need software to include to all spouses and all children in

Moderator: MOD_nyhetsgrupper

Svar
Dora Smith

need software to include to all spouses and all children in

Legg inn av Dora Smith » 03 okt 2006 02:32:22

I am currently using PAF, PAF Companion, and Roots Magic. As far as I can
learn, none of these programs does one very obvious thing that I need it to.
Most genealogical software won't do something else as basic.

Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of book,
web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all the spouses
and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in God's name the makers
of these programs think we wouldn't need that - takes half a brain in my
opinion.

I am dealing with French Canadian families, and most of thsoe ancestors
married more than once, and had large, close knit families. Not, a couple
of them, but two thirds of 3500 of them. I do NOT want to list only spouse
and the children of the spouse who is the direct ancestor! Why in Chr___
anyone would think I would want to do that. Why do genealogy programs
even accept multiple spouses and their children if you aren't supposed to
want to list them on reports?!!!

No, I do not want to prepare a mess of umpteen disorganized descendant
reports. (Roots Magic people thought they could talk me into doing
something else totally different that makes no sense.) I want a single
ancestor report . With all spouses and all their children for each
ancestor.

The program also needs to be able to import irregular dates and dual dates,
which PAF Companion and Roots Magic can do, but most programs, including
Family Tree Maker, cannot. In 12 or more versions the makers of FTM just
don't get it. I ahve a large database, 14,800 people, and anway, if I did
not ENTER the exact date, it is because I do not HAVE teh exact date!
Don't anybody do like the FTM customer service person and tell me to enter
my data over again! (Probably explains FTM's shortcomings - they don't
listen and never heard a word you just said to them.)

I need to create descendant reports in narrative formats and a web site with
all the individual pages linked to a central chart or index.

What genealogical software meets my criteria?

--
Yours,
Dora Smith
Austin, TX
tiggernut24@yahoo.com

the_verminator@comcast.ne

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av the_verminator@comcast.ne » 03 okt 2006 02:41:32

Dora Smith wrote:
I am currently using PAF, PAF Companion, and Roots Magic. As far as I can
learn, none of these programs does one very obvious thing that I need it to.
Most genealogical software won't do something else as basic.

Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of book,
web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all the spouses
and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in God's name the makers
of these programs think we wouldn't need that - takes half a brain in my
opinion.

I am dealing with French Canadian families, and most of thsoe ancestors
married more than once, and had large, close knit families. Not, a couple
of them, but two thirds of 3500 of them. I do NOT want to list only spouse
and the children of the spouse who is the direct ancestor! Why in Chr___
anyone would think I would want to do that. Why do genealogy programs
even accept multiple spouses and their children if you aren't supposed to
want to list them on reports?!!!

No, I do not want to prepare a mess of umpteen disorganized descendant
reports. (Roots Magic people thought they could talk me into doing
something else totally different that makes no sense.) I want a single
ancestor report . With all spouses and all their children for each
ancestor.

The program also needs to be able to import irregular dates and dual dates,
which PAF Companion and Roots Magic can do, but most programs, including
Family Tree Maker, cannot. In 12 or more versions the makers of FTM just
don't get it. I ahve a large database, 14,800 people, and anway, if I did
not ENTER the exact date, it is because I do not HAVE teh exact date!
Don't anybody do like the FTM customer service person and tell me to enter
my data over again! (Probably explains FTM's shortcomings - they don't
listen and never heard a word you just said to them.)

I need to create descendant reports in narrative formats and a web site with
all the individual pages linked to a central chart or index.

What genealogical software meets my criteria?

--
Yours,
Dora Smith
Austin, TX
tiggernut24@yahoo.com


You should check out TMG (The Master Genealogist) and SecondSite. When
used together I'm pretty sure you'll find they can give you exactly
what you are looking for.

--
The Verminator

the_verminator@comcast.ne

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av the_verminator@comcast.ne » 03 okt 2006 06:27:29

Dora Smith wrote:
Verminator:

I downloaded and installed the trail version

I've got it handling hte irregular dates, and printing all the spouses, but
how do you get it to print all the children? For my mother in law's
grandfather it lists both spouses but the children of only one spouse.

--

Dora- it depends on who is the focus person of the report and what
report you are running.

The TMG forum would be the best place to ask.

http://www.whollygenes.com/forums201/index.php

--
The Verminator

Liz_in_Calgary

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Liz_in_Calgary » 03 okt 2006 11:06:25

Perhaps what you want is a descendant report, but that won't
give you the parents of parents of the lines that married
into the line.

What I would like is a program that would create a report of
all the families - just basic stuff, name, dates of birth
death and marraige, with all the siblings - more of a
graphical tree than a report - I tried to make my own, in
a spreadsheet, it truly is a programming nightmare, grandpa
is on one sheet and grandma is way over on the other side -
It may be something that is finished before I leave this
world.

take care
Liz



On Tue, 03 Oct 2006 01:32:22 GMT, in alt.genealogy "Dora
Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com> wrote :

Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of book,
web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all the spouses
and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in God's name the makers
of these programs think we wouldn't need that - takes half a brain in my
opinion.

Dave

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Dave » 03 okt 2006 19:55:10

There once was a program that ran under DOS that did what I think you want.
It's name was PAFAbility and is still available. I Googled it and a good
link came up. It worked directly with the PAF2.3 (?) files. You would put in
the base person's RIN number, the program would go out and find the endline
grandparents, put them in proper order, and then print out all descendants
for each line. You could print out directly or it would generate a
WordPerfect 5.1 document including indexes. A great little program. If I
remember correctly, you could limit how many generations back from the base
person you wanted to go. I'm not sure if a grandmother remarried if the
subsequent marriages were traced but I seem to remember that they did. It
would also cross-reference duplicate lines if any and only print them once.

This program might help finding a newer version of it. Good luck.

Dave

"Dora Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com> wrote in message
news:G4jUg.25099$DU3.2947@tornado.texas.rr.com...
I am currently using PAF, PAF Companion, and Roots Magic. As far as I
can
learn, none of these programs does one very obvious thing that I need it
to.
Most genealogical software won't do something else as basic.

Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of book,
web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all the spouses
and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in God's name the
makers
of these programs think we wouldn't need that - takes half a brain in my
opinion.

I am dealing with French Canadian families, and most of thsoe ancestors
married more than once, and had large, close knit families. Not, a
couple
of them, but two thirds of 3500 of them. I do NOT want to list only
spouse
and the children of the spouse who is the direct ancestor! Why in Chr___
anyone would think I would want to do that. Why do genealogy programs
even accept multiple spouses and their children if you aren't supposed to
want to list them on reports?!!!

No, I do not want to prepare a mess of umpteen disorganized descendant
reports. (Roots Magic people thought they could talk me into doing
something else totally different that makes no sense.) I want a single
ancestor report . With all spouses and all their children for each
ancestor.

The program also needs to be able to import irregular dates and dual
dates,
which PAF Companion and Roots Magic can do, but most programs, including
Family Tree Maker, cannot. In 12 or more versions the makers of FTM just
don't get it. I ahve a large database, 14,800 people, and anway, if I
did
not ENTER the exact date, it is because I do not HAVE teh exact date!
Don't anybody do like the FTM customer service person and tell me to enter
my data over again! (Probably explains FTM's shortcomings - they don't
listen and never heard a word you just said to them.)

I need to create descendant reports in narrative formats and a web site
with
all the individual pages linked to a central chart or index.

What genealogical software meets my criteria?

--
Yours,
Dora Smith
Austin, TX
tiggernut24@yahoo.com


dave

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av dave » 03 okt 2006 20:23:10

Having lurked on this thread for the last few days, I'm not 100% sure what
form of report you want but I do get the impression that you wish to
'report' on 'everyone'.

To that end, I'll suggest Legacy as follows-the report info is in the form
of tables:

Reports->Family[Family Group Records]
Record Selection: select "All families in the entire family file"
Report Options: select what you want.

