Does your program?

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hlmw

Does your program?

Legg inn av hlmw » 02 jan 2008 17:23:46

Do you know of a genealogy program that has a place to identify a
person as 'illegitimate' with a click or would it have to be
specifically entered somewhere in a program?
Please do not misunderstand my question. I do not wish to make such an
entry in my genealogy program, but have come across a genealogy document
of recent origin that so identifies a person.
Lorna

Bruce Remick

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av Bruce Remick » 02 jan 2008 17:51:39

"hlmw" <hlmw1@telus.net> wrote in message
news:mailman.1470.1199291084.4586.alt-genealogy@rootsweb.com...
Do you know of a genealogy program that has a place to identify a person
as 'illegitimate' with a click or would it have to be specifically entered
somewhere in a program?
Please do not misunderstand my question. I do not wish to make such an
entry in my genealogy program, but have come across a genealogy document
of recent origin that so identifies a person.
Lorna


If you don't want to enter an illegitimate birth directly into your program,
why not simply cite it in the notes for the father or mother. Although it
may be an illegitimate child according to civil law, it is still the
legitimate child of the woman who bore it and of the man who fathered it.
Your program notes can be easily edited if necessary, depending upon who you
might want to pass the information to.

Bruce

hlmw

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av hlmw » 02 jan 2008 20:09:06

Bruce Remick wrote:
"hlmw" <hlmw1@telus.net> wrote in message
news:mailman.1470.1199291084.4586.alt-genealogy@rootsweb.com...

Do you know of a genealogy program that has a place to identify a person
as 'illegitimate' with a click or would it have to be specifically entered
somewhere in a program?
Please do not misunderstand my question. I do not wish to make such an
entry in my genealogy program, but have come across a genealogy document
of recent origin that so identifies a person.
Lorna



If you don't want to enter an illegitimate birth directly into your program,
why not simply cite it in the notes for the father or mother. Although it
may be an illegitimate child according to civil law, it is still the
legitimate child of the woman who bore it and of the man who fathered it.
Your program notes can be easily edited if necessary, depending upon who you
might want to pass the information to.

Bruce

I am wondering why a person has been indentified as 'illegitimate' for

legal purposes.
Thanks, Lorna
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saki

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av saki » 02 jan 2008 20:29:54

hlmw <hlmw1@telus.net> wrote in
news:mailman.1480.1199300991.4586.alt-genealogy@rootsweb.com:

Bruce Remick wrote:

If you don't want to enter an illegitimate birth directly into your
program, why not simply cite it in the notes for the father or
mother. Although it may be an illegitimate child according to civil
law, it is still the legitimate child of the woman who bore it and of
the man who fathered it. Your program notes can be easily edited if
necessary, depending upon who you might want to pass the information
to.

Rather than the "legitimate child" (which has a specific legal meaning)
wouldn't you be better off referring to "the actual child" here of two
specific parents? I agree with you that the notes section of the program
would be a good place to indicate this.

Whether the parents of the child are married to each other might well be
of some historical importance. I'm working on a project now involving
German church records in Charleston SC. Until I started reading the
records more closely, I realized I had previously missed important words
like "ledig" (single) after the parents' names.

I am wondering why a person has been indentified as 'illegitimate' for
legal purposes.

I would imagine that inheritance might be one reason for a legal
identification.

----
saki@ucla.edu
http://sakionline.net/familypage

JD

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av JD » 03 jan 2008 15:57:36

hlmw <hlmw1@telus.net> wrote:

Do you know of a genealogy program that has a place to identify a
person as 'illegitimate' with a click or would it have to be
specifically entered somewhere in a program?
Please do not misunderstand my question. I do not wish to make such an
entry in my genealogy program, but have come across a genealogy document
of recent origin that so identifies a person.
Lorna


You might have a look at GenoPro at
http://www.genopro.com to see if possibly it's the origin.

I haven't used it myself enough to know the answer to your software
question, but it seems likely to be able to do that type of relationship
automatically. It appears to be flexible enough to enter & display medical
and social relationships, as well as biological ones.

JD

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av JD » 03 jan 2008 16:27:04

JD <jd4x4@<del.this>verizon.net> wrote:

You might have a look at GenoPro at
http://www.genopro.com to see if possibly it's the origin.

I haven't used it myself enough to know the answer to your software
question, but it seems likely to be able to do that type of
relationship automatically. It appears to be flexible enough to enter
& display medical and social relationships, as well as biological
ones.

I installed a demo copy (was eventually going to anyhow) and while there is
not already a pre-defined "illegitimate" child relationship, it would be
very simple to define one. There are however 23 pre-defined "union"
relationships other than "marriage", such as "legal cohabitation" and
"rape/forced" which can join two individuals and allow for a biological
offspring so I'm a bit amazed that "illegitimate" wasn't a pre-defined
option! It would be easy to define it, and selectable with a "click", btw.

And, I haven't tried any of the reports or queries that might have produced
a document as you describe, but I'm betting GenoPro would be a likely
producer!

Fred McKenzie

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av Fred McKenzie » 03 jan 2008 19:49:28

In article <mailman.1470.1199291084.4586.alt-genealogy@rootsweb.com>,
hlmw <hlmw1@telus.net> wrote:

Do you know of a genealogy program that has a place to identify a
person as 'illegitimate' with a click or would it have to be
specifically entered somewhere in a program?

