Use it for what?

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Paul Blair

Use it for what?

Legg inn av Paul Blair » 6. februar 2007 kl. 22.17

Seen in a different place:

Can I use (name of family program) to record rat-breeding?

(This rather parallels similar requests from dog breeders)

How do you figure out the families???

Paul

Austin W. Spencer

Re: Use it for what?

Legg inn av Austin W. Spencer » 7. februar 2007 kl. 2.47

On Feb 6, 4:17 pm, Paul Blair <pbl...@pcug.org.au> wrote:
Seen in a different place:

Can I use (name of family program) to record rat-breeding?

(This rather parallels similar requests from dog breeders)

How do you figure out the families???

Paul

Easy. Assume controlled breeding -- much easier to track than the
alternative. (Also truer to the precedent of the purebred dogs.)
Create a family group every time you breed any two particular rats.
Record the litter in that family group. Repeat with another family
group and a different pair of rats. You will have to give each of the
little runts names, of course. And your program, given expectations
about HUMAN couplings, will always wonder why its "men" and "women"
are breeding in their twos and threes.

Austin W. Spencer

Hugh Watkins

Re: Use it for what?

Legg inn av Hugh Watkins » 7. februar 2007 kl. 6.17

Austin W. Spencer wrote:
On Feb 6, 4:17 pm, Paul Blair <pbl...@pcug.org.au> wrote:

Seen in a different place:

Can I use (name of family program) to record rat-breeding?

(This rather parallels similar requests from dog breeders)

How do you figure out the families???

Paul


Easy. Assume controlled breeding -- much easier to track than the
alternative. (Also truer to the precedent of the purebred dogs.)
Create a family group every time you breed any two particular rats.
Record the litter in that family group. Repeat with another family
group and a different pair of rats. You will have to give each of the
little runts names, of course.

numbers will be good enough
but will you tattoo them on?

And your program, given expectations
about HUMAN couplings, will always wonder why its "men" and "women"
are breeding in their twos and threes.


wonder?

no computer can think only give an illusion of thought through calculation

wonderment is reserved for some of us

Hugh W

--

a wonderful artist in Denmark
http://www.ingerlisekristoffersen.dk/

Beta blogger
http://snaps4.blogspot.com/ photographs and walks

old blogger GENEALOGE
http://hughw36.blogspot.com/ MAIN BLOG

cecilia

Re: Use it for what?

Legg inn av cecilia » 7. februar 2007 kl. 9.27

Paul Blair <pblair@pcug.org.au> wrote:

Seen in a different place:
Can I use (name of family program) to record rat-breeding?
(This rather parallels similar requests from dog breeders)
How do you figure out the families???

For the idly curious, dogs may have pedigrees of lengths to make one a
liitle envious.

eg

http://www.greyhound-data.com/d?i=413643&z=9UA44D

Vain Jet (b 2000) -4- Sand Man -4- Mixed Harmony -4-
Talbotstown III -4- Under the Globe -4- St Patrick -4- Figaro -4-
Hercules -4- Wonder -4- Old Phoenix (b 177x, 45 generations before
Vain Jet)

Kerry Raymond

Re: Use it for what?

Legg inn av Kerry Raymond » 7. februar 2007 kl. 10.49

For the idly curious, dogs may have pedigrees of lengths to make one a
liitle envious.

Yes, having your generations 20-30 years apart really slows down the family
tree.

Kerry Raymond

Re: Use it for what?

Legg inn av Kerry Raymond » 7. februar 2007 kl. 11.01

Create a family group every time you breed any two particular rats.
Record the litter in that family group. Repeat with another family
group and a different pair of rats. You will have to give each of the
little runts names, of course.

Well, in a world that seems to have given up on marriage in favour of random
couplings, donor semen and surrogate mothers, genealogists might well take
to using rat breeding software. You'd still have to give each of the little
runts names, of course.

Kerry

Austin W. Spencer

Re: Use it for what?

