Mysterious gravestone
Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper
-
clifto
Mysterious gravestone
Brought mom-in-law out to the cemetery where her husband is buried, and
it was enlightening. She showed us a few graves we didn't know about,
including three or four that I was practically standing on before but
didn't realize were associated with the family plot.
I had a location sheet from a previous trip and took a quick meander to
try to find it. I'm not at all certain I did. I did find a marker with
the right last name, but no hint of the person himself. I was looking for
Nicola Caffarella. I found one-inch letters:
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
and way below that, the name CAFFARELLA in four-inch letters.
Mom-in-law has absolutely no idea who these people might be, and her
memory seems awfully good about family details.
My main question is, why would the stone say "Caffarella" without any hint
of any Caffarellas in the grave? Second question: can anyone explain the
format of the Traficante information?
--
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
it was enlightening. She showed us a few graves we didn't know about,
including three or four that I was practically standing on before but
didn't realize were associated with the family plot.
I had a location sheet from a previous trip and took a quick meander to
try to find it. I'm not at all certain I did. I did find a marker with
the right last name, but no hint of the person himself. I was looking for
Nicola Caffarella. I found one-inch letters:
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
and way below that, the name CAFFARELLA in four-inch letters.
Mom-in-law has absolutely no idea who these people might be, and her
memory seems awfully good about family details.
My main question is, why would the stone say "Caffarella" without any hint
of any Caffarellas in the grave? Second question: can anyone explain the
format of the Traficante information?
--
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
-
Hugh Watkins
Re: Mysterious gravestone
clifto wrote:
purely a guess
the maiden name of the girls
or their grandmother . .
Hugh W
--
For genealogy and help with family and local history in Bristol and
district http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Brycgstow/
http://snaps4.blogspot.com/ photographs and walks
GENEALOGE http://hughw36.blogspot.com/ MAIN BLOG
Brought mom-in-law out to the cemetery where her husband is buried, and
it was enlightening. She showed us a few graves we didn't know about,
including three or four that I was practically standing on before but
didn't realize were associated with the family plot.
I had a location sheet from a previous trip and took a quick meander to
try to find it. I'm not at all certain I did. I did find a marker with
the right last name, but no hint of the person himself. I was looking for
Nicola Caffarella. I found one-inch letters:
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
and way below that, the name CAFFARELLA in four-inch letters.
Mom-in-law has absolutely no idea who these people might be, and her
memory seems awfully good about family details.
My main question is, why would the stone say "Caffarella" without any hint
of any Caffarellas in the grave? Second question: can anyone explain the
format of the Traficante information?
purely a guess
the maiden name of the girls
or their grandmother . .
Hugh W
--
For genealogy and help with family and local history in Bristol and
district http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Brycgstow/
http://snaps4.blogspot.com/ photographs and walks
GENEALOGE http://hughw36.blogspot.com/ MAIN BLOG
-
Alida Spry
Re: Mysterious gravestone
"clifto" <clifto@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:nr9ds4-edq.ln1@remote.clifto.com...
Does the cemetery have any records to indicate who purchased the plot? What
about church records? Anyone else in the family you can ask?
Did you do a search on Rosa Traficante?
Those are just some of the thoughts that I had upon reading your post. As
to the format, I've no idea but maiden name sounds plausible. Good luck!
Alida
news:nr9ds4-edq.ln1@remote.clifto.com...
Brought mom-in-law out to the cemetery where her husband is buried, and
it was enlightening. She showed us a few graves we didn't know about,
including three or four that I was practically standing on before but
didn't realize were associated with the family plot.
I had a location sheet from a previous trip and took a quick meander to
try to find it. I'm not at all certain I did. I did find a marker with
the right last name, but no hint of the person himself. I was looking for
Nicola Caffarella. I found one-inch letters:
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
and way below that, the name CAFFARELLA in four-inch letters.
Mom-in-law has absolutely no idea who these people might be, and her
memory seems awfully good about family details.
My main question is, why would the stone say "Caffarella" without any hint
of any Caffarellas in the grave? Second question: can anyone explain the
format of the Traficante information?
Does the cemetery have any records to indicate who purchased the plot? What
about church records? Anyone else in the family you can ask?
Did you do a search on Rosa Traficante?