Alternatively

Reports->Individuals[Individual report]
Record Selection: select "All families in the entire family file"
Report Options: select what you want.

The negative aspect of both of these reports is the order of the reports. It
almost seems to be random, but it's all there, and with a little effort can
be ordered into a generational structure.

another Dave

"Dave" <dave.scheipers@nospamatt.net> wrote in message
news:imyUg.182670$QM6.1809@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
There once was a program that ran under DOS that did what I think you
want.
It's name was PAFAbility and is still available. I Googled it and a good
link came up. It worked directly with the PAF2.3 (?) files. You would put
in
the base person's RIN number, the program would go out and find the
endline
grandparents, put them in proper order, and then print out all descendants
for each line. You could print out directly or it would generate a
WordPerfect 5.1 document including indexes. A great little program. If I
remember correctly, you could limit how many generations back from the
base
person you wanted to go. I'm not sure if a grandmother remarried if the
subsequent marriages were traced but I seem to remember that they did. It
would also cross-reference duplicate lines if any and only print them
once.

This program might help finding a newer version of it. Good luck.

Dave

"Dora Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com> wrote in message
news:G4jUg.25099$DU3.2947@tornado.texas.rr.com...
I am currently using PAF, PAF Companion, and Roots Magic. As far as I
can
learn, none of these programs does one very obvious thing that I need it
to.
Most genealogical software won't do something else as basic.

Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of
book,
web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all the
spouses
and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in God's name the
makers
of these programs think we wouldn't need that - takes half a brain in my
opinion.

I am dealing with French Canadian families, and most of thsoe ancestors
married more than once, and had large, close knit families. Not, a
couple
of them, but two thirds of 3500 of them. I do NOT want to list only
spouse
and the children of the spouse who is the direct ancestor! Why in Chr___
anyone would think I would want to do that. Why do genealogy programs
even accept multiple spouses and their children if you aren't supposed to
want to list them on reports?!!!

No, I do not want to prepare a mess of umpteen disorganized descendant
reports. (Roots Magic people thought they could talk me into doing
something else totally different that makes no sense.) I want a single
ancestor report . With all spouses and all their children for each
ancestor.

The program also needs to be able to import irregular dates and dual
dates,
which PAF Companion and Roots Magic can do, but most programs, including
Family Tree Maker, cannot. In 12 or more versions the makers of FTM
just
don't get it. I ahve a large database, 14,800 people, and anway, if I
did
not ENTER the exact date, it is because I do not HAVE teh exact date!
Don't anybody do like the FTM customer service person and tell me to
enter
my data over again! (Probably explains FTM's shortcomings - they don't
listen and never heard a word you just said to them.)

I need to create descendant reports in narrative formats and a web site
with
all the individual pages linked to a central chart or index.

What genealogical software meets my criteria?

--
Yours,
Dora Smith
Austin, TX
tiggernut24@yahoo.com




J. Hugh Sullivan

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av J. Hugh Sullivan » 03 okt 2006 20:56:24

On Tue, 03 Oct 2006 01:32:22 GMT, "Dora Smith"
<villandra@austin.rr.com> wrote:

I am currently using PAF, PAF Companion, and Roots Magic. As far as I can
learn, none of these programs does one very obvious thing that I need it to.
Most genealogical software won't do something else as basic.

Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of book,
web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all the spouses
and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in God's name the makers
of these programs think we wouldn't need that - takes half a brain in my
opinion.

Seems to me like you might want to take a closer look at the
definition of ancestor which is defined as one from whom you are
descended..

If a man and his wife are your ancestor, then his second wife is not
your ancestor nor are her parents.

I am dealing with French Canadian families, and most of thsoe ancestors
married more than once, and had large, close knit families. Not, a couple
of them, but two thirds of 3500 of them. I do NOT want to list only spouse
and the children of the spouse who is the direct ancestor! Why in Chr___
anyone would think I would want to do that. Why do genealogy programs
even accept multiple spouses and their children if you aren't supposed to
want to list them on reports?!!!

No, I do not want to prepare a mess of umpteen disorganized descendant
reports. (Roots Magic people thought they could talk me into doing
something else totally different that makes no sense.) I want a single
ancestor report . With all spouses and all their children for each
ancestor.

I suspect RootsMagic people told you how to print a descendant chart
that would show all spouses and all children. If you printed umpteen
disorganized descendant reports it was not the fault of RootsMagic.

Probably the reason no program will do what you want is because no one
else wants to do what you want. The descendant chart works fine for
them.

The program also needs to be able to import irregular dates and dual dates,
which PAF Companion and Roots Magic can do, but most programs, including
Family Tree Maker, cannot. In 12 or more versions the makers of FTM just
don't get it.

You certainly diagnosed the problem of FTM.

I need to create descendant reports in narrative formats and a web site with
all the individual pages linked to a central chart or index.

What genealogical software meets my criteria?

Most programs will print narrative descendant reports with an index
but now you are talking about a descendant report. Before you were
talking about an ancestor report. Legacy, RootsMagic and TMG will do
that. I suspect they will help with web sites - I don't know because I
never plan to have one.

If I didn't understand your problem, perhaps you could state it
differently.

Hugh

Pat in Atlanta

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Pat in Atlanta » 03 okt 2006 22:59:02

I've asked FTM several times to include both spouses because the children of
the second spouse will be half brothers or siblings of the children of the
second spouse. So the poster isn't the only one who would like that
feature.
"J. Hugh Sullivan" <Eagle@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:4522bb4c.28179449@news1.news.adelphia.net...
On Tue, 03 Oct 2006 01:32:22 GMT, "Dora Smith"
villandra@austin.rr.com> wrote:

I am currently using PAF, PAF Companion, and Roots Magic. As far as I
can
learn, none of these programs does one very obvious thing that I need it
to.
Most genealogical software won't do something else as basic.

Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of book,
web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all the spouses
and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in God's name the
makers
of these programs think we wouldn't need that - takes half a brain in my
opinion.

Seems to me like you might want to take a closer look at the
definition of ancestor which is defined as one from whom you are
descended..

If a man and his wife are your ancestor, then his second wife is not
your ancestor nor are her parents.

I am dealing with French Canadian families, and most of thsoe ancestors
married more than once, and had large, close knit families. Not, a
couple
of them, but two thirds of 3500 of them. I do NOT want to list only
spouse
and the children of the spouse who is the direct ancestor! Why in Chr___
anyone would think I would want to do that. Why do genealogy programs
even accept multiple spouses and their children if you aren't supposed to
want to list them on reports?!!!

No, I do not want to prepare a mess of umpteen disorganized descendant
reports. (Roots Magic people thought they could talk me into doing
something else totally different that makes no sense.) I want a single
ancestor report . With all spouses and all their children for each
ancestor.

I suspect RootsMagic people told you how to print a descendant chart
that would show all spouses and all children. If you printed umpteen
disorganized descendant reports it was not the fault of RootsMagic.

Probably the reason no program will do what you want is because no one
else wants to do what you want. The descendant chart works fine for
them.

The program also needs to be able to import irregular dates and dual
dates,
which PAF Companion and Roots Magic can do, but most programs, including
Family Tree Maker, cannot. In 12 or more versions the makers of FTM just
don't get it.

You certainly diagnosed the problem of FTM.

I need to create descendant reports in narrative formats and a web site
with
all the individual pages linked to a central chart or index.

What genealogical software meets my criteria?

Most programs will print narrative descendant reports with an index
but now you are talking about a descendant report. Before you were
talking about an ancestor report. Legacy, RootsMagic and TMG will do
that. I suspect they will help with web sites - I don't know because I
never plan to have one.

If I didn't understand your problem, perhaps you could state it
differently.

Hugh

the_verminator@comcast.ne

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av the_verminator@comcast.ne » 04 okt 2006 01:39:07

Pat in Atlanta wrote:
I've asked FTM several times to include both spouses because the children of
the second spouse will be half brothers or siblings of the children of the
second spouse. So the poster isn't the only one who would like that
feature.

