WW-II enlistments
Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper
-
singhals
WW-II enlistments
OK, I took advantage of Ancestry's offer (g), and now I've
got a question.
Several of the names I pulled up enlisted in 1942 in HAWAII!
Since I KNOW beyond argument that these guys were born,
raised, married, and buried in WV, what's up with that?
At first I thought the Hawaii one was a 2nd enlistment, but
I didn't find a 1st enlistment to go with it.
I don't see any way to check if they were drafted and then
re-upped, which might explain it, but then again, I thought
the WW-II draft was for the "duration".
Anyone have a clue?
Cheryl
got a question.
Several of the names I pulled up enlisted in 1942 in HAWAII!
Since I KNOW beyond argument that these guys were born,
raised, married, and buried in WV, what's up with that?
At first I thought the Hawaii one was a 2nd enlistment, but
I didn't find a 1st enlistment to go with it.
I don't see any way to check if they were drafted and then
re-upped, which might explain it, but then again, I thought
the WW-II draft was for the "duration".
Anyone have a clue?
Cheryl
-
Huntersglenn
Re: WW-II enlistments
I did a look-up for my father and uncles, and noticed that for the
aircraft carrier musters for WWII, when you first search for the name
and get the listing of results, the column is titled 'enlistment date' -
but when you look at the actual image, the date is the date that the
sailor came aboard the ship. They have my father listed 8 separate
times. There IS a column on the original for date of enlistment, but
the date that ancestry is recording is the other date. Now why the Navy
decided that the same sailor would 'first come aboard' more than once is
beyond me (unless maybe they did that at each 'major' port?).
I did notice that I had couldn't search their names directly, but had to
do a search on just the last name to find them.
Hope that helps,
Cathy
singhals wrote:
aircraft carrier musters for WWII, when you first search for the name
and get the listing of results, the column is titled 'enlistment date' -
but when you look at the actual image, the date is the date that the
sailor came aboard the ship. They have my father listed 8 separate
times. There IS a column on the original for date of enlistment, but
the date that ancestry is recording is the other date. Now why the Navy
decided that the same sailor would 'first come aboard' more than once is
beyond me (unless maybe they did that at each 'major' port?).
I did notice that I had couldn't search their names directly, but had to
do a search on just the last name to find them.
Hope that helps,
Cathy
singhals wrote:
OK, I took advantage of Ancestry's offer (g), and now I've got a question.
Several of the names I pulled up enlisted in 1942 in HAWAII! Since I
KNOW beyond argument that these guys were born, raised, married, and
buried in WV, what's up with that?
At first I thought the Hawaii one was a 2nd enlistment, but I didn't
find a 1st enlistment to go with it.
I don't see any way to check if they were drafted and then re-upped,
which might explain it, but then again, I thought the WW-II draft was
for the "duration".
Anyone have a clue?
Cheryl
-
T.M. Sommers
Re: WW-II enlistments
singhals wrote:
Hard to say without seeing the actual record.
Also, the WWII Army Enlistment records are available on the
National Archives website, too.
--
Thomas M. Sommers -- tms@nj.net -- AB2SB
OK, I took advantage of Ancestry's offer (g), and now I've got a question.
Several of the names I pulled up enlisted in 1942 in HAWAII! Since I
KNOW beyond argument that these guys were born, raised, married, and
buried in WV, what's up with that?
At first I thought the Hawaii one was a 2nd enlistment, but I didn't
find a 1st enlistment to go with it.
I don't see any way to check if they were drafted and then re-upped,
which might explain it, but then again, I thought the WW-II draft was
for the "duration".
Anyone have a clue?
Hard to say without seeing the actual record.
Also, the WWII Army Enlistment records are available on the
National Archives website, too.
--
Thomas M. Sommers -- tms@nj.net -- AB2SB
-
T.M. Sommers
Re: WW-II enlistments
Huntersglenn wrote:
Was he ship's company, or with the air group?
--
Thomas M. Sommers -- tms@nj.net -- AB2SB
I did a look-up for my father and uncles, and noticed that for the
aircraft carrier musters for WWII, when you first search for the name
and get the listing of results, the column is titled 'enlistment date' -
but when you look at the actual image, the date is the date that the
sailor came aboard the ship. They have my father listed 8 separate
times. There IS a column on the original for date of enlistment, but
the date that ancestry is recording is the other date. Now why the Navy
decided that the same sailor would 'first come aboard' more than once is
beyond me (unless maybe they did that at each 'major' port?).