Those are just some of the thoughts that I had upon reading your post. As
to the format, I've no idea but maiden name sounds plausible. Good luck!
Alida
--
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
-
The Kat
Re: Mysterious gravestone
On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 11:59:02 -0500, clifto <clifto@gmail.com> wrote:
The Caffarella Valley is in Rome, maybe they're from there?
--
Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk.
This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity...
Remove XYZ to email me
My main question is, why would the stone say "Caffarella" without any hint
of any Caffarellas in the grave?
The Caffarella Valley is in Rome, maybe they're from there?
--
Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk.
This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity...
Remove XYZ to email me
-
Alida Spry
Re: Mysterious gravestone
"clifto" <clifto@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:nr9ds4-edq.ln1@remote.clifto.com...
Hi again,
I googled the three surnames and found this site which apparently shows a
Gennaro FRIELLO and a Rosaria TRAFICANTE and a Guiseppe CAFFARELLA. I don't
know what it means but there it is.
http://www.difesa.it/NR/rdonlyres/D9D84 ... 9742/5.pdf
Perhaps the the gravestone indicates that Rosa Traficante married at age
1921 to Gennaro FRIELLO. I don't know about the other dates. Maybe 1926 is
when she was born and 1998 is when she died? Maybe this is a common Italian
format?
I don't know if that helps or just makes it more confusing. Don't you love
genealogy?
Alida
news:nr9ds4-edq.ln1@remote.clifto.com...
Brought mom-in-law out to the cemetery where her husband is buried, and
it was enlightening. She showed us a few graves we didn't know about,
including three or four that I was practically standing on before but
didn't realize were associated with the family plot.
I had a location sheet from a previous trip and took a quick meander to
try to find it. I'm not at all certain I did. I did find a marker with
the right last name, but no hint of the person himself. I was looking for
Nicola Caffarella. I found one-inch letters:
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
and way below that, the name CAFFARELLA in four-inch letters.
Mom-in-law has absolutely no idea who these people might be, and her
memory seems awfully good about family details.
My main question is, why would the stone say "Caffarella" without any hint
of any Caffarellas in the grave? Second question: can anyone explain the
format of the Traficante information?
--
Hi again,
I googled the three surnames and found this site which apparently shows a
Gennaro FRIELLO and a Rosaria TRAFICANTE and a Guiseppe CAFFARELLA. I don't
know what it means but there it is.
http://www.difesa.it/NR/rdonlyres/D9D84 ... 9742/5.pdf
Perhaps the the gravestone indicates that Rosa Traficante married at age
1921 to Gennaro FRIELLO. I don't know about the other dates. Maybe 1926 is
when she was born and 1998 is when she died? Maybe this is a common Italian
format?
I don't know if that helps or just makes it more confusing. Don't you love
genealogy?
Alida
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
-
Alida Spry
Re: Mysterious gravestone
"Alida Spry" <a_spry@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3XTIi.20$Pc3.19@trndny09...
oops...I meant either at age 21 or in 1921. Sorry
I don't know about the other dates. Maybe 1926 is
news:3XTIi.20$Pc3.19@trndny09...
"clifto" <clifto@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:nr9ds4-edq.ln1@remote.clifto.com...
Brought mom-in-law out to the cemetery where her husband is buried, and
it was enlightening. She showed us a few graves we didn't know about,
including three or four that I was practically standing on before but
didn't realize were associated with the family plot.
I had a location sheet from a previous trip and took a quick meander to
try to find it. I'm not at all certain I did. I did find a marker with
the right last name, but no hint of the person himself. I was looking for
Nicola Caffarella. I found one-inch letters:
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
and way below that, the name CAFFARELLA in four-inch letters.
Mom-in-law has absolutely no idea who these people might be, and her
memory seems awfully good about family details.
My main question is, why would the stone say "Caffarella" without any
hint
of any Caffarellas in the grave? Second question: can anyone explain the
format of the Traficante information?
--
Hi again,
I googled the three surnames and found this site which apparently shows a
Gennaro FRIELLO and a Rosaria TRAFICANTE and a Guiseppe CAFFARELLA. I
don't know what it means but there it is.
http://www.difesa.it/NR/rdonlyres/D9D84 ... 9742/5.pdf
Perhaps the the gravestone indicates that Rosa Traficante married at age
1921 to Gennaro FRIELLO.
oops...I meant either at age 21 or in 1921. Sorry
I don't know about the other dates. Maybe 1926 is
when she was born and 1998 is when she died? Maybe this is a common
Italian format?