Half siblings are easily dealt with in descendancy reports.. and are,
unless incest is involved, completely absurd in ancestor reports.
Remember- there are NO "indirect" ancestors.

--
The Verminator

Dora Smith

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Dora Smith » 04 okt 2006 04:09:09

No, I awnt something like this - in an ancestor report. That is, for each
ancestral family. Person said she created a reverse register report, which
she says IS an ancestor report, adn it certainly sounds like one, using a
feature of TMG that is now something else, and people on the TMG list are
telling me it can't be done.

Notice that each spouse here married twice. All three marriages and all
children of each are listed.

14. Dennis Hess (Benjamin, #28) was born on 4 February 1845 at Bethel Twp.,
Bedford Co., (now Fulton County) Pennsylvania. Dennis migrated with his
parents to Missouri. He first married, Jemima/Gemima Elizabeth Vaughan, on
2 January 1870, in Moniteau Co., Missouri. In the census of 1880 the
family resided in Walker Twp., Pilot Grove, Moniteau Co., Missouri.

One cold winter day while the family was busy butchering she went into town
to get some supplies and was caught in a snow storm. She died the winter of
1885 with pneumonia. Six children were born of this union.

Then in 1886 he married, Mary Elizabeth (Bull) Whittaker, the widow of John
Whittaker and the mother of two young sons. In 1900 this family resided in
Saline, Cooper Co., Missouri. Then by the 1910 census the family was
residing in Greeley Twp., Oklahoma City, Oklahoma.

The six known children of Dennis Hess and Jemima Elizabeth Vaughan were as
follows:

i. Eugene Monroe "Pete" Hess was born, 12 October 1870 in
California, Moniteau County, Missouri. He appeared in the household of his
parents in the 1880 census being age 10. He married Mary Jane McFadden, the
daughter of Joseph and Sarah J. (Arnold) McFadden. She was born 27 August
1861, in Wayne County, Ohio. She died 27 April 1916, in Tipton, Missouri.
Eugene Monroe died 22 December 1905, in Tipton, Missouri. Both Mary and
Eugene Monroe are buried at the St. Andrew's Cemetery.

ii. Albert Louis Hess was born, 17 August 1872 in California,
Moniteau Co., Missouri. In the 1880 census he appeared in the household of
his parents being age 9. He married Ollie Mae Karstetter. He died 7 April
1958. Ollie was born circa 1873, in Clarksburg, Missouri. She died 12
February 1913, in Clarksburg, Missouri.

iii. Mary "Alice" Hess was born, 7 September 1874 in
California, Moniteau County, Missouri. In the 1880 census she appeared in
the household of her parents being age 6. She married John Godfred
Schmolzi, April 1900. He was born 1 September 1871, in Switzerland. He
died August 1959, in Cooper County, Missouri. She died 30 December 1967 in
Rolla, Phelps County, Missouri.

iv. Victoria Hess was born, 23 May 1877 in California,
Moniteau County, Missouri. She appeared in the household of her parents in
the 1880 census, being age 4. She married Frank Himes.

v. George Taylor Hess was born 21 September 1878 in
California, Moniteau County, Missouri. He appeared in the 1880 census in
the household of his parents, being age 2. He served in the Spanish
American War. The family lost track of him after the war and thought he had
died. After being contacted by his great granddaughter Joline we now know
that he survived the war, married and reared a family. He married Estella
Mae Traub, 11 April 1907 in Cedar Rapids, Linn Co, Iowa. George possibly
enlisted in the calvary at St. Joseph, Missouri and is said to have served
in the Spanish-American War (May-Aug 1898). However, the federal archives
has no record of his service. He was also reported to have lived in the
Booneville & St Louis, Missouri areas. Sometime before April 1907, he came
to Iowa, where he was married in Cedar Rapids, Linn Co, on 11 April 1907.
George and Estella lived near Watkins, Benton Co, Iowa, which is close to
the Linn County border. At least three of the children were born in Fairfax,
Linn Co, Iowa. He lived in Cedar Rapids before his death on 25 February 1953
at Mercy Hospital, Cedar Rapids, Linn County, Iowa and is buried in the
Brandon Cemetery next to his wife Estella. Estella Mae Traub was born 12
June 1887 in Pekin, Tazewell Co, Illinois.

vi. Martha Hess was born in California, Moniteau County,
Missouri. She married George Ernest.

The five known children of Dennis Hess and Mary Elizabeth (Bull) Whittaker
were as follows:

i. Rose Hess was born on 12 August 1887 at Missouri.

ii Margaret Hess was born circa 1889 at Missouri.

iii. Flora Hess was born on 9 September 1890 at Missouri.
She died at Oklahoma City, Oklahoma Co., Oklahoma.

iv. Hattie Mabel Hess was born on 17 July 1892 at Gooch's
Mill, Cooper Co., Missouri. She was baptized on 3 November 1895 at SS. Peter
& Paul Catholic Church, Boonville, Cooper, Missouri. She died on 18 October
1984 at Newark, Licking Co., Ohio, at age 90. She was buried on 21 October
1984 at Calvary Cemetery, Little Flower Section; Tulsa, Tulsa Co., Oklahoma.

7 v. Amanda Elizabeth Hess

15. Mary Elizabeth Bull (George, #30) was born on 2 August 1854 at Tipton,
Moniteau Co., Missouri. She married John Whittaker circa 1875 at Tipton,
Moniteau Co., Missouri.

John Whittaker, was a farmer and they lived three miles north of Tipton,
Missouri. Mr. Whittaker went to town after the doctor for his mother-in-law
Mrs. George (Albertine Veulemans) Bull. When he was about to return, and at
a point just opposite the Tipton House, his horse became frightened at some
object throwing him heavily on the frozen road, striking his head and
causing one or more severe contusions. He was carried into the hotel,
placed in comfortable quarters and cared for by Dr. Redmon before he
proceeded to the bedside of Mrs. Bull. His wife was notified and came
immediately to take care of him. Mrs. Bull died 29 February 1884 and Mr.
Whittaker died 3 March 1884. Mary was left with two young sons.

The two known children of John Whittaker and Mary Elizabeth (Bull) Whittaker
were as follows:

i. George W. Whittaker was born, 23 December 1876 in Cooper
County, Missouri. He married Lucinda Ellen Vaughan, the daughter of Green
Berry Vaughan and Hannah Hopps Hess, 16 August 1905 in Cooper County,
Missouri. He died 3 August 1908 in Missouri. George and Lucinda had one
son George James Whittaker.

ii. Herman Whittaker was born, 8 February 1877 in Roundhill,
Cooper County, Missouri. He married Eva Lavona Vaughan, daughter of Green
Berry Vaughan and Hannah Hopps Hess, 14 October 1900 in Cooper County,
Missouri. He died 12 April 1920 in California, Missouri. Hannah Hopps
(Hess) Vaughan is the sister of Dennis Hess.

Mary Elizabeth (Bull) Whittaker married, second, Dennis Hess, son of
Benjamin Hess and Mary Polly Garland, circa 1886 in Missouri. After the
death of her second husband Mary Elizabeth made her home with her daughter
Amanda and her husband Charles Robert Hall. Mary Elizabeth was a Master
Quilter and several articles over the years appeared in the local (Maud)
newspaper and also in the Daily Oklahoman News of her quilts. One article
which drew attention was a quilt that she displayed in her son-in-laws
cleaning shop. At the time the quilt was displayed Mary Elizabeth was
seventy-nine years old. The quilt contained 35 squares with 204 pieces to
the square making 7,140 pieces to the whole and a big job. She estimated
that it took 128,500 stitches before this masterpiece of quilting was
complete. Mary Elizabeth's hobby was quilt making and she made many lovely
quilts for her family and friends, she did both applique and piece quilting.
She past the art of quilting on to her daughter, Hattie and several members
of the family today have some of these quilts. At the time Auntie (Hattie)
was quilting she told this writer that quilting was pictorial needle art
that reflected a great deal about the quilters life, politics, religion,
social activities or even various moods. Some of the quilt patterns that
are in this writers possession are: "Indian Trail, Lincoln's Platform,
Double Wedding Ring, Arkansas Traveler, Flower Garden, Spider Webb, Prairie
Queen and Morning Star". Mary Elizabeth died at the home of her daughter,
Amanda and son-in-law Charles Robert Hall the afternoon of 22 September 1933
in Maud, Pottawatomie Co., Oklahoma, at age 79. She was buried on 26
September 1933 in Sacred Heart Catholic Cemetery, Maud, Pottawatomie Co.,
Oklahoma.