Was he ship's company, or with the air group?
--
Thomas M. Sommers -- tms@nj.net -- AB2SB
-
Jim Elbrecht
Re: WW-II enlistments
"T.M. Sommers" <tms@nj.net> wrote:
-snip-
Thanks for that heads up. I wish Ancestry had a link to it in
their 'about this database' - but here's a good FAQ on how the file
came to be-
ftp://216.54.96.55/aad_docs/rg64_army_serial_faq.pdf
[and how incomplete it is- but why NARA digitized it anyway]
I had mentioned that the height and weight of the 2 soldiers I found
on ancestry made no sense. From the NARA FAQ;
Nara> Why are the enlistee’s height, weight, and military occupational
Nara> specialty not included in the records accessible through AAD?
Nara> Some Enlistment cards include fields for Height and Weight, but
Nara> instructions for their use or disuse changed during the war.
Nara> Some versions of the Enlistment cards and instructions indicate
Nara> that the same fields (columns 74-78) were used for Military
Nara> Occupational Specialty or for other purposes. None of the
Nara> instructions clearly indicate when, if ever, data for Height
Nara> and Weight or Military Occupational Specialty were punched into
Nara> the Enlistment cards. For this reason, the data recorded in
Nara> these fields are not displayed in the records in AAD. The raw
Nara> data electronic records that NARA preserves retain whatever
Nara> values were punched in these fields.
Makes a good case for when Ancestry says "database online" - that it
is probably wise to go to where it is online and use a 'one step
closer to original record'.
Thanks again for the heads-up.
Jim
-snip-
Also, the WWII Army Enlistment records are available on the
National Archives website, too.
Thanks for that heads up. I wish Ancestry had a link to it in
their 'about this database' - but here's a good FAQ on how the file
came to be-
ftp://216.54.96.55/aad_docs/rg64_army_serial_faq.pdf
[and how incomplete it is- but why NARA digitized it anyway]
I had mentioned that the height and weight of the 2 soldiers I found
on ancestry made no sense. From the NARA FAQ;
Nara> Why are the enlistee’s height, weight, and military occupational
Nara> specialty not included in the records accessible through AAD?
Nara> Some Enlistment cards include fields for Height and Weight, but
Nara> instructions for their use or disuse changed during the war.
Nara> Some versions of the Enlistment cards and instructions indicate
Nara> that the same fields (columns 74-78) were used for Military
Nara> Occupational Specialty or for other purposes. None of the
Nara> instructions clearly indicate when, if ever, data for Height
Nara> and Weight or Military Occupational Specialty were punched into
Nara> the Enlistment cards. For this reason, the data recorded in
Nara> these fields are not displayed in the records in AAD. The raw
Nara> data electronic records that NARA preserves retain whatever
Nara> values were punched in these fields.
Makes a good case for when Ancestry says "database online" - that it
is probably wise to go to where it is online and use a 'one step
closer to original record'.
Thanks again for the heads-up.
Jim
-
Huntersglenn
Re: WW-II enlistments
T.M. Sommers wrote:
pick up crew at various ports, and he specifically mentioned their ship
picking up at least 5 sailors in San Francisco because they had some men
jump ship either in port or in the port they'd been at prior to that
one. So maybe they did a new 'date sailor came aboard ship' each time
because of how often men deserted and needed to be replaced?
Cathy
Huntersglenn wrote:
I did a look-up for my father and uncles, and noticed that for the
aircraft carrier musters for WWII, when you first search for the name
and get the listing of results, the column is titled 'enlistment date'
- but when you look at the actual image, the date is the date that the
sailor came aboard the ship. They have my father listed 8 separate
times. There IS a column on the original for date of enlistment, but
the date that ancestry is recording is the other date. Now why the
Navy decided that the same sailor would 'first come aboard' more than
once is beyond me (unless maybe they did that at each 'major' port?).
Was he ship's company, or with the air group?
Ship's company. I do remember Daddy saying that they would lose and
pick up crew at various ports, and he specifically mentioned their ship
picking up at least 5 sailors in San Francisco because they had some men
jump ship either in port or in the port they'd been at prior to that
one. So maybe they did a new 'date sailor came aboard ship' each time
because of how often men deserted and needed to be replaced?