I don't know if that helps or just makes it more confusing. Don't you
love genealogy?
Alida
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
-
clifto
Re: Mysterious gravestone
Hugh Watkins wrote:
I could believe that the names are maiden names, but I'm still confused
by the dearth of Caffarellas in the area.
--
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
clifto wrote:
My main question is, why would the stone say "Caffarella" without any hint
of any Caffarellas in the grave?
purely a guess
the maiden name of the girls
or their grandmother . .
I could believe that the names are maiden names, but I'm still confused
by the dearth of Caffarellas in the area.
--
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
-
clifto
Re: Mysterious gravestone
Alida Spry wrote:
Looks like these were all born in the 1980's.
You made me start thinking. Gennaio is the first month of the Italian
year. When I saw the "M." my first thought was all the tombstones in
this area that give a death date as "Morto [date]". So we might well
be looking at
Morto 21 Gennaio 1926 Anni 98
Died 21 January 1926 98 Years (of age)
No luck for Illinois Traficante families in the census on HQ. Suspect
neither of the kids will show up in the census, just a hunch.
Found
one Friello family in Illinois in 1920, no indication that they have
kids, and no indication that they ever did.
Sometimes I think that's half the fun. Other times I realize how insane
I am to have such thoughts.
--
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
"clifto" <clifto@gmail.com> wrote...
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
I googled the three surnames and found this site which apparently shows a
Gennaro FRIELLO and a Rosaria TRAFICANTE and a Guiseppe CAFFARELLA. I don't
know what it means but there it is.
http://www.difesa.it/NR/rdonlyres/D9D84 ... 9742/5.pdf
Looks like these were all born in the 1980's.
Perhaps the the gravestone indicates that Rosa Traficante married at age
1921 to Gennaro FRIELLO. I don't know about the other dates. Maybe 1926 is
when she was born and 1998 is when she died? Maybe this is a common Italian
format?
You made me start thinking. Gennaio is the first month of the Italian
year. When I saw the "M." my first thought was all the tombstones in
this area that give a death date as "Morto [date]". So we might well
be looking at
Morto 21 Gennaio 1926 Anni 98
Died 21 January 1926 98 Years (of age)
No luck for Illinois Traficante families in the census on HQ. Suspect
neither of the kids will show up in the census, just a hunch.
one Friello family in Illinois in 1920, no indication that they have
kids, and no indication that they ever did.
I don't know if that helps or just makes it more confusing. Don't you love
genealogy?
Sometimes I think that's half the fun. Other times I realize how insane
I am to have such thoughts.
--
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
-
Alida Spry
Re: Mysterious gravestone
"clifto" <clifto@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:jbhds4-a3r.ln1@remote.clifto.com...
OK, well it seems I did help a little. I even learned something too! I
don't know much about Italian research so I'll have to remember this for
future reference.
Have a great weekend!
Alida
news:jbhds4-a3r.ln1@remote.clifto.com...
Alida Spry wrote:
"clifto" <clifto@gmail.com> wrote...
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
I googled the three surnames and found this site which apparently shows a
Gennaro FRIELLO and a Rosaria TRAFICANTE and a Guiseppe CAFFARELLA. I
don't
know what it means but there it is.
http://www.difesa.it/NR/rdonlyres/D9D84 ... 9742/5.pdf
Looks like these were all born in the 1980's.
Perhaps the the gravestone indicates that Rosa Traficante married at age
1921 to Gennaro FRIELLO. I don't know about the other dates. Maybe 1926
is
when she was born and 1998 is when she died? Maybe this is a common
Italian
format?
You made me start thinking. Gennaio is the first month of the Italian
year. When I saw the "M." my first thought was all the tombstones in
this area that give a death date as "Morto [date]". So we might well
be looking at
Morto 21 Gennaio 1926 Anni 98
Died 21 January 1926 98 Years (of age)
No luck for Illinois Traficante families in the census on HQ. Suspect
neither of the kids will show up in the census, just a hunch.Found
one Friello family in Illinois in 1920, no indication that they have
kids, and no indication that they ever did.