--
Yours,
Dora Smith
Austin, TX
tiggernut24@yahoo.com
"dave" <barbara-dave@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:asOdnbg6X-Y_Jb_YnZ2dnUVZ_tqdnZ2d@adelphia.com...
Having lurked on this thread for the last few days, I'm not 100% sure what
form of report you want but I do get the impression that you wish to
'report' on 'everyone'.

To that end, I'll suggest Legacy as follows-the report info is in the form
of tables:

Reports->Family[Family Group Records]
Record Selection: select "All families in the entire family file"
Report Options: select what you want.


Steve Hayes

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Steve Hayes » 04 okt 2006 05:59:42

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 03:09:09 GMT, "Dora Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com>
wrote:

No, I awnt something like this - in an ancestor report. That is, for each
ancestral family. Person said she created a reverse register report, which
she says IS an ancestor report, adn it certainly sounds like one, using a
feature of TMG that is now something else, and people on the TMG list are
telling me it can't be done.

I understand what you want, and the only program that I *think* could do it
was Family Origins, which had a kind of reverse register report.

Unfortunately I can't get Family Origins 2.0 to run under Windows XP to try it
out.

Every time U try to run it the opening screen appears, and it says "Press any
key to continue".

Pressing any key causes it to jump back to the Windows "desktop".


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://people.tribe.net/hayesstw
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

Steve Hayes

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Steve Hayes » 04 okt 2006 06:05:24

On 3 Oct 2006 17:39:07 -0700, "the_verminator@comcast.net"
<the_verminator@comcast.net> wrote:

Pat in Atlanta wrote:
I've asked FTM several times to include both spouses because the children of
the second spouse will be half brothers or siblings of the children of the
second spouse. So the poster isn't the only one who would like that
feature.

Half siblings are easily dealt with in descendancy reports.. and are,
unless incest is involved, completely absurd in ancestor reports.
Remember- there are NO "indirect" ancestors.

That's just playing with words.

No one is claiming that there are such things as "indirect" ancestors.

But what the OP wants is quite clear -- a report that shows ALL the ancestors
of a person, with their spouses and children.

Just because the extra people are not ancestors, but spouses and siblings of
ancestors, does not mean thagt one ought not to want to include them in a
report that shows all the ancestors.




--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://people.tribe.net/hayesstw
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

J. Hugh Sullivan

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av J. Hugh Sullivan » 04 okt 2006 15:27:29

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 07:05:24 +0200, Steve Hayes
<hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote:

On 3 Oct 2006 17:39:07 -0700, "the_verminator@comcast.net"
the_verminator@comcast.net> wrote:

Pat in Atlanta wrote:
I've asked FTM several times to include both spouses because the children of
the second spouse will be half brothers or siblings of the children of the
second spouse. So the poster isn't the only one who would like that
feature.

Half siblings are easily dealt with in descendancy reports.. and are,
unless incest is involved, completely absurd in ancestor reports.
Remember- there are NO "indirect" ancestors.

That's just playing with words.

No one is claiming that there are such things as "indirect" ancestors.

But what the OP wants is quite clear -- a report that shows ALL the ancestors
of a person, with their spouses and children.

Just because the extra people are not ancestors, but spouses and siblings of
ancestors, does not mean thagt one ought not to want to include them in a
report that shows all the ancestors.

There is no problem wanting such a report. The problem is that it is
not genealogy which is essentially about bloodlines - and in the
header of each news group above.

If an ancestor had 5 wives I am the product of 1 of those wives, not
all 5. Each of my step first cousins X times removed has a different
ancestor report, albeit ending at the same papaw.

My wife has a step-brother - his father married her mother. My wife is
not related by blood to him or his ancestors thus is not genealogy.
I'll agree that it is family history.

One son's father-in-law has been married 8 times. Our d-i-l has more
steps than a staircase.

Can you imagine what the report Dora wants would look like for a
descendant of King Solomon? As far as descendants, concubines and
hanky pankys do not require the legality of marriage. And think of the
job security for a programmer.

Isn't the only thing missing from a descendant report the
non-genealogy of relatives by marriage but not blood?

Please note that I add family history to my genealogy so I am not
averse to the idea. I just think we should keep the distinction
between genealogy and family history.

I have found the creators of Legacy. RootsMagic and TMG to be very
receptive and attuned to the needs of users. Perhaps others can say
the same for the parade of owners of FTM - I can't.

Now let me go download the recommended program - it may be the only
one I've never tried.

If I'm wrong, be gentle. 8-)

Hugh

larry dodds

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av larry dodds » 04 okt 2006 15:44:29

that is not a family tree. Liz in Calgary. I wouldn't recommend any
program for you. genealogy is family tree. not a gathering of random names
and try and put them into a report. and call them a FAMILY So what is
your point of having all those names and no connections you to your original
tree. no wonder we get stomped on for freedom of information, none access
to cemeteries, etc.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Larry

"Liz_in_Calgary" <misnomer@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:aic4i29dhu2sa90cqr5aravbk72acuniee@4ax.com...
Perhaps what you want is a descendant report, but that won't
give you the parents of parents of the lines that married
into the line.

What I would like is a program that would create a report of
all the families - just basic stuff, name, dates of birth
death and marraige, with all the siblings - more of a
graphical tree than a report - I tried to make my own, in
a spreadsheet, it truly is a programming nightmare, grandpa
is on one sheet and grandma is way over on the other side -
It may be something that is finished before I leave this
world.

take care
Liz



On Tue, 03 Oct 2006 01:32:22 GMT, in alt.genealogy "Dora
Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com> wrote :

Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of book,
web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all the spouses
and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in God's name the
makers
of these programs think we wouldn't need that - takes half a brain in my
opinion.

Steve Hayes

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Steve Hayes » 04 okt 2006 17:14:11

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 14:27:29 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 07:05:24 +0200, Steve Hayes
hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote:

On 3 Oct 2006 17:39:07 -0700, "the_verminator@comcast.net"
the_verminator@comcast.net> wrote:


Half siblings are easily dealt with in descendancy reports.. and are,
unless incest is involved, completely absurd in ancestor reports.
Remember- there are NO "indirect" ancestors.

That's just playing with words.

No one is claiming that there are such things as "indirect" ancestors.

But what the OP wants is quite clear -- a report that shows ALL the ancestors
of a person, with their spouses and children.

Just because the extra people are not ancestors, but spouses and siblings of
ancestors, does not mean thagt one ought not to want to include them in a
report that shows all the ancestors.

There is no problem wanting such a report. The problem is that it is
not genealogy which is essentially about bloodlines - and in the
header of each news group above.

So would you exclude your brothes, sisters, uncles, aunts and cousins from
your genealogy because they aren't in your "bloodline"?


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://people.tribe.net/hayesstw
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

J. Hugh Sullivan

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av J. Hugh Sullivan » 04 okt 2006 18:34:06

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 18:14:11 +0200, Steve Hayes
<hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 14:27:29 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 07:05:24 +0200, Steve Hayes
hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote:

On 3 Oct 2006 17:39:07 -0700, "the_verminator@comcast.net"
the_verminator@comcast.net> wrote:


Half siblings are easily dealt with in descendancy reports.. and are,
unless incest is involved, completely absurd in ancestor reports.
Remember- there are NO "indirect" ancestors.