Legg inn av Austin W. Spencer » 8. februar 2007 kl. 2.32

On Feb 7, 12:17 am, Hugh Watkins <hugh.watk...@gmail.com> wrote:
Austin W. Spencer wrote:
On Feb 6, 4:17 pm, Paul Blair <pbl...@pcug.org.au> wrote:

Seen in a different place:

Can I use (name of family program) to record rat-breeding?

(This rather parallels similar requests from dog breeders)

How do you figure out the families???

Paul

Easy. Assume controlled breeding -- much easier to track than the
alternative. (Also truer to the precedent of the purebred dogs.)
Create a family group every time you breed any two particular rats.
Record the litter in that family group. Repeat with another family
group and a different pair of rats. You will have to give each of the
little runts names, of course.

numbers will be good enough
but will you tattoo them on?

The thing to understand about controlled breeding is that in order to
carry it off, you'd better control everything else. Isolate two rats
to induce them to mate, and then isolate the mother with her litter
until the young mature, and then separate the rats and keep them in
separate cages to prevent unplanned matings. Once they can live on
food other than mother's milk, the breeder has to feed them. (I only
said controlled breeding was easy to TRACK. And the same, for that
matter, is once again true of purebred dogs.)

The point of al this is that you can name, number, and generally
identify the rats in your lab based on which cage they originally
belonged to. It gets more complicated as your population grows larger
and rats move from cage to cage, perchance to mate. But names and
labels designated at birth can move from cage to cage as well and need
not be fixed to their bodies with a needle.

So what it really means "to use (name of family program) to record rat-
breeding)," as Paul originally put it, is to put each of those records
into a certain kind of database and then draw specific relations among
them, based on the controlled breeding experiments being done in the
lab. There is no technical obstacle; all we need are some kind of
records to put in.

And your program, given expectations
about HUMAN couplings, will always wonder why its "men" and "women"
are breeding in their twos and threes.

wonder?

no computer can think only give an illusion of thought through calculation

wonderment is reserved for some of us

Hugh W

I was thinking of those problem analyzers that halt data entry when we
do something we "should not." If I give an English nobleman the title
of a "5th Earl," PAF tells me: "Numbers and punctuation are typically
not typed as part of a name." And heaven forfend that any human should
get married more than 60 years after birth or less than 12 years
(which sometimes did happen among medieval nobles, as well).

Austin W. Spencer

Austin W. Spencer

Re: Use it for what?

Legg inn av Austin W. Spencer » 8. februar 2007 kl. 3.11

On Feb 7, 3:27 am, m...@ic24.net (cecilia) wrote:
Paul Blair <pbl...@pcug.org.au> wrote:
Seen in a different place:
Can I use (name of family program) to record rat-breeding?
(This rather parallels similar requests from dog breeders)
How do you figure out the families???

For the idly curious, dogs may have pedigrees of lengths to make one a
liitle envious.

eg

http://www.greyhound-data.com/d?i=413643&z=9UA44D

Vain Jet (b 2000) -4- Sand Man -4- Mixed Harmony -4-
Talbotstown III -4- Under the Globe -4- St Patrick -4- Figaro -4-
Hercules -4- Wonder -4- Old Phoenix (b 177x, 45 generations before
Vain Jet)

The ancestor loss does not make me envious. Eighty-four percent in 12
generations? Yikes!

AWS

singhals

Re: Use it for what?

Legg inn av singhals » 8. februar 2007 kl. 22.56

Austin W. Spencer wrote:

I was thinking of those problem analyzers that halt data entry when we
do something we "should not." If I give an English nobleman the title
of a "5th Earl," PAF tells me: "Numbers and punctuation are typically
not typed as part of a name." And heaven forfend that any human should
get married more than 60 years after birth or less than 12 years
(which sometimes did happen among medieval nobles, as well).

PAF tells you it thinks there's a possible problem. My
approach is to mumble "Cope" and click OK. It's been
working a lot of years for me.

Cheryl

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