I don't know if that helps or just makes it more confusing. Don't you
love
genealogy?
Sometimes I think that's half the fun. Other times I realize how insane
I am to have such thoughts.
--
OK, well it seems I did help a little. I even learned something too! I
don't know much about Italian research so I'll have to remember this for
future reference.
Have a great weekend!
Alida
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
-
clifto
Re: Mysterious gravestone
singhals wrote:
I had just guessed that and am glad to see your corroborating info.
Not necessarily. Steven Seagal played a character named Nicola in one of
his movies IIRC.
Found a death notice for Nicola. "Nicola Caffarella, beloved husband of
Madeline, dear father of Theresa [Peter] Casso, Frank [Connie], Rose
[Roy] Friello, and Pauline. Funeral Thursday, 9 a.m., from funeral
home, 3722 W. Chicago avenue, to Our Lady of Angels church. Interment
Mount Carmel cemetery." Mount Carmel was the one I was at, so this is
most likely the Nicola I had the location sheet for.
I also see more than a few links between Friello and Caffarella. But it
appears this is a different Caffarella family, which allows me to relax
and concentrate my efforts elsewhere.
Testing the Chicago Tribune archives by looking up Capone, it appears
they only go back to 1928, so I'd have to find someone who archives the
paper on fiche. And I'll probably look this up if I end up at some such
place, but for now it's relegated to a curiosity while I scrounge for
orts and tidbits about the real family.
--
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
clifto wrote:
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
m. 21 Genn. 1926 anni 98 =
died 21 (Jan?) 1926 aged 98. (m. - morte/dead)
I had just guessed that and am glad to see your corroborating info.
The Friello children are _probably_ the children of Rosa's
daughter who married a Friello.
At a guess Caffarella is Rosa's surname; her maiden name was
probably Rosa Traficante. But isn't Nicola female?
Not necessarily. Steven Seagal played a character named Nicola in one of
his movies IIRC.
Found a death notice for Nicola. "Nicola Caffarella, beloved husband of
Madeline, dear father of Theresa [Peter] Casso, Frank [Connie], Rose
[Roy] Friello, and Pauline. Funeral Thursday, 9 a.m., from funeral
home, 3722 W. Chicago avenue, to Our Lady of Angels church. Interment
Mount Carmel cemetery." Mount Carmel was the one I was at, so this is
most likely the Nicola I had the location sheet for.
I also see more than a few links between Friello and Caffarella. But it
appears this is a different Caffarella family, which allows me to relax
and concentrate my efforts elsewhere.
The best way to confirm/refute the maiden name scenario is
to read the local newspapers for (Jan?) 1926 to see who
died. Or check the churhc's burial books (NOT the cemetery
book, the book in which the Priest records the burial
services he performs).
Testing the Chicago Tribune archives by looking up Capone, it appears
they only go back to 1928, so I'd have to find someone who archives the
paper on fiche. And I'll probably look this up if I end up at some such
place, but for now it's relegated to a curiosity while I scrounge for
orts and tidbits about the real family.
--
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
-
Gjest
Re: Mysterious gravestone
clifto wrote:
Several thoughts on your quest:
(1) Maybe the gravestone has that name because somebody bought it at a
discount, when someone backed out of their purchase??? Such a deal !
(2) The Archdiocese of Chicago has several "super" sites that can access the
WHOLE list of burial records, no matter in which cemetery the people are
buried. Right now, the only one that comes to mind is Resurrection cemetery.
Once you have burial dates, you can dig into the newspapers for death
notices.
(3) If you have a Chicago Public Library card, you can access their website,
and log in to the newspaper (and other stuff, including Heritage Quest).
There the Tribune runs from 1849 to 1986 and is searchable by word. The
other button, for 1985 to present is only searchable by general terms (i.e.
"death notices" or "obituaries") Of course, if you don't have a CPL card,
you can still go downtown to the Washington library, and view the papers on
microfilm -- though you can't search.
Good luck,
bob
singhals wrote:
clifto wrote:
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
m. 21 Genn. 1926 anni 98 =
died 21 (Jan?) 1926 aged 98. (m. - morte/dead)
I had just guessed that and am glad to see your corroborating info.
The Friello children are _probably_ the children of Rosa's
daughter who married a Friello.