That's just playing with words.

No one is claiming that there are such things as "indirect" ancestors.

But what the OP wants is quite clear -- a report that shows ALL the ancestors
of a person, with their spouses and children.

Just because the extra people are not ancestors, but spouses and siblings of
ancestors, does not mean thagt one ought not to want to include them in a
report that shows all the ancestors.

There is no problem wanting such a report. The problem is that it is
not genealogy which is essentially about bloodlines - and in the
header of each news group above.

So would you exclude your brothes, sisters, uncles, aunts and cousins from
your genealogy because they aren't in your "bloodline"?

If I had brothers and/or sisters why wouldn't they be in my bloodline?

And, my descendant report includes all my brothers, sisters, uncles,
aunts and cousins. It doesn't include the ancestry of any people who
are not my bloodline.

As I understood she wanted to include people where the only
relationship, if any, was legal.

On another thread I believe it was explained to her that she misled
respondents with her explanation.

Hugh

Steve Hayes

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Steve Hayes » 05 okt 2006 03:10:06

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 17:34:06 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 18:14:11 +0200, Steve Hayes
hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 14:27:29 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:

There is no problem wanting such a report. The problem is that it is
not genealogy which is essentially about bloodlines - and in the
header of each news group above.

So would you exclude your brothes, sisters, uncles, aunts and cousins from
your genealogy because they aren't in your "bloodline"?

If I had brothers and/or sisters why wouldn't they be in my bloodline?

That's what I was asking you -- you were saying that a report that included
brothers and sisters etc was not genealogy because such people aren't in your
bloodline.

And, my descendant report includes all my brothers, sisters, uncles,
aunts and cousins. It doesn't include the ancestry of any people who
are not my bloodline.

That's irrelevant to the original poster's question, which was whether any
genealogy program produces a report that includes all ancestors of a given
person, with the spouses and children of each of those ancestors. A good one
would include parents of spouses as well.

To object to having such a report on the grounds that not every person on it
is an actual ancestor seems silly to me. Many "descendant reports" include
non-descendants like spouses and parents of spouses, so why shouldn't ancestor
reports include non-ancestors like spouses and parents of spouses and their
children?

As I understood she wanted to include people where the only
relationship, if any, was legal.

Yes. So what?

What is wrong with that? Why are so many people objecting to the very idea of
having such a report?




On another thread I believe it was explained to her that she misled
respondents with her explanation.

--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://people.tribe.net/hayesstw
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

Steve Hayes

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Steve Hayes » 05 okt 2006 05:45:21

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 02:52:20 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 04:10:06 +0200, Steve Hayes
hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 17:34:06 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 18:14:11 +0200, Steve Hayes
hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 14:27:29 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:

There is no problem wanting such a report. The problem is that it is
not genealogy which is essentially about bloodlines - and in the
header of each news group above.

So would you exclude your brothes, sisters, uncles, aunts and cousins from
your genealogy because they aren't in your "bloodline"?

If I had brothers and/or sisters why wouldn't they be in my bloodline?

That's what I was asking you -- you were saying that a report that included
brothers and sisters etc was not genealogy because such people aren't in your
bloodline.

Point me to where I said that. I doubt that I ever said people in my
bloodline were not in my bloodline.

See above, in the text you yourself have quoted, but I repeat:

I said:

Just because the extra people are not ancestors, but spouses and siblings of
ancestors, does not mean thagt one ought not to want to include them in a
report that shows all the ancestors.

You replied:

There is no problem wanting such a report. The problem is that it is
not genealogy which is essentially about bloodlines - and in the
header of each news group above.

I mentioned a report that included spouses and siblings of ancestors and you
said that that was not genealogy, because those are not bloodlines. Perhaps
you were confused by the word "sibling" - it is a word that means brothers and
sisters.


And, my descendant report includes all my brothers, sisters, uncles,
aunts and cousins. It doesn't include the ancestry of any people who
are not my bloodline.

That's irrelevant to the original poster's question, which was whether any
genealogy program produces a report that includes all ancestors of a given
person, with the spouses and children of each of those ancestors. A good one
would include parents of spouses as well.

Precisely. And I said what she asked for was not genealogy. And I gave
illustrations.

To object to having such a report on the grounds that not every person on it
is an actual ancestor seems silly to me. Many "descendant reports" include
non-descendants like spouses and parents of spouses, so why shouldn't ancestor
reports include non-ancestors like spouses and parents of spouses and their
children?

As I understood she wanted to include people where the only
relationship, if any, was legal.

Yes. So what?

What is wrong with that? Why are so many people objecting to the very idea of
having such a report?

I said there was nothing wrong in asking. You are not reading very
carefully. I said it was not genealogy.

Why are you out of step with so many people?

On another thread I believe it was explained to her that she misled
respondents with her explanation.

My great great grandfather had 3 children by 2 ladies who were not his
wives The ancestors of those two ladies are no relation to me - nor
are the 2 ladies. It would be as genealogically reasonable to include
them as it would for me to include Marie Antoinette or Jean D'Arc ot
Tokyo Rose.

If your grandfather had children by them, however, those children would be in
your bloodline, and those ladies would be in their bloodlines. So it is still
genealogy.

I don't include Queen Victoria in our family tree, even though my wife's gggg
grandmother had an affair with her father, and though some members of the
family claim (erroneously) that my wife's ggg grandfather was the offspring of
that union. But I include my wife's ancestors because they are my children's
bloodline, even if they aren't mine. Is that not genealogy?

I have no problem if people include whoever they wish in their family
history - I just have a problem if they call it genealogy when it is
not by any official definition.

Who prescribes the "official" definition?

And the discussion is not about official definitions, but about software to
produce a report.




--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://people.tribe.net/hayesstw
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

J. Hugh Sullivan

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av J. Hugh Sullivan » 05 okt 2006 13:56:17

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 06:45:21 +0200, Steve Hayes
<hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 02:52:20 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:

My great great grandfather had 3 children by 2 ladies who were not his
wives The ancestors of those two ladies are no relation to me - nor
are the 2 ladies. It would be as genealogically reasonable to include
them as it would for me to include Marie Antoinette or Jean D'Arc ot
Tokyo Rose.

If your grandfather had children by them, however, those children would be in
your bloodline, and those ladies would be in their bloodlines. So it is still
genealogy.

Perhaps you can explain how those ladies, and their ancestors, are in
my bloodline.

Those ladies and their ancestors are not part of my genealogy. They
are part of my step-whatever's ancestral genealogy. One's ancestral
genealogy is not the others. All lines of the gg grandlover and his
friends of the opposite sex would/could be on a descendant report.

I don't include Queen Victoria in our family tree, even though my wife's gggg
grandmother had an affair with her father, and though some members of the
family claim (erroneously) that my wife's ggg grandfather was the offspring of
that union. But I include my wife's ancestors because they are my children's
bloodline, even if they aren't mine. Is that not genealogy?

That's your children's and her bloodline, not your's.

If your wife's father had had an affair with another lady and children
resulted, that ladies ancestors would be neither your nor your wife's
bloodline - but the children would be your wife's steps and the lady's
ancestors would be theirs but not your wife's.

I have no problem if people include whoever they wish in their family
history - I just have a problem if they call it genealogy when it is
not by any official definition.

Who prescribes the "official" definition?

Precedent for one thing. The dictionary for another. Majority opinion
of recognized researchers for another.

It's certainly not as decided by every Tom, Dick and Harry, who wishes
to include the family dog and cat in his genealogy.

And the discussion is not about official definitions, but about software to
produce a report.

Wanting the report (for the 3rd time is fine). Calling it genealogy is
dishonest. Call a dog's tail a leg and he still has only 4 legs.

Once again the original poster apparently was unable to accurately
explain what she wanted. Thus wanting the report for purposes of this
particular thread is moot.