Cathy
-
singhals
Re: WW-II enlistments
Sorry, guys, I know it's bad manners to ask a question then
vanish.
Anyway ... part of the mystery has been solved, since
sitting by the phone waiting for it to ring gave me time to
READ the printouts --
Harlan E Harmison Jr -- Nativity WV -- Enlisted VA Term of
Enlistment: Enlistment for Hawaiian Department; Source
Enlisted Man, Regular Army, after 3 months of Discharge It
says he was in the Infantry.
Marvin V Sirbaugh -- Nativity WV; enlisted VA; Term:
Enlistment for Hawaiian Department; Source Enlisted Man,
Philippine Scout or recall to AD of an enlisted man who had
been transferred to the ERC It says he was an MP.
So, I'm gonna figure I can ignore Hawaii.
Cheryl
Huntersglenn wrote:
vanish.
Anyway ... part of the mystery has been solved, since
sitting by the phone waiting for it to ring gave me time to
READ the printouts --
Harlan E Harmison Jr -- Nativity WV -- Enlisted VA Term of
Enlistment: Enlistment for Hawaiian Department; Source
Enlisted Man, Regular Army, after 3 months of Discharge It
says he was in the Infantry.
Marvin V Sirbaugh -- Nativity WV; enlisted VA; Term:
Enlistment for Hawaiian Department; Source Enlisted Man,
Philippine Scout or recall to AD of an enlisted man who had
been transferred to the ERC It says he was an MP.
So, I'm gonna figure I can ignore Hawaii.
Cheryl
Huntersglenn wrote:
I did a look-up for my father and uncles, and noticed that for the
aircraft carrier musters for WWII, when you first search for the name
and get the listing of results, the column is titled 'enlistment date' -
but when you look at the actual image, the date is the date that the
sailor came aboard the ship. They have my father listed 8 separate
times. There IS a column on the original for date of enlistment, but
the date that ancestry is recording is the other date. Now why the Navy
decided that the same sailor would 'first come aboard' more than once is
beyond me (unless maybe they did that at each 'major' port?).
I did notice that I had couldn't search their names directly, but had to
do a search on just the last name to find them.
Hope that helps,
Cathy
singhals wrote:
OK, I took advantage of Ancestry's offer (g), and now I've got a
question.
Several of the names I pulled up enlisted in 1942 in HAWAII! Since I
KNOW beyond argument that these guys were born, raised, married, and
buried in WV, what's up with that?
At first I thought the Hawaii one was a 2nd enlistment, but I didn't
find a 1st enlistment to go with it.
I don't see any way to check if they were drafted and then re-upped,
which might explain it, but then again, I thought the WW-II draft was
for the "duration".
Anyone have a clue?
Cheryl
-
Michael R. James
Re: WW-II enlistments
T.M. Sommers <tms@nj.net> wrote:
I see that in my family too. If you look at the information that comes
with the records of WWII Enlistments on Ancestry.com, you will
see an explanation.
Apparently, when the records were scanned, there were a great
many errors, either in the scanning process or because of
damage to the original punch cards. The National Archives have chosen
not to try and fix them up and guess what the originals should say.
This article gives a lengthy explanation:
http://www.archives.gov/publications/pr ... d-ww2.html
mike
--
mrjames@swcp.com http://www.swcp.com/~mrjames/
"When you can measure what you are speaking about and express it
in numbers you know something about it; but when you cannot express
it in numbers your knowledge is a meagre and unsatisfactory kind"
- Lord Kelvin
singhals wrote:
OK, I took advantage of Ancestry's offer (g), and now I've got a question.
Several of the names I pulled up enlisted in 1942 in HAWAII! Since I
KNOW beyond argument that these guys were born, raised, married, and
buried in WV, what's up with that?
I see that in my family too. If you look at the information that comes
with the records of WWII Enlistments on Ancestry.com, you will
see an explanation.
Apparently, when the records were scanned, there were a great
many errors, either in the scanning process or because of
damage to the original punch cards. The National Archives have chosen
not to try and fix them up and guess what the originals should say.
