds of millions of time every day. I would suggest that you might want to re-think your position on this Chris
Will Johnson
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul K Davis <pkd-gm@earthlink.net>
To: GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com
Sent: Fri, 8 Apr 2005 20:03:49 -0700
Subject: storing other people's posts
In a recent post, Chris Dickinson wrote "You aren't even supposed to store
other people's posts!"
To the best of my knowledge this is not so. I believe the copyright law
allows individual to make one full copy of any copyrighted material solely
for their own study. You may not have someone else do it for you, either
for pay or gratis.
-- PKD [Paul K Davis, pkd-gm@earthlink.net]
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Chris Dickinson
Re: storing other people's posts
Will Jonson wrote:
Yes.
<snip>
If someone left their car door open with the keys in the ignition, and you
stole it without any threat of retribution, the act of theft still remains
an act of theft.
Anyway, I'm sure by now that everyone on this list/newsgroup is sick
and tired of the issue. I won't be posting any more on it.
Chris
When you say "commercially", I think you've introduced a very important
point. Copyright law in general is supporting the *income* of the author.
Yes.
<snip>
So that makes emails a quite different animal than a book for example. If
I were to post one-third of CP online, I'd be infringing on their income
stream. They'd have specific financial damage and sue me for recovery and
cease-and-desist. If I were to repost an email from someone on this list,
that would not be the case.
If someone left their car door open with the keys in the ignition, and you
stole it without any threat of retribution, the act of theft still remains
an act of theft.
Anyway, I'm sure by now that everyone on this list/newsgroup is sick
and tired of the issue. I won't be posting any more on it.
Chris
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Chris Dickinson
Re: storing other people's posts
Will Jonson wrote:
<snip>
so therefore they are violating copyright hundreds of millions of time every
day.
<snip>
As I clarified in another post, this is AUP not copyright.
Chris
<snip>
so therefore they are violating copyright hundreds of millions of time every
day.
<snip>
As I clarified in another post, this is AUP not copyright.
Chris
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Todd A. Farmerie
Re: storing other people's posts
I am sure this is getting a bit tedious, but a few of these issues are
relevant to broader research in the real world, not just USENET.
Paul K Davis wrote:
I suspect that you are right with respect to posts - they are
distributed in the manner to which the author gave implied consent by
posting, and there is no mandate to then delete them from a computer
where they legitimately appeared, nor does the law prevent the rendering
of something into a more convenient format, for personal use, by someone
who legitimately posesses a copy (e.g. you can purchase a music CD and
copy it into MP3 format, but for personal use only).
However, you cannot make a full copy of just anything, even for personal
study. You cannot, for example, copy an entire library book that is
still in print - you are expected to buy a copy. The rights to copy
under 'fair use' depends on the complex interplay involving the
proportion of the entire work involved, the potential financial impact
on the copyright holder, availability of the original, purpose of
copying, etc.
taf
relevant to broader research in the real world, not just USENET.
Paul K Davis wrote:
In a recent post, Chris Dickinson wrote "You aren't even supposed to store
other people's posts!"
To the best of my knowledge this is not so. I believe the copyright law
allows individual to make one full copy of any copyrighted material solely
for their own study.
I suspect that you are right with respect to posts - they are
distributed in the manner to which the author gave implied consent by
posting, and there is no mandate to then delete them from a computer
where they legitimately appeared, nor does the law prevent the rendering
of something into a more convenient format, for personal use, by someone
who legitimately posesses a copy (e.g. you can purchase a music CD and
copy it into MP3 format, but for personal use only).
However, you cannot make a full copy of just anything, even for personal
study. You cannot, for example, copy an entire library book that is
still in print - you are expected to buy a copy. The rights to copy
under 'fair use' depends on the complex interplay involving the
proportion of the entire work involved, the potential financial impact
on the copyright holder, availability of the original, purpose of
copying, etc.
taf
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Gordon Banks
Re: storing other people's posts
Email address to me belongs to me. The copyright may reside with the
author, but if it is sent to me, I can store it.
On Fri, 2005-04-08 at 23:17 -0700, Stanford Mommaerts-Browne wrote:
Gordon Banks <geb@gordonbanks.com>
author, but if it is sent to me, I can store it.
On Fri, 2005-04-08 at 23:17 -0700, Stanford Mommaerts-Browne wrote:
Paul is 100% correct, according to Title IX of the US Code, (and similar
laws, elsewhere).
F
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul K Davis" <pkd-gm@earthlink.net
To: <GEN-MEDIEVAL-L@rootsweb.com
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2005 8:03 PM
Subject: storing other people's posts
In a recent post, Chris Dickinson wrote "You aren't even supposed to store
other people's posts!"
To the best of my knowledge this is not so. I believe the copyright law
allows individual to make one full copy of any copyrighted material solely
for their own study. You may not have someone else do it for you, either
for pay or gratis.
-- PKD [Paul K Davis, pkd-gm@earthlink.net]
--
Gordon Banks <geb@gordonbanks.com>
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Janet Ariciu
genealogy copyright law
I googled and I found three site that you all might like to read.
Who Owns Genealogy? Cousins and Copyright
http://www.genealogy.com/genealogy/14_cpyrt.html
Copyright General Statement
http://www.usgenweb.org/volunteers/copyright.shtml
The best to last
Copyrights & Wrongs
http://www.oz.net/~markhow/writing/copy.htm
Copyright Fundamentals for Genealogy
by Mike Goad
http://www.pddoc.com/copyright/genealog ... entals.htm
This four out of 665,000
Janet
Who Owns Genealogy? Cousins and Copyright
http://www.genealogy.com/genealogy/14_cpyrt.html
Copyright General Statement
http://www.usgenweb.org/volunteers/copyright.shtml
The best to last
Copyrights & Wrongs
http://www.oz.net/~markhow/writing/copy.htm
Copyright Fundamentals for Genealogy
by Mike Goad
http://www.pddoc.com/copyright/genealog ... entals.htm
This four out of 665,000
Janet