If you want to presume the family pet boa constrictor is your
bloodline and part of your genealogy be my guest. Just don't expect
many of us to shed our skins each spring.

Hugh

Nigel Bufton

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Nigel Bufton » 05 okt 2006 14:34:22

"J. Hugh Sullivan" <Eagle@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:4524f8bc.4536082@news1.news.adelphia.net...
On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 06:45:21 +0200, Steve Hayes
hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 02:52:20 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan)
wrote:

My great great grandfather had 3 children by 2 ladies who were not his
wives The ancestors of those two ladies are no relation to me - nor
are the 2 ladies. It would be as genealogically reasonable to include
them as it would for me to include Marie Antoinette or Jean D'Arc ot
Tokyo Rose.

If your grandfather had children by them, however, those children would be
in
your bloodline, and those ladies would be in their bloodlines. So it is
still
genealogy.

Perhaps you can explain how those ladies, and their ancestors, are in
my bloodline.

Those ladies and their ancestors are not part of my genealogy. They
are part of my step-whatever's ancestral genealogy. One's ancestral
genealogy is not the others. All lines of the gg grandlover and his
friends of the opposite sex would/could be on a descendant report.

I don't include Queen Victoria in our family tree, even though my wife's
gggg
grandmother had an affair with her father, and though some members of the
family claim (erroneously) that my wife's ggg grandfather was the
offspring of
that union. But I include my wife's ancestors because they are my
children's
bloodline, even if they aren't mine. Is that not genealogy?

That's your children's and her bloodline, not your's.

If your wife's father had had an affair with another lady and children
resulted, that ladies ancestors would be neither your nor your wife's
bloodline - but the children would be your wife's steps and the lady's
ancestors would be theirs but not your wife's.

I have no problem if people include whoever they wish in their family
history - I just have a problem if they call it genealogy when it is
not by any official definition.

Who prescribes the "official" definition?

Precedent for one thing. The dictionary for another. Majority opinion
of recognized researchers for another.

It's certainly not as decided by every Tom, Dick and Harry, who wishes
to include the family dog and cat in his genealogy.

And the discussion is not about official definitions, but about software
to
produce a report.

Wanting the report (for the 3rd time is fine). Calling it genealogy is
dishonest. Call a dog's tail a leg and he still has only 4 legs.

Once again the original poster apparently was unable to accurately
explain what she wanted. Thus wanting the report for purposes of this
particular thread is moot.

If you want to presume the family pet boa constrictor is your
bloodline and part of your genealogy be my guest. Just don't expect
many of us to shed our skins each spring.

Hugh

The pedants are confusing a person's own genealogy (their pedigree) and a
person's study of their genealogy (their pedigree plus others' pedigrees
that are related through marriage or adoption).

A good encyclopædia will clarify the distinction. The Encyclopædia
Britannica, for example, makes the point that amateur genealogists tend to
focus on their family and include pedigrees other than their own which are
of interest. Professional genealogists (according to the EB) either trace a
pedigree for client, and/or have in interest in multiple families.

My own genealogical file contains my pedigree and those of others who
married members of my pedigree. When I produce a full genealogy report of
this file, I want all any or all of these pedigrees included. That's why I
created "The Complete Genealogy Reporter".

Nigel

Sir Creep

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Sir Creep » 05 okt 2006 18:43:29

J. Hugh Sullivan wrote:
Pat in Atlanta wrote:
I've asked FTM several times to include both spouses because the children of
the second spouse will be half brothers or siblings of the children of the
second spouse. So the poster isn't the only one who would like that
feature.

Half siblings are easily dealt with in descendancy reports.. and are,
unless incest is involved, completely absurd in ancestor reports.
Remember- there are NO "indirect" ancestors.
Just because the extra people are not ancestors, but spouses and siblings of
ancestors, does not mean thagt one ought not to want to include them in a
report that shows all the ancestors.

If an ancestor had 5 wives I am the product of 1 of those wives, not
all 5. Each of my step first cousins X times removed has a different
ancestor report, albeit ending at the same papaw.

My wife has a step-brother - his father married her mother. My wife is
not related by blood to him or his ancestors thus is not genealogy.
I'll agree that it is family history.
Hugh

Hugh, how in the world did you confuse the original question (re:
half-siblings) with the example you gave (re: in-laws). My half-sister
is my sister, and my mother's 'blood flows through her', so all her
offspring are.....that's right....RELEVANT relatives. Now, my
half-sister's father is NOT my relative, and apart from mentioning him
in my tree (after all, he wsa my mother's husband onee), what he did
subsequent to my older sister's birth and/or his 'genealogy' is truly
of no importance to me, and to that end I suspect we agree (unless one
is creating a 'One World Tree' LMAO) that wanting to produce a report
that shows all that background noise is, well, um....[can't think of a
nice way to put it]. But the original post was asking about
half-siblings, not in-laws, as you seem to suggest. Half-siblings are
as much a true and legitimate relative as one can imagine. In-laws
outer shell families are anything but.

Sir Creep

Sir Creep

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Sir Creep » 05 okt 2006 18:48:17

Steve Hayes wrote:
I don't include Queen Victoria in our family tree, even though my wife's gggg
grandmother had an affair with her father,

Wow....that's funny. MY gggg grandmother had an affair with QV's
father! Are we related?
SC

K0BBE

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av K0BBE » 05 okt 2006 19:38:25

Sir Creep smashed in the group:

Wow....that's funny. MY gggg grandmother had an affair with
QV's father! Are we related?
SC

If you are related is not the question...

I'm making a "name genealogy". All Van Coilge'es (and variations
of that name), from the first, the second or the third spousse
have to come in my output. AND THEY DO !

Use Pro-Gen, Genealogie à la carte.
Dutch programm, also available in English.

See an output @ http://vancoilge.net/ /
Click on "stamboom" and then on "Rouger", and see ALL the
descendents of that Rouger with variants of his surname Van
Coilge!

--
K0BBE
:: familiewebblad: [ http://vancoilge.net/ ]
:: e-adres: incorrect

J. Hugh Sullivan

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av J. Hugh Sullivan » 05 okt 2006 22:47:03

On 5 Oct 2006 10:43:29 -0700, "Sir Creep" <sircreep@hotmail.com>
wrote:

J. Hugh Sullivan wrote:
Pat in Atlanta wrote:
I've asked FTM several times to include both spouses because the children of
the second spouse will be half brothers or siblings of the children of the
second spouse. So the poster isn't the only one who would like that
feature.

Half siblings are easily dealt with in descendancy reports.. and are,
unless incest is involved, completely absurd in ancestor reports.
Remember- there are NO "indirect" ancestors.
Just because the extra people are not ancestors, but spouses and siblings of
ancestors, does not mean thagt one ought not to want to include them in a
report that shows all the ancestors.

If an ancestor had 5 wives I am the product of 1 of those wives, not
all 5. Each of my step first cousins X times removed has a different
ancestor report, albeit ending at the same papaw.

My wife has a step-brother - his father married her mother. My wife is
not related by blood to him or his ancestors thus is not genealogy.
I'll agree that it is family history.
Hugh

Hugh, how in the world did you confuse the original question (re:
half-siblings) with the example you gave (re: in-laws). My half-sister
is my sister, and my mother's 'blood flows through her', so all her
offspring are.....that's right....RELEVANT relatives. Now, my
half-sister's father is NOT my relative, and apart from mentioning him
in my tree (after all, he wsa my mother's husband onee), and to that end I suspect we agree (unless one
is creating a 'One World Tree' LMAO) that wanting to produce a report
that shows all that background noise is, well, um....[can't think of a
nice way to put it]. But the original post was asking about
half-siblings, not in-laws, as you seem to suggest. Half-siblings are
as much a true and legitimate relative as one can imagine. In-laws
outer shell families are anything but.

Sir Creep

This is from the original post...
"Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of
book, web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all
the spouses and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in
God's name the makers of these programs think we wouldn't need that -
takes half a brain in my opinion."

