Aston-Kinnersley-Bradshaw-Fowke

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Aston-Kinnersley-Bradshaw-Fowke

Legg inn av Gjest » 03 des 2004 19:11:02

Subject:
Subject: Aston-Kinnersley-Bradshaw-Fowke


Hi,


I as sending this to you to look at since you have done such good work on the
Astons. If you would prefer, I will send to Richardson or gen med. I just
hate to send this out and watch another fight.

Recently, Douglas Richardson quoted material in gen. med. which he said
showed the descent of Gerard Fowke from John de Welles, 4th Baron Welles and Maud
de Ros. The line is given in RD600, 437-8:

Maud de Ros = John de Welles
Margery de Welles = Stephen le Scrope
Maud le Scrope = Sir Baldwin Freville
Joyce Freville = Sir Roger Aston
Sir Robert Aston = Isabella Brereton
John Aston = Elizabeth Delves
Margery Aston = John Kinnersley
Isabel Kinnersley = John Bradshaw
Anne Bradshaw = John Fowke
Francis Fowke = Jane Raynsford
John Fowke = Dorothy Cupper
Roger Fowke = Mary Bayley
Col. Gerard Fowke = Anne Thoroughgood

Gary Boyd Roberts’ sources cited included Schieffelin (In Search of a Magna
Carta Signer -- Fowke); Kynnersley (A History of the Family of Kynnserley of
Leighton, Shrops.), and Clifford and Clifford (Tixall – Aston). I have
Schieffelin, am getting Tixall, and can’t yet find Kynnserley. Roberts makes it
clear he would like “A definitive monograph on the Aston-Kinnersley-Bradshaw-Fowke
link.â€

Gjest

Re: Aston-Kinnersley-Bradshaw-Fowke

Legg inn av Gjest » 03 des 2004 19:21:02

Hi,
As I was trying to say, stupedly, on the Fowke line, this is not a standard
erratum of PA3, since several other published works are involved. So I
decidedly after someone's advice, to submitt it to gen.med. I have yet to meet
someone on this line who doesn't have a lot of information to offer, although
some like to fight as well. I hope this will bring information, not blood.
Thanks, Charlie McNett

Douglas Richardson

Re: Aston-Kinnersley-Bradshaw-Fowke

Legg inn av Douglas Richardson » 04 des 2004 09:20:45

My comments are interspersed below. DR

CMcNett@aol.com wrote in message news:<1ad.2c615d60.2ee204a8@aol.com>...
Subject:
Subject: Aston-Kinnersley-Bradshaw-Fowke


Hi,

Thank you for your good post. You've raised some good questions.

I as sending this to you to look at since you have done such good work on the
Astons. If you would prefer, I will send to Richardson or gen med. I just
hate to send this out and watch another fight.

Recently, Douglas Richardson quoted material in gen. med. which he said
showed the descent of Gerard Fowke from John de Welles, 4th Baron Welles and
Maud de Ros. The line is given in RD600, 437-8:

Maud de Ros = John de Welles
Margery de Welles = Stephen le Scrope
Maud le Scrope = Sir Baldwin Freville
Joyce Freville = Sir Roger Aston
Sir Robert Aston = Isabella Brereton
John Aston = Elizabeth Delves
Margery Aston = John Kinnersley
Isabel Kinnersley = John Bradshaw
Anne Bradshaw = John Fowke
Francis Fowke = Jane Raynsford
John Fowke = Dorothy Cupper
Roger Fowke = Mary Bayley
Col. Gerard Fowke = Anne Thoroughgood

The line above is sound down to John Aston who married Elizabeth
Delves. Beyond that, I have no particulars.

[quote]Gary Boyd Roberts’ sources cited included Schieffelin (In Search of a Magna
Carta Signer -- Fowke); Kynnersley (A History of the Family of Kynnserley of
Leighton, Shrops.), and Clifford and Clifford (Tixall â€" Aston). I have
Schieffelin, am getting Tixall, and can’t yet find Kynnserley. Roberts makes > it clear he would like “A definitive monograph on the
Aston-Kinnersley-Bradshaw-Fowke link.â€Â

Gjest

Re: Aston-Kinnersley-Bradshaw-Fowke

Legg inn av Gjest » 04 jan 2005 01:11:01

Brice Clagett, writing on 1/3/05 from gen-med and sgm noted:
At least three secondary sources say that Margery or Margaret
Aston, wife of John Kinnersley, was not the daughter (as
per RD600) of John Aston who married Elizabeth Delves,
but rather his sister, being daughter of Sir Robert Aston:

Thomas and Arthur Clifford, A Topographical and Historical
Description of the Parish of Tixall in the County of
Stafford (1817) p. 198; Foss, The Judges of England p.
751; Burke's Peerage (106th ed.) p. 3063.

It is true that Margery/Margaret is not listed as a child of
Sir Robert Aston in the Visitation of Staffordshire of 1583,
which does list two other daughters, but that hardly precludes
there having been more.

I have seen the Kinnersley book to which Mr. McNett refers,
but don't remember how it deals with this point. I believe the
book is at the NEHGS library.
I am glad he has those facts, which fit in very well with the listing of the
Visitation of Warwickshire 1619 by Schieffelin (p. 10) which says:
"ob. 10 E.4 (1470) John Kindardesley =Margaret daughter of Robert Aston de
Tixall. Renupta Rad'o Wolesley" It is the Burkes Dormant and Extinct Peerages
which lists Margaret as the daughter of John Aston.

I am attempting to get all the sources cited by Roberts in RD600 and
Richardson in PA3. Clagett suggested NEHGS as a source for the history of the
Kynnersleys, NEHGS do not list it, nor does LDS. Anyone know a source?? It is
important because it also should list the child Isabel of John Kynnersley and
Margart Aston.

The following three sources are also difficult to find, not available at LDS
on tape to borrow but at the main library:
Calendar of Patent Rolls of Edward IV 1461-1467 (1897) pp 549-550
VCH Stafford 5 (1959): p. 6
Rev. Shaw HIstory and Antiquities of Staffordshire 2 v. 1798 -1801, part 1,
p. 60

Thanks so much to Clagett, waiting with baited breath for the history of the
Clagetts.

Charlie McNett

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