At a guess Caffarella is Rosa's surname; her maiden name was
probably Rosa Traficante. But isn't Nicola female?
Not necessarily. Steven Seagal played a character named Nicola in one of
his movies IIRC.
Found a death notice for Nicola. "Nicola Caffarella, beloved husband of
Madeline, dear father of Theresa [Peter] Casso, Frank [Connie], Rose
[Roy] Friello, and Pauline. Funeral Thursday, 9 a.m., from funeral
home, 3722 W. Chicago avenue, to Our Lady of Angels church. Interment
Mount Carmel cemetery." Mount Carmel was the one I was at, so this is
most likely the Nicola I had the location sheet for.
I also see more than a few links between Friello and Caffarella. But it
appears this is a different Caffarella family, which allows me to relax
and concentrate my efforts elsewhere.
The best way to confirm/refute the maiden name scenario is
to read the local newspapers for (Jan?) 1926 to see who
died. Or check the churhc's burial books (NOT the cemetery
book, the book in which the Priest records the burial
services he performs).
Testing the Chicago Tribune archives by looking up Capone, it appears
they only go back to 1928, so I'd have to find someone who archives the
paper on fiche. And I'll probably look this up if I end up at some such
place, but for now it's relegated to a curiosity while I scrounge for
orts and tidbits about the real family.
Several thoughts on your quest:
(1) Maybe the gravestone has that name because somebody bought it at a
discount, when someone backed out of their purchase??? Such a deal !
(2) The Archdiocese of Chicago has several "super" sites that can access the
WHOLE list of burial records, no matter in which cemetery the people are
buried. Right now, the only one that comes to mind is Resurrection cemetery.
Once you have burial dates, you can dig into the newspapers for death
notices.
(3) If you have a Chicago Public Library card, you can access their website,
and log in to the newspaper (and other stuff, including Heritage Quest).
There the Tribune runs from 1849 to 1986 and is searchable by word. The
other button, for 1985 to present is only searchable by general terms (i.e.
"death notices" or "obituaries") Of course, if you don't have a CPL card,
you can still go downtown to the Washington library, and view the papers on
microfilm -- though you can't search.
Good luck,
bob
-
Jobayless@yahoo.com
Re: Mysterious gravestone
On Sep 21, 11:59 am, clifto <cli...@gmail.com> wrote:
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
and way below that, the name CAFFARELLA in four-inch letters.
JB found this
I found that Rosa Caffarella was her maiden name she married a
Friello. Maybe she Ialso married a Trafiocante.
Chicago Tribune, Obituary Index, 1988-1997
Name: Friello, Rose A.
Maiden Name: Caffarella, Rose A.
Date: 26-Nov-96
Source Information:
John Stoddard, comp.. Chicago Tribune, Obituary Index, 1988-1997
[database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: The Generations Network, Inc.,
2001. Original data: Chicago Tribune. Chicago, IL, USA: Chicago
Tribune, 1988-1997.
Brought mom-in-law out to the cemetery where her husband is buried, and
it was enlightening. She showed us a few graves we didn't know about,
including three or four that I was practically standing on before but
didn't realize were associated with the family plot.
I had a location sheet from a previous trip and took a quick meander to
try to find it. I'm not at all certain I did. I did find a marker with
the right last name, but no hint of the person himself. I was looking for
Nicola Caffarella. I found one-inch letters:
ROSA TRAFICANTE
M. 21 GENN. 1926 ANNI 98
LEROY ROBERT FRIELLO
SEPT. 14, 1927 - MAR. 28, 1928
PAULINE JOY FRIELLO
APR. 8, 1929 - DEC. 13, 1929
and way below that, the name CAFFARELLA in four-inch letters.
JB found this
I found that Rosa Caffarella was her maiden name she married a
Friello. Maybe she Ialso married a Trafiocante.
Chicago Tribune, Obituary Index, 1988-1997
Name: Friello, Rose A.
Maiden Name: Caffarella, Rose A.
Date: 26-Nov-96
Source Information:
John Stoddard, comp.. Chicago Tribune, Obituary Index, 1988-1997
[database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: The Generations Network, Inc.,
2001. Original data: Chicago Tribune. Chicago, IL, USA: Chicago
Tribune, 1988-1997.