Note "of ancestors" and "all of their children for each ancestor". In
an ancestor report you list your ancestors and the parents of those
half-siblings are not your ancestors. In fact your own words agree
with me, "...what he did subsequent to my older sister's birth and/or
his 'genealogy' is truly of no importance to me,...". The half-sibling
comment was added by another poster and I never really addressed it
except by reference to their ancestors.

Once again another thread indicated that the original poster misstated
what she was looking for. If someone can't ask the question properly
it's not easy to give a proper answer.

Hugh

Dennis K.

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Dennis K. » 06 okt 2006 00:21:47

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 21:47:03 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan)
wrote:

"Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of
book, web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all
the spouses and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in
God's name the makers of these programs think we wouldn't need that -
takes half a brain in my opinion."

I took the OPs request to mean:

IF...

father + wife1 had you and 2 other children
father + wife2 had 2 other children

....the OP would like to see all these displayed.

If wife2 had a previous (or subsequent) marriage, that marriage and its
resulting children would *not* be displayed (since neither she nor her
other husband qualify as your "ancestor").

In an ancestor report you list your ancestors and the parents of those
half-siblings are not your ancestors.

One of them is. At least by my definition of "half-sibling".

--

Dennis K.

Dora Smith

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Dora Smith » 06 okt 2006 03:59:28

Larry, if I've gotten confused about who is answering who and actually
saying what, I apologize.

I understood you to be saying that family is only the children of ancestral
spouses of your ancestors, but now that I read it again I can't tell if you
are saying that or arguing with that notion.

--
Yours,
Dora Smith
Austin, TX
tiggernut24@yahoo.com
"Liz_in_Calgary" <misnomer@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:r4q8i2lghtup884q72oi2u8oa5arouhf3d@4ax.com...
No, I am related to all the people in my database, and all
the people I would like to show on my report. More
interested in the dead than the live ones.

thanks for the advice.
take care
Liz



On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 14:44:29 GMT, in alt.genealogy "larry
dodds" <larrydodds@shaw.ca> wrote :

that is not a family tree. Liz in Calgary. I wouldn't recommend any
program for you. genealogy is family tree. not a gathering of random
names
and try and put them into a report. and call them a FAMILY So what is
your point of having all those names and no connections you to your
original
tree. no wonder we get stomped on for freedom of information, none
access
to cemeteries, etc.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Larry

Steve Hayes

Ancestors who had affairs with Edward, Duke of Kent

Legg inn av Steve Hayes » 06 okt 2006 04:50:54

On 5 Oct 2006 10:48:17 -0700, "Sir Creep" <sircreep@hotmail.com> wrote:

Steve Hayes wrote:
I don't include Queen Victoria in our family tree, even though my wife's gggg
grandmother had an affair with her father,

Wow....that's funny. MY gggg grandmother had an affair with QV's
father! Are we related?
SC

Who was she?

My wife's ancestor was Eliza Green, but a number of family members believe she
was Julie de St Laurent or some such thing.


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://people.tribe.net/hayesstw
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

Steve Hayes

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Steve Hayes » 06 okt 2006 05:00:47

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 21:47:03 GMT, Eagle@adelphia.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:

On 5 Oct 2006 10:43:29 -0700, "Sir Creep" <sircreep@hotmail.com
wrote:
Hugh, how in the world did you confuse the original question (re:
half-siblings) with the example you gave (re: in-laws). My half-sister
is my sister, and my mother's 'blood flows through her', so all her
offspring are.....that's right....RELEVANT relatives. Now, my
half-sister's father is NOT my relative, and apart from mentioning him
in my tree (after all, he wsa my mother's husband onee), and to that end I suspect we agree (unless one
is creating a 'One World Tree' LMAO) that wanting to produce a report
that shows all that background noise is, well, um....[can't think of a
nice way to put it]. But the original post was asking about
half-siblings, not in-laws, as you seem to suggest. Half-siblings are
as much a true and legitimate relative as one can imagine. In-laws
outer shell families are anything but.

Sir Creep

This is from the original post...
"Neither PAF, PAF Companion, nor Rootsmagic, will prepare any sort of
book, web site, or narrative report, of ancestors, that includes all
the spouses and all of their children for each ancestor. Why in
God's name the makers of these programs think we wouldn't need that -
takes half a brain in my opinion."

Note "of ancestors" and "all of their children for each ancestor". In
an ancestor report you list your ancestors and the parents of those
half-siblings are not your ancestors. In fact your own words agree
with me, "...what he did subsequent to my older sister's birth and/or
his 'genealogy' is truly of no importance to me,...". The half-sibling
comment was added by another poster and I never really addressed it
except by reference to their ancestors.

Note that the original poster did not say "ancestor reports" -- that is your
misinterpretation.

Your quibble seems to be that she called it an ":ancestor report", but she
didn't -- YOU did.

She asked why programs did not include ancestors and their spouses and
siblings. That's all.

Note two things that she did NOT do:

1) She did not call it genealogy.

2) She did not call it an "ancestor report"

So why do you go on (and on and on) berating her for doing things that she did
not do, but which you have unfairly imputed to her?

Please, let's not have another of those interminable "fight" threads.


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://people.tribe.net/hayesstw
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

Dora Smith

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Dora Smith » 06 okt 2006 05:11:57

Half siblings and step parents have an annoying way of insinuating
themselves into family life and family history for generations.

For example, Mildred grew up with a grandmother who does not appear in an
ancestor report that does not list both of her grandfather's wives, and with
aunts who were descended from her father's mother. So who in H--- are
these people she was living with that an oversimplistic ancestor narrative
doesn`t mention? And how come they all in succession ended up sharing the
same address as Mildred's cousin the mayor of Northampton?

Doing a descendancy report from Mildred's great grandfather does not solve
the problem, because Mildred was 100% FRench Canadian, and more of her
ancestors married multiple times than did not do so. The Church all but
formally required everyone to have atleast 16 children, refusing Communion
to anyone who wasn't turnign them out regularly, and the King of France
gave all sorts of incentives and rewards to anyone who had atleast 12. When
the wife inevitably died the man just took a new wife and kept going. If
the man died the woman remarried and kept going, and amazingly some women
actually reached old age after bearing eighteen or so children. Some men
married three and more times, in succession, the Church being quite strict
on that part, and had two to three dozen children! If anyone doubts that,
I can send you the GEDCOM's, with the notes proving they aren't historically
imaginary children. Of course, they were hard put to end up with twelve
children who survived. The resulting large families were close knit, and
the stories of their migrations, employment, marriages, and adventures is
not the story of the children of any particular spouse.

French Canadians are an extreme case, but they have however regrettably
married into my family, and how under any circumstances do we not report
half the family?!

--
Yours,
Dora Smith
Austin, TX
tiggernut24@yahoo.com
"Sir Creep" <sircreep@hotmail.com> wrote in message

Dennis K.

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Dennis K. » 06 okt 2006 12:12:27

On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 04:11:57 GMT, "Dora Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com>
wrote:

Doing a descendancy report from Mildred's great grandfather does not solve
the problem

Have you tried Legacy's Multiple Lines of Descent report? You have to
plug in your top-most ancestors manually, but they are easy enough to
find using Search|Miscellaneous Searches|Direct line ancestors with no
parents.

--

Dennis K.

Steve Hayes

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Steve Hayes » 06 okt 2006 13:10:59

On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 03:02:19 GMT, "Dora Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com>
wrote:

Family Origins is the ancestor of Legacy, and its web site says Family
Origins not still available and takes you to Legacy. Legacy says they
don't include multiple spouses and children thereof in ancestral databases.
It is possible that Family Origins once did, despite having allegedly been
designed by the same people with the same attitude problems as the people
who designed Legacy.

Not true.

Family Origins may not be available, but I don't think it had much to do with
Legacy.