I see that Reunion allows a couple to be listed as "Unmarried",
"Marriage" (with dates) or "Common Law" (with dates). If unmarried, the
offspring would be assumed to be illegitimate. Of course notes that
refer to a legal document might be appropriate.

Terms like bastard and illegitimate are considered derogatory. It isn't
the child's fault, but the child gets the blame! I don't think use of
these terms are necessary for genealogical purposes. Listing parents as
unmarried should be sufficient.

Fred

Texas Gen

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av Texas Gen » 03 jan 2008 21:04:37

I don't know if anyone has said this yet, but Legacy has the "This couple
never married" option.

Donna

Gjest

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av Gjest » 04 jan 2008 00:00:10

Reunion (Mac based program) allows you to indicate illegitimacy - it's
part of a status pick list for children. Same pick list allows you to
indicate the individual as step kid, god child, adopted, stillborn,
died as infant, died as child, twin, family pet and all kinds of
stuff.

My great grandmother (born in the 1870's) was illegitimate - her
mother had two children, despite never being married or living common
law (she kept house for her father and a cousin). No idea who the
father(s) were. The birth certificates actually say illegitimate, and
no indication of paternity.

M

Bruce Remick

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av Bruce Remick » 04 jan 2008 02:05:16

"Fred McKenzie" <fmmck@aol.com> wrote in message
news:fmmck-EDD167.13492503012008@nntp.aioe.org...
In article <mailman.1470.1199291084.4586.alt-genealogy@rootsweb.com>,
hlmw <hlmw1@telus.net> wrote:

Do you know of a genealogy program that has a place to identify a
person as 'illegitimate' with a click or would it have to be
specifically entered somewhere in a program?

I see that Reunion allows a couple to be listed as "Unmarried",
"Marriage" (with dates) or "Common Law" (with dates). If unmarried, the
offspring would be assumed to be illegitimate. Of course notes that
refer to a legal document might be appropriate.

Terms like bastard and illegitimate are considered derogatory. It isn't
the child's fault, but the child gets the blame! I don't think use of
these terms are necessary for genealogical purposes. Listing parents as
unmarried should be sufficient.

Fred

I still prefer to use the Notes section to explain things in my Remick
program database. If the birth date of a couple's first child is earlier
than their date of marriage, I acknowledge this and explain my birth &
marriage date sources in Notes for the mother. No need for an
"illegitimate" label. If I can determine that a particular Remick female
had a child and was not married at the time, I list the child with the
mother and explain in Notes what I know about the woman's marital status.
If the child did not stay with its mother, I say so under Notes for the
child but will continue to follow the child through life.

If a Remick male has fathered a child out of wedlock, I will list the child
with the man and mention the circumstances in the Notes for the child. I
will try to continue to follow the child since it is related to a Remick by
blood.

As Fred mentions, there probably is no need for an "illegitimate" label per
se.

Bruce

hlmw

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av hlmw » 04 jan 2008 03:18:48

Fred McKenzie wrote:
In article <mailman.1470.1199291084.4586.alt-genealogy@rootsweb.com>,
hlmw <hlmw1@telus.net> wrote:


Do you know of a genealogy program that has a place to identify a
person as 'illegitimate' with a click or would it have to be
specifically entered somewhere in a program?


I see that Reunion allows a couple to be listed as "Unmarried",
"Marriage" (with dates) or "Common Law" (with dates). If unmarried, the
offspring would be assumed to be illegitimate. Of course notes that
refer to a legal document might be appropriate.

Terms like bastard and illegitimate are considered derogatory. It isn't
the child's fault, but the child gets the blame! I don't think use of
these terms are necessary for genealogical purposes. Listing parents as
unmarried should be sufficient.

Fred

Thank you for your comments with which I agree entirely. It happens that

I have seen a family tree printout with that word beside the name and am
wondering why it was entered as such. I think that the suggestion
already raised about a possible beneficiary being thus identified for
legal purposes, might be correct.
Lorna

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ALT-GENEALOGY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without
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>

hlmw

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av hlmw » 04 jan 2008 03:26:22

Mary_Gordon@tvo.org wrote:
Reunion (Mac based program) allows you to indicate illegitimacy - it's
part of a status pick list for children. Same pick list allows you to
indicate the individual as step kid, god child, adopted, stillborn,
died as infant, died as child, twin, family pet and all kinds of
stuff.

My great grandmother (born in the 1870's) was illegitimate - her
mother had two children, despite never being married or living common
law (she kept house for her father and a cousin). No idea who the
father(s) were. The birth certificates actually say illegitimate, and
no indication of paternity.

Thank you, this is what I have wanted to find out. I thought there had

to be a program that would allow for every 'contingency' - not that I
want to use it.
Lorna
M

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To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ALT-GENEALOGY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message


hlmw

Re: Does your program?

Legg inn av hlmw » 04 jan 2008 03:26:22

Mary_Gordon@tvo.org wrote:
Reunion (Mac based program) allows you to indicate illegitimacy - it's
part of a status pick list for children. Same pick list allows you to
indicate the individual as step kid, god child, adopted, stillborn,
died as infant, died as child, twin, family pet and all kinds of
stuff.

My great grandmother (born in the 1870's) was illegitimate - her
mother had two children, despite never being married or living common
law (she kept house for her father and a cousin). No idea who the
father(s) were. The birth certificates actually say illegitimate, and
no indication of paternity.

Thank you, this is what I have wanted to find out. I thought there had

to be a program that would allow for every 'contingency' - not that I
want to use it.
Lorna
M

-------------------------------
To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to ALT-GENEALOGY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message


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