This article gives a lengthy explanation:
http://www.archives.gov/publications/pr ... d-ww2.html
mike
--
mrjames@swcp.com http://www.swcp.com/~mrjames/
"When you can measure what you are speaking about and express it
in numbers you know something about it; but when you cannot express
it in numbers your knowledge is a meagre and unsatisfactory kind"
- Lord Kelvin
-
Otis Willie PIO The Ameri
Re: WW-II enlistments
In response to your inquiry, and to assist others seeking similar information:
Hawaiian enlistments were a special category of individuals who agreed to serve for the duration of the war, plus additional months if needed in the Island chain (but not all made it to Hawaii.) This category was generally directed toward qualified Caucasian draftees whose service periods were limited to two years. In other words, a fixed non-combat assignment in exhange for an indefinite enlistment period. This short-lived program was, obviously, intended to quickly displace military-eligible Hawaiian (Japanese) enlistees who were not affected by the infamous ExecOrder 9066. The majority (99.4%) of Japanese/Hawaiian Army personnel who were removed from the Islands later served in Europe where their two largest units (100th and 442nd RCT) acquired the largest number of combat awards for Valor in American history.
-- Otis Willie (Ret.)
Military News and Information Editor (http://www.13105320634.com)
The American War Library, Est. 1988 (http://www.amervets.com)
16907 Brighton Avenue
Gardena CA 90247
1-310-532-0634
Military Webmaster Site Link Request Form:
http://www.amervets.com/linkreq.htm
Military and Vet Info-Exchange/Discussion Groups
http://members.aol.com/warlibrary/share.htm
OK, I took advantage of Ancestry's offer (g), and now I've
got a question.
Several of the names I pulled up enlisted in 1942 in HAWAII!
Since I KNOW beyond argument that these guys were born,
raised, married, and buried in WV, what's up with that?
At first I thought the Hawaii one was a 2nd enlistment, but
I didn't find a 1st enlistment to go with it.
I don't see any way to check if they were drafted and then
re-upped, which might explain it, but then again, I thought
the WW-II draft was for the "duration".
Anyone have a clue?
Cheryl
Hawaiian enlistments were a special category of individuals who agreed to serve for the duration of the war, plus additional months if needed in the Island chain (but not all made it to Hawaii.) This category was generally directed toward qualified Caucasian draftees whose service periods were limited to two years. In other words, a fixed non-combat assignment in exhange for an indefinite enlistment period. This short-lived program was, obviously, intended to quickly displace military-eligible Hawaiian (Japanese) enlistees who were not affected by the infamous ExecOrder 9066. The majority (99.4%) of Japanese/Hawaiian Army personnel who were removed from the Islands later served in Europe where their two largest units (100th and 442nd RCT) acquired the largest number of combat awards for Valor in American history.
-- Otis Willie (Ret.)
Military News and Information Editor (http://www.13105320634.com)
The American War Library, Est. 1988 (http://www.amervets.com)
16907 Brighton Avenue
Gardena CA 90247
1-310-532-0634
Military Webmaster Site Link Request Form:
http://www.amervets.com/linkreq.htm
Military and Vet Info-Exchange/Discussion Groups
http://members.aol.com/warlibrary/share.htm
-
singhals
Re: WW-II enlistments
Otis Willie PIO The American War Library wrote:
Thanks.
Cheryl
In response to your inquiry, and to assist others seeking similar information:
OK, I took advantage of Ancestry's offer (g), and now I've
got a question.
Several of the names I pulled up enlisted in 1942 in HAWAII!
Since I KNOW beyond argument that these guys were born,
raised, married, and buried in WV, what's up with that?
At first I thought the Hawaii one was a 2nd enlistment, but
I didn't find a 1st enlistment to go with it.
I don't see any way to check if they were drafted and then
re-upped, which might explain it, but then again, I thought
the WW-II draft was for the "duration".
Anyone have a clue?
Cheryl
Hawaiian enlistments were a special category of individuals who agreed to serve for the duration of the war, plus additional months if needed in the Island chain (but not all made it to Hawaii.) This category was generally directed toward qualified Caucasian draftees whose service periods were limited to two years. In other words, a fixed non-combat assignment in exhange for an indefinite enlistment period. This short-lived program was, obviously, intended to quickly displace military-eligible Hawaiian (Japanese) enlistees who were not affected by the infamous ExecOrder 9066. The majority (99.4%) of Japanese/Hawaiian Army personnel who were removed from the Islands later served in Europe where their two largest units (100th and 442nd RCT) acquired the largest number of combat awards for Valor in American history.
Thanks.
Cheryl