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://people.tribe.net/hayesstw
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

J. Hugh Sullivan

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av J. Hugh Sullivan » 06 okt 2006 14:07:09

On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 04:11:57 GMT, "Dora Smith"
<villandra@austin.rr.com> wrote:

Half siblings and step parents have an annoying way of insinuating
themselves into family life and family history for generations.

It's now very clear what you wish, and why, Dora. I would have thought
the programming was very complex. But, if the owner of Wholly Genes
says it's done, believe me, it's done.

If my first ancestor had multiple spouses I would do a different
ancestor report for my half siblings of each spouse. Or I would do one
descendant report that would include all spouses and all the
descendants - but not the ancestors of each spouse.

I am in no way attempting to deny your legitimate request.

I would add that it is difficult for readers to precisely follow a
very complex line of another. Most find that an explanation in
general terms better serves one's purpose.

Since you learned that Brother's Keeper does the job for you and TMG
will also apparently do it, there seems to be little need for further
discussion of this particular issue.

Hugh

Denis Beauregard

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Denis Beauregard » 06 okt 2006 16:14:21

On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 14:10:59 +0200, Steve Hayes
<hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote in soc.genealogy.computing:

On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 03:02:19 GMT, "Dora Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com
wrote:

Family Origins is the ancestor of Legacy, and its web site says Family
Origins not still available and takes you to Legacy. Legacy says they
don't include multiple spouses and children thereof in ancestral databases.
It is possible that Family Origins once did, despite having allegedly been
designed by the same people with the same attitude problems as the people
who designed Legacy.

Not true.

Family Origins may not be available, but I don't think it had much to do with
Legacy.

FO was purchased by FTM and disappeared. But it is possible the
developpers of FO started Legacy. It is a matter of contract when
selling a software.


Denis

P.S. What about removing irrelevant newsgroups from the list of
cross-posting ?
soc.genealogy doesn't exist
soc.genealogy.marketplace is to sell goods

--
0 Denis Beauregard -
/\/ Les Français d'Amérique - http://www.francogene.com/genealogie-quebec/
|\ French in North America before 1721 - http://www.francogene.com/quebec-genealogy/
/ | Maintenant sur cédérom, début à 1765
oo oo Now on CD-ROM, beginning to 1765

Dora Smith

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Dora Smith » 07 okt 2006 06:51:49

Here is the explanation on the Family Origins web site, which you get taken
to when you click to download a copy of Family Origins. The history is
complex, and I think what Dennis is saying is either correct or close to it
as far as it goes. I've an idea that one or more of these entities may
also have evolved or merged into Family Tree Maker.

IMPORTANT NOTICE
As you may know, we (FormalSoft) wrote Family Origins over 12 years ago and
licensed the marketing rights to Parsons Technology. We continued to write
every single version of Family Origins since then.

Parsons Technology was bought up by Mattel, and our contract with Parsons
was assigned to genealogy.com by them.

In January 2003, genealogy.com discontinued Family Origins in favor of their
own genealogy program. This is the third genealogy program they have
acquired the rights to and then discontinued.

Because of this it was necessary for us to develop a new genealogy program
to replace Family Origins.

RootsMagic is the natural successor to Family Origins. Don't be fooled by
the claims of other programs.

a.. RootsMagic was written by the same programming team that wrote every
version of Family Origins.
b.. RootsMagic is the only program that can import your Family Origins
data without losing any information.
c.. RootsMagic's look and feel is closer to Family Origins than any other
program available.
If you are looking for a program that is every bit as easy to use as Family
Origins, and every bit as powerful as Family Origins, and written by the
same programming team that wrote every version of Family Origins, then
RootsMagic is the program for you.


--
Yours,
Dora Smith
Austin, TX
tiggernut24@yahoo.com
"Denis Beauregard" <denis.b-at-francogene.com@fr.invalid> wrote in message
news:disci2hhv63vck00390v00llvsvfbgu59j@4ax.com...
On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 14:10:59 +0200, Steve Hayes
hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote in soc.genealogy.computing:

On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 03:02:19 GMT, "Dora Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com
wrote:

Family Origins is the ancestor of Legacy, and its web site says Family
Origins not still available and takes you to Legacy. Legacy says they
don't include multiple spouses and children thereof in ancestral
databases.
It is possible that Family Origins once did, despite having allegedly
been
designed by the same people with the same attitude problems as the people
who designed Legacy.

Not true.

Family Origins may not be available, but I don't think it had much to do
with
Legacy.

FO was purchased by FTM and disappeared. But it is possible the
developpers of FO started Legacy. It is a matter of contract when
selling a software.


Denis

P.S. What about removing irrelevant newsgroups from the list of
cross-posting ?
soc.genealogy doesn't exist
soc.genealogy.marketplace is to sell goods

--
0 Denis Beauregard -
/\/ Les Français d'Amérique - http://www.francogene.com/genealogie-quebec/
|\ French in North America before 1721 -
http://www.francogene.com/quebec-genealogy/
/ | Maintenant sur cédérom, début à 1765
oo oo Now on CD-ROM, beginning to 1765

Dora Smith

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Dora Smith » 07 okt 2006 07:02:51

I quoted the page on the Family Origins website elsewhere on this thread
(someplace). I believe that Denis Beauregard was part of that particular
discussion.

--
Yours,
Dora Smith
Austin, TX
tiggernut24@yahoo.com
"Steve Hayes" <hayesmstw@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:athci212bd8c41rr0sdcqi1uepheisrm10@4ax.com...
On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 03:02:19 GMT, "Dora Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com
wrote:

Family Origins is the ancestor of Legacy, and its web site says Family
Origins not still available and takes you to Legacy. Legacy says they
don't include multiple spouses and children thereof in ancestral
databases.
It is possible that Family Origins once did, despite having allegedly been
designed by the same people with the same attitude problems as the people
who designed Legacy.

Not true.

Family Origins may not be available, but I don't think it had much to do
with
Legacy.


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://people.tribe.net/hayesstw
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop
uk

Steve Hayes

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Steve Hayes » 07 okt 2006 15:14:12

On Sat, 07 Oct 2006 05:51:49 GMT, "Dora Smith" <villandra@austin.rr.com>
wrote:

If you are looking for a program that is every bit as easy to use as Family
Origins, and every bit as powerful as Family Origins, and written by the
same programming team that wrote every version of Family Origins, then
RootsMagic is the program for you.

In which case, RootsMagic may be able to produce the report you want.


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://people.tribe.net/hayesstw
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

Hugh Watkins

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av Hugh Watkins » 13 okt 2006 13:05:30

in FTM select each child in turn

menu >> people >> other parents

drop down menus to link each child correctly

if achild is not in a family view

use the people menu to correct the relationsship mistake and add a child


Hugh W


Dora Smith wrote:

Verminator:

I downloaded and installed the trail version

I've got it handling hte irregular dates, and printing all the spouses, but
how do you get it to print all the children? For my mother in law's
grandfather it lists both spouses but the children of only one spouse.



--

new phone = new daily blog
http://upsrev622.blogspot.com/

family history
http://hughw36.blogspot.com

profe2

Re: need software to include to all spouses and all children

Legg inn av profe2 » 09 feb 2007 08:38:14

Esto es una prueba para este grupo en español
"Hugh Watkins" <hugh.watkins@gmail.com> escribió en el mensaje
news:4p9doaFh6higU2@individual.net...
in FTM select each child in turn

menu >> people >> other parents

drop down menus to link each child correctly

if achild is not in a family view

use the people menu to correct the relationsship mistake and add a child


Hugh W


Dora Smith wrote:

Verminator:

I downloaded and installed the trail version

I've got it handling hte irregular dates, and printing all the spouses,
but how do you get it to print all the children? For my mother in law's
grandfather it lists both spouses but the children of only one spouse.



--

new phone = new daily blog
http://upsrev622.blogspot.com/

family history
http://hughw36.blogspot.com

Svar

Gå tilbake til «alt